6 + 2 Point Deductions

[mikel_88]

The forest argument has absolutely no chance to succeed. What happens if after June 30th there are suddenly no takers for your star player. The premier league was very pragmatic, probably too pragmatic in our case. No reason to think they will change their approach. Rules are rules. The question is by how much they were over on June 30th. Ultimately they have decided to adopt a dictatorial approach for reasons that at this stage are not clear to me. Protecting the top 6 doesn't look to be the case when you are going after Chelsea and City. Probably the fear of external regulation and governance...

We had to sell rich by a certain time no way will they get away with it if was after the cut off. This ffp check will be far more difficult to pass if close imo. I just dont see how forest will be clear from it

 

[Gallaeo]

If Forest win their argument that Johnson was sold later to accumulate more money, surely that then proves one of our mitigations of Richarlison/Spurs and would have to be then taken into genuine consideration for our appeal. Right?

They can’t make that argument. Monies received after financial year end are not included in the accounts

 

[Furey1878]

Would actually be a bit funny if the PL did just come out with points deductions for the other 14 like Arnie with an Uzi in each hand. Multiple teams surviving relegation with -57 points, teams qualifying for the conference league on +8 points and Liverpool and City forever on +90 points. Makes the futures depicted by films like Blade Runner or Children of men seem less bleak.

 

[IllinoisBlue]

FFP is an oxymoron when you consider the moneyed clubs continue to buy any players they want, and the less moneyed clubs are deducted points for making an effort to stay competitive.

 

[IllinoisBlue]

The June 30th deadline is a huge detriment to the less moneyed clubs who are forced to sell players at a cut price, in the middle of a transfer window, in order to balance the previous years books.

 

[ForestAreMagic]

This is a fundamental now. Having made such an (unfair) example of us, the PL 'HAVE' to continue in that vein. They've boxed themselves into a corner they can't get out of and remain credible or viable.

Agree, unfortunately for us.

Something I don’t understand: Everton and (if there’s a case) Forest get investigated quickly. If we’re guilty in 22-23 we get punished this season.

But City and Chelsea appear to be getting about 15 years’ grace from some of their alleged offences. Why are we ahead of them in the queue? It appears 1 year’s ‘cheating’ is treated more seriously than 15 years’ ‘cheating’

 

[ForestAreMagic]

The June 30th deadline is a huge detriment to the less moneyed clubs who are forced to sell players at a cut price, in the middle of a transfer window, in order to balance the previous years books.

In any normal business, a director sanctioning the sale of its biggest asset at a 30pc discount - just because year end is approaching - would be kicked out of the place.

 

[detonator7]

But City and Chelsea appear to be getting about 15 years’ grace from some of their alleged offences. Why are we ahead of them in the queue? It appears 1 year’s ‘cheating’ is treated more seriously than 15 years’ ‘cheating’

Because it's quicker and easier. Especially if the club admit guilt like we did

 

[edge]

We had to sell rich by a certain time no way will they get away with it if was after the cut off. This ffp check will be far more difficult to pass if close imo. I just dont see how forest will be clear from it

Pity they don't get away with it as surely that would make are appeal much easier?

 

[Andy Gray Diving Headers]

So, is the 14th the date that we will find out of any new charges against us? Wouldn't it be nice to have a calendar just based on fixtures instead of waiting to hear any news about being charged, how the appeal is doing, if other clubs are suing us etc etc.
No matter what the club is found guilty or not guilty of, the Board has put us fans through the wringer and treated us like...well, you know what.

 

[kenada_blue]

Agree, unfortunately for us.

Something I don’t understand: Everton and (if there’s a case) Forest get investigated quickly. If we’re guilty in 22-23 we get punished this season.

But City and Chelsea appear to be getting about 15 years’ grace from some of their alleged offences. Why are we ahead of them in the queue? It appears 1 year’s ‘cheating’ is treated more seriously than 15 years’ ‘cheating’

City are more powerful than the league and have dictated the timeline on the hearing.

Tentative date is this autumn. Ruling won't get announced until 2025. Then the Chelsea one will be looked at.

What this does is put our case in the distance that people will forget about when both these get off lightly, knowing full well the league put the caveats in the report of on a "case by case" basis.

We're 100% the guinea pig for their new system that they haven't properly set up. No one else will ever get the level of punishment we got that I can tell you.

 

[Bez2k2k]

What I don’t get is the losses figure. 105m over 3 years. Who came up with it? Does it rise every year like everything else does? It seems an awfully low figure when buying a championship player will now set you back 20/30m.

I have a feeling they will punish loads and then boost the figure, this will be done to protect certain clubs.

 

[Jacko93]

What I don’t get is the losses figure. 105m over 3 years. Who came up with it? Does it rise every year like everything else does? It seems an awfully low figure when buying a championship player will now set you back 20/30m.

I have a feeling they will punish loads and then boost the figure, this will be done to protect certain clubs.

My concern is that if Everton successfully take the ESL findings stance, that they cannot apply a punitive stance on something if a framework for the punishment had not already been set prior to charges being raised, then City and everything they have done will also fail to be punished for exactly the same reason.

If I had any confidence whatsoever that there would be a fairness in the process, I would take the 10 points in the knowledge that every single team that has done the same will get the same for each charge.

Trouble is, that simply wont happen. Both City and Chelsea will have some sort of mitigating factor applied and their punishment will be a nominal fine.

 

[twoblue]

What I don’t get is the losses figure. 105m over 3 years. Who came up with it? Does it rise every year like everything else does? It seems an awfully low figure when buying a championship player will now set you back 20/30m.

I have a feeling they will punish loads and then boost the figure, this will be done to protect certain clubs.

we should look at changing the whole transfer system. It’s hardly providing a competitive league. Are transfer fees evident in other sports like cricket?

As someone pointed out the American sports system is far from perfect but the fact that players are encouraged to go to university and are then drafted makes for far better outcomes for players that don’t make it.

Drafting from the bottom up let’s the weaker teams get first pick of the top graduates in any given year.

They can stick there lack of relegations though.

 

[Moomin]

Yeah all seems very odd doesn’t it. The villa thing kinda gets me. It’s a similar sized club, similar history, similar sized stadium etc etc but I look at their team and just think it’s all going to come crumbling down. They will not finish in the top 4, there’s too many teams below them who will come good after this much needed rest/break.

As far as I can see they have spent almost 400m in three seasons, god knows what their weekly wage bill is with players like Digne, Wakins, Tielemens etc.

But why haven’t they been punished for anything? Just strikes me as strange.

Maybe because Villa haven't broken any rules.

Just had a brief scan of there accounts, last season they posted a small profit after the sale of Grealish. Season before was a loss of 37 million. Wage bill for both seasons is about 75% turnover.

While we lost 44 million last season and the year before that was 121 million.

Wage bill for 20/21 was 95% of our turnover, for season 21/22 it was 89% of our turnover.

Our wagebill is the issue.