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ECHO Comment: "Fears of Witch-hunt Against Liverpool FC" part 3

jondel said:
Yeah Terry said tarby was very good at telling the time.
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Funnily enough, Tarby didn't tell that story last night. He preferred to tell the story about when he invited Judy Garland onto the London Palladium show, and when she turned up off her head on booze and drugs and felt like she couldn't go on stage, he cajoled her to perform with some TLC - and afterward she said to Tarby "You've got a lot of class, kid".

No one else recalled the incident, just Tarby. It was nice of Tarby to re-tell that story.
 
Alanbileysfeathercut said:
Bloody hell old chubby Tory Tarby enjoyed a dig at us blues.
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fortune.jpg

I foresee another Yewtree in his future...
 
Alanbileysfeathercut said:
Bloody hell old chubby Tory Tarby enjoyed a dig at us blues.
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Apparently he got in touch with Gerry Pacemaker"s family; supposedly not happy with them releasing news of his death on what should have been Tarbuck's celebratory night. There was an evening of programmes to be shown in honour of Tarbuck's unique wit and humour and he felt that the news took the shine off it somewhat.

He had a right pop at Gerry's widow by all accounts.
 
gwladysnight said:
All three of their forwards signed five-year deals two years ago. They are less than halfway through those deals. Since they signed those deals they have won the Champions League and the League whilst their most likely destinations Barca and Madrid have bombed.

Sadly I think Liverpool hold all the cards.

With their midfield I could see Milner wanting to finish his career at Leeds and Wijnaldum being attracted to Barca especially if Koeman survives.
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Yes thats a reasonable enough understanding. I mean I still think RM have won their domestic league, so not completely bombing but certainly under pressure. Either way though, Barcelona and Real Madrid are much much bigger clubs than Liverpool, or anyone else in this league (as evidence by how they took Ronaldo/Beckham etc) off United when United had won 10+ leagues in the preceding years. So the pull will be there.

The deals they agreed in 2018 I'd imagine were all top dollar. So the questions will be
1) Are Liverpool prepared to match/better those deals
2) If so for who? All of them or which ones?

If that can be squared then they will be doing that now and will be announced by the summer.

The reality is we asre at the tipping point re contracts, where it goes from the club feeling comfortable to the player having some control, particularly for the top players. 2 years is that tipping point. We saw that with Ross Barkley you do lose control of the situation and the power really becomes with the player (there are countless other examples, Van Persie, Hazard etc etc).

The double concern Liverpool have, is clubs like Madrid, Barca etc are now skint. They were already rolling back spending before the crisis never mind after. Madrid seem to have made Mbappe number 1 target this summer. If he costs up to 100m (given his age he will still hold some premium) are they going to be willing to go heavily for Salah as well? You wouldn't put it past them, to whisper in Salah's ear that if he just sits tight summer 2022 they will come in and take him for a low fee as a 30 year old with 12 months left. Maybe around the £50m mark. Or just tell him to hold tight and a massive bosman awaits him as a final pay day.

So while the situation looks fairly solid now, especially given the continued rumours around Salah it could look different in 6 months by the summer. As I mentioned above, we saw similar with Barkley, where he just wouldn't sign and it ended up spiralling quite quickly. It's happening to them before with Can and now seemingly Wijnaldum. My advice, following the Barkley affair for us is always the same. Leading up to that 2 year period, get them to sign an extension, or move them on. As from that point onwards, they are only losing value.
 
I see Bally was in the Tarbuck audience. Judi Dench's late husband Michael Williams and Clive Swift (Hyacinth Buckets husband) were there too both Scousers and massive Blues so hope they had a go back.
 

catcherintherye said:
Yes thats a reasonable enough understanding. I mean I still think RM have won their domestic league, so not completely bombing but certainly under pressure. Either way though, Barcelona and Real Madrid are much much bigger clubs than Liverpool, or anyone else in this league (as evidence by how they took Ronaldo/Beckham etc) off United when United had won 10+ leagues in the preceding years. So the pull will be there.

