2024/25 Sean Dyche - Sacked

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John from Bootle said:
Nope. I got in to a disagreement with Lob, but that was most definitely related to Dyche. Do things go off topic at times? Of course, but I don't come here with the intention of discussing anything but Everton (well, in this particular part of the forum anyway.) I'm certainly not the first person to wander off topic because of comments made, and I certainly won't be the last. I've had one warning in all my time on this forum and that was for using a swear word, so I'm certainly not here to troll people or constantly derail threads.

I think you're missing the point mate. I didn't say you'd changed your opinion, I said you'd made contradictory statements. I don't disagree that we've improved because of Branthwaite for example, but I take exception to people having the contradictory opinion that it's not about the poorer players we have when things aren't going well, but it's definitely about our better players when things are going better.
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Your first point, when you vaulted me, had absolutely nothing to do with Branthwaite. That came later. You claimed that I said Dyche was pragmatic at one point in time and then said he wasn't pragmatic at another point. Which I did not. I said he was rubbish, and a coward of a manager. Which is a point I have been very consistent on.

You also like to present the argument that anyone who doesn't like Dyche blames everything on him and don't accept that there is weakness in the squad. You're doing that in the quoted text above. But it's complete nonsense. Almost everyone who is critical of Dyche is also critical of the ownership, the executive of the club and the playing squad. More than one thing can be wrong at an institution at the same time. The difference between you and these people is that you are seeking to absolve one element of the problem from blame. Essentially, you are doing the exact opposite thing you are accusing others of, blaming the players exclusively whilst saying that Dyche is doing the only thing that he can and is therefore both blameless and powerless for what we're observing on the pitch.
 

windymiller said:
Your first point, when you vaulted me, had absolutely nothing to do with Branthwaite. That came later. You claimed that I said Dyche was pragmatic at one point in time and then said he wasn't pragmatic at another point. Which I did not. I said he was rubbish, and a coward of a manager. Which is a point I have been very consistent on.

You also like to present the argument that anyone who doesn't like Dyche blames everything on him and don't accept that there is weakness in the squad. You're doing that in the quoted text above. But it's complete nonsense. Almost everyone who is critical of Dyche is also critical of the ownership, the executive of the club and the playing squad. More than one thing can be wrong at an institution at the same time. The difference between you and these people is that you are seeking to absolve one element of the problem from blame. Essentially, you are doing the exact opposite thing you are accusing others of, blaming the players exclusively whilst saying that Dyche is doing the only thing that he can and is therefore both blameless and powerless for what we're observing on the pitch.
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Nope,, I said that when we were conceding loads you said we couldn't call it pragmatism unless we stopped conceding so many. We stopped conceding so many and you said we can't call it pragmatism, it's just cowardice. Like I said, it comes across as contradictory. It comes across like that word is just not insulting enough for you to bear.

I used the Branthwaite example to highlight that it's not that I'm disagreeing with you per se, it's that other comments contradict that statement. I'm not seeking to absolve anybody, I just don't agree he's reached the point where he definitely deserves to be sacked. I've stated numerous times that I feel he was closer to the sack going in to the Palace game than he is now, so on current form, I think a lot of the criticism is unwarranted.

Going back to your previous post; you think I'll just keep on supporting him if we nosedive? That's well wide of the mark. I said if we lost to Brentford he'd lose my backing, then I said he had to win at least one of United/Wolves to keep my backing. Soooo, I was either bluffing and have got incredibly lucky, or, maybe, I was actually telling the truth and you're well wide of the mark, again.
 
I don’t actually see him being sacked when the new owners are confirmed but hopefully it adds some pressure when he goes through him winless runs for fun.

Tough game against Chelsea but no reason we can’t get anything from it.

City looks dreadful right now but I fully expect we will make them look like Prime City on Boxing Day.
 
John from Bootle said:
Nope,, I said that when we were conceding loads you said we couldn't call it pragmatism unless we stopped conceding so many. We stopped conceding so many and you said we can't call it pragmatism, it's just cowardice. Like I said, it comes across as contradictory. It comes across like that word is just not insulting enough for you to bear.

I used the Branthwaite example to highlight that it's not that I'm disagreeing with you per se, it's that other comments contradict that statement. I'm not seeking to absolve anybody, I just don't agree he's reached the point where he definitely deserves to be sacked. I've stated numerous times that I feel he was closer to the sack going in to the Palace game than he is now, so on current form, I think a lot of the criticism is unwarranted.

Going back to your previous post; you think I'll just keep on supporting him if we nosedive? That's well wide of the mark. I said if we lost to Brentford he'd lose my backing, then I said he had to win at least one of United/Wolves to keep my backing. Soooo, I was either bluffing and have got incredibly lucky, or, maybe, I was actually telling the truth and you're well wide of the mark, again.
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No inconsistency. I said he played negative football and that others confused that with pragmatism. For example, if he played negative football against Arsenal at the Emirates but played a more attacking style against weaker teams at home, then that could be called pragmatism. However, if you play negative, safety first, don't concede, hope to sneak a goal on a set piece football against everyone, then that's not pragmatism that's just how you want to play football. Pragmatism implies some sort of compromise or at least an adjustment to deal with a varying challenge. There's none of that. We play the same formation, largely with the same players and with the same patterns of play against everyone. Once again, in my opinion, that is not pragmatism.

We'll find out soon enough whether I'm wide of the mark as Dyche always has periods where he wins no games. He's had them every season at every club he's ever been at, usually multiple spells a season. My bet is that you'll still be in here rationalising why it's not his fault/he's actually doing a good job/the risk of replacing him exceeds the risk of keeping him when that happens.
 

Lob said:
Do you literally have to manipulate every post you do on here mate. Here is the bit you deleted from the end of that post. Clearly i was talking about if we were in the championship. Note that there is also no Lob at the end of it. You added that bit in. Pretty sure deliberately rewording and manipulating peoples posts is against the rules. One really sad dude you are.



And here is me 7 years ago voting no to Dyche. That opinion has never changed and ended up being very accurate.
dyche2017-webp.283525
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Mate just posted the link… didn’t manipulate anything. Pretty sure @GrandOldTeam can confirm that’s just how it formats.
relax… we all know Dyche is here to steady a rocky ship mate… that’s why I don’t get the hassle he is given.

Upshot is, you could see that the club was a shambles when he came in and nothings changed.
 
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