2018/19 Idrissa Gueye

[ToffeeTim]

So the solution is to make the hole even bigger with a player who is effective enough in his role that PSG want to sign him, but not good enough for us?!

You do know we won't be playing with 10 men if Gueye is sold?

Other players do exist.

 

[Parker]

So the solution is to make the hole even bigger with a player who is effective enough in his role that PSG want to sign him, but not good enough for us?!

Gana doesn't play that role though. He's a ball winner which is fine for a team like PSG where he will be used purely for that. The problem is when he goes chasing the ball and leaving gaps which is what he did on Saturday.

Don't start with this "How can he not be good enough for Everton when PSG want him?" nonsense as well when he would be expected to perform in a more limited role at PSG because he will be used for specific situations. Whereas here he just doesn't fit what Silva wants in his defensive midfielder.

As I said, I want a proper anchor man to be his replacement. A Matic, a Busquets or a prime Gareth Barry who reads the game and wins the ball back via positioning and anticipation but also able to manipulate the tempo of the game. I don't think thats too much to ask is it? For Everton it probably is though.

 

[Jt5688]

You do know we won't be playing with 10 men if Gueye is sold?

Other players do exist.

Other players exist, but none at a Everton who have shown anywhere near the level of ability to win the ball back that Gueye has. McCarthy was at his best at a similar role when he had Barry as a safety blanket, which gana hasn’t had except for about 5 months when Morgan was decent

 

[Papa Shango]

Your right 30 million isn't a lot in the current market...but 30 million for a 29 year old DM who has little to no real passing range is pretty good going IMHO. Jimmy Mac might break down, but you could say that about any player who has had injuries. We have to be realistic...the chances of us finishing seventh are slim and then there's no guarantee seventh will get us Europe anyway. Get Jimmy Mac back in the side and at least see if he can still do it at this level..if he can great we might actually get some of the 13 mil we spent on him back.

I don't think we need to worry about the money as much as we used to. Even if McCarthy was to fill in and stay healthy you still need to fill the squad position left by Gueye (who does have passing range by the way) as we would have no cover and 30M these days would just about get you that cover. I would worry that we would be selling our starting mid, replacing him with his back up and then using the money gained from our starter to pay for a back up. It is risky.

Also am I the only one concerned about the other end of the table this season? No I don't think we will get 7th (how grim is that?) but I also fear we could be easily dragged down the league table looking at our remaining home fixtures.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

So the solution is to make the hole even bigger with a player who is effective enough in his role that PSG want to sign him, but not good enough for us?!

PSG spending 30/35 mil on him is like us spending 10mil on a stop gap quick fix player fir 6 months. PSG are desperate and handicapped by FFP. If they get Gana this time next year he will be on bench.

 

[Jt5688]

Gana doesn't play that role though. He's a ball winner which is fine for a team like PSG where he will be used purely for that. The problem is when he goes chasing the ball and leaving gaps which is what he did on Saturday.

Don't start with this "How can he not be good enough for Everton when PSG want him?" nonsense as well when he would be expected to perform in a more limited role at PSG because he will be used for specific situations. Whereas here he just doesn't fit what Silva wants in his defensive midfielder.

As I said, I want a proper anchor man to be his replacement. A Matic, a Busquets or a prime Gareth Barry who reads the game and wins the ball back via positioning and anticipation but also able to manipulate the tempo of the game. I don't think thats too much to ask is it? For Everton it probably is though.

I don’t understand the logic that him having a more defined role at PSG will mean fewer gaps. If he’s straight into the first team there he would pair Veratti in midfield, with Neymar, Di Maria, Mbappe and Cavani in front of him. As soon as an opponent gets through the forward four, there will be as many gaps as there are at Everton and he’ll have just as much work to do alongside the playmaking but stroppy Veratti.

Silva does not play some inherently more complicated system than PSG, he just has worse players. We both play very attacking full backs. We both play 4-2-3-1 with an emphasis on counter attacks. Gomes is even a Veratti like deep sitting playmaker. I do not buy the idea that as PSG his role will be dramtically different. The criticism of him chasing the ball and leaving a gap will be exactly the same at PSG, especially when they have even fewer players tracking back of positioned defensively when they’re out of possession.

If you put a prime Barry back in our midfield, with Gomes alongside, you would lack both recovery pace and have two players performing a similar role. We could still easily be overrun if the opponent put three in the middle. Would you want Kante in the team? Or is he also impossible to work for us but good enough for title winning teams?

 

[Borussin]

Witsel's been absolutely superb for your boys this season, hasn't he?

Yes he has. Eclipsed Paco Alcacer as the signing of the season. He has been the biggest difference in the team this season. Monster of a player. The midfield was a problem the last couple of seasons, but not this season!

 

[Jt5688]

PSG spending 30/35 mil on him is like us spending 10mil on a stop gap quick fix player fir 6 months. PSG are desperate and handicapped by FFP. If they get Gana this time next year he will be on bench.

I agree with you re the relative spend on their part, but isn’t this slightly contradictory? If they’re hamstrung by FFP (which I agree with you about) then 30m is not nothing and makes their post Neymar and Mbappe signing position even more perilous. Furthermore given FFP calculations are done on the basis of several years, they would still have that problem in the summer given how recently they signed the two of them.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

I don’t understand the logic that him having a more defined role at PSG will mean fewer gaps. If he’s straight into the first team there he would pair Veratti in midfield, with Neymar, Di Maria, Mbappe and Cavani in front of him. As soon as an opponent gets through the forward four, there will be as many gaps as there are at Everton and he’ll have just as much work to do alongside the playmaking but stroppy Veratti.

Silva does not play some inherently more complicated system than PSG, he just has worse players. We both play very attacking full backs. We both play 4-2-3-1 with an emphasis on counter attacks. Gomes is even a Veratti like deep sitting playmaker. I do not buy the idea that as PSG his role will be dramtically different. The criticism of him chasing the ball and leaving a gap will be exactly the same at PSG, especially when they have even fewer players tracking back of positioned defensively when they’re out of possession.

If you put a prime Barry back in our midfield, with Gomes alongside, you would lack both recovery pace and have two players performing a similar role. We could still easily be overrun if the opponent put three in the middle. Would you want Kante in the team? Or is he also impossible to work for us but good enough for title winning teams?

I think silva’s preferred formation is 433, which a lot have mentioned on here
Ideally a disciplined number 6 who protects the back 4 and is technically good enough to start our attacks from deep. Which Gana is incapable of doing.

Then flanked by 2 box to box midfielders who can defend and offer something in the final third, Doucoure would be the type of player suited to that position.

Obviously time will tell, how the team moves forward, but this is reason imo selling Gana is no big deal, as the long term system doesn’t suit him.

 

[Zeke]

I don't think we need to worry about the money as much as we used to. Even if McCarthy was to fill in and stay healthy you still need to fill the squad position left by Gueye (who does have passing range by the way) as we would have no cover and 30M these days would just about get you that cover. I would worry that we would be selling our starting mid, replacing him with his back up and then using the money gained from our starter to pay for a back up. It is risky.

Also am I the only one concerned about the other end of the table this season? No I don't think we will get 7th (how grim is that?) but I also fear we could be easily dragged down the league table looking at our remaining home fixtures.

You always need to worry about money....every club worries about money, especially with the new financial fair play rules. Gana is 29, and getting no younger or better. He is what he is....a good footballer at his position, not great. His passing range is poor, when was the last time he setup a half decent chance!? He wins the ball back well and recycles it, that's pretty much it. I watched city on Sunday, Fernandinho created so many chances because he can pass a ball forward as well as be a screen to the defence...that's the type of player we should be trying to buy/develop/recruit.
30 million will buy you a lot, even in today's market.
I'm not too worried about finishing anything below 14th to be honest, were rubbish but not that rubbish!

 

[Papa Shango]

You always need to worry about money....every club worries about money, especially with the new financial fair play rules. Gana is 29, and getting no younger or better. He is what he is....a good footballer at his position, not great. His passing range is poor, when was the last time he setup a half decent chance!? He wins the ball back well and recycles it, that's pretty much it. I watched city on Sunday, Fernandinho created so many chances because he can pass a ball forward as well as be a screen to the defence...that's the type of player we should be trying to buy/develop/recruit.
30 million will buy you a lot, even in today's market.
I'm not too worried about finishing anything below 14th to be honest, were rubbish but not that rubbish!

He set up the second against Bournemouth!

We have other players to set chances up, but generally they don't so everything seems to go through Gueye who is the only one who shows for he ball.

I think the key though is how you rate the player, for me he is our most important player and its not even close hence me not wanting him sold, certainly not for 30M.

 

[EFC78]

I've repeatedly defended Gana, but that 1st goal for Southampton was pathetic from him. If he's not preventing things like that there is no point having him as that is exactly what he's in there to stop.

 

[BlueToff]

I've repeatedly defended Gana, but that 1st goal for Southampton was pathetic from him. If he's not preventing things like that there is no point having him as that is exactly what he's in there to stop.

Pathetic from them all as well, though.

If we sell him we need a replacement. Really, we should have a replacement in before he's sold.

 

[PhilRegan]

To differentiate us from the likes of Watford, Westham etc we need to start building with our best players rather than without and he is currently one of our better players. This does scream of an Arteta last minute no replacement accounts sale though if I'm being honest, completely non football related sale.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

I agree with you re the relative spend on their part, but isn’t this slightly contradictory? If they’re hamstrung by FFP (which I agree with you about) then 30m is not nothing and makes their post Neymar and Mbappe signing position even more perilous. Furthermore given FFP calculations are done on the basis of several years, they would still have that problem in the summer given how recently they signed the two of them.

They don’t seem to think FFP will be an issue come the summer, as they are being strongly linked with De jong fromnAjax for 70mil