The deals they agreed in 2018 I'd imagine were all top dollar. So the questions will be
1) Are Liverpool prepared to match/better those deals
2) If so for who? All of them or which ones?

If that can be squared then they will be doing that now and will be announced by the summer.

The reality is we asre at the tipping point re contracts, where it goes from the club feeling comfortable to the player having some control, particularly for the top players. 2 years is that tipping point. We saw that with Ross Barkley you do lose control of the situation and the power really becomes with the player (there are countless other examples, Van Persie, Hazard etc etc).

The double concern Liverpool have, is clubs like Madrid, Barca etc are now skint. They were already rolling back spending before the crisis never mind after. Madrid seem to have made Mbappe number 1 target this summer. If he costs up to 100m (given his age he will still hold some premium) are they going to be willing to go heavily for Salah as well? You wouldn't put it past them, to whisper in Salah's ear that if he just sits tight summer 2022 they will come in and take him for a low fee as a 30 year old with 12 months left. Maybe around the £50m mark. Or just tell him to hold tight and a massive bosman awaits him as a final pay day.

So while the situation looks fairly solid now, especially given the continued rumours around Salah it could look different in 6 months by the summer. As I mentioned above, we saw similar with Barkley, where he just wouldn't sign and it ended up spiralling quite quickly. It's happening to them before with Can and now seemingly Wijnaldum. My advice, following the Barkley affair for us is always the same. Leading up to that 2 year period, get them to sign an extension, or move them on. As from that point onwards, they are only losing value.
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I think the selling point has already gone. For me it was the summer of 2018, Madrid or Barca would have looked at any of their front three and gone ‘just coming into their prime, not yet on mega wages, best days ahead’ and had the cash to buy them. Plus they wouldn’t have had to do a hard sell, Madrid and Barca were far more appealing at the time.

Now though these players are 28/29. Madrid and Barca just don’t buy players at this point for mega fees and for good reason because their best years are either limited or already behind them. The oldest was probably Suarez at 27 who was smack in his prime and didn’t really ever have much pace anyway. He was also miles better than any of their three now.

There’s just no way a business case stacks up for these players. A pace player, who works well in a high pressing system (which neither of them play), has too many miles in the tank already (e.g Firmino is no longer good enough for either of them) so might decline very quickly after 30, demands a huge fee in the market (which neither can afford), will have no resale value, only Salah has any commercial value, they will demand a huge wage because they’re already on that at Liverpool and none of them are better than some of the players already in place (Hazard).

Compare that with targets like Haaland , Sancho, Mbappe. All have their primes ahead of them, all would probably cost the same. The Dortmund lads might even be on lower wages. All have huge commercial value as the next stars of the game. They’ll hold any resale value for longer if they become unwanted at some point.

If you’re an exec in the boardrooms of Madrid or Barcelona it’s not even a question. A star for the now and future or for the same price a player on the decline? Top clubs don’t buy those types of players.

My view is that Salah will agitate for a move, and not get it, but will use it to get a better deal at Liverpool, which Klopp will give him to keep his team happy. Firmino knows he’s not moving upwards anywhere now so will angle for a longer deal and Mane probably will do the same. Klopp will then go off into the sunset as soon as he stops winning and leave that front three, Thiago, Henderson, Van Dijk, all on eye watering contracts and all in decline for the next manager to sort out.
 
Saint Domingo said:
I think the selling point has already gone. For me it was the summer of 2018, Madrid or Barca would have looked at any of their front three and gone ‘just coming into their prime, not yet on mega wages, best days ahead’ and had the cash to buy them. Plus they wouldn’t have had to do a hard sell, Madrid and Barca were far more appealing at the time.

Now though these players are 28/29. Madrid and Barca just don’t buy players at this point for mega fees and for good reason because their best years are either limited or already behind them. The oldest was probably Suarez at 27 who was smack in his prime and didn’t really ever have much pace anyway. He was also miles better than any of their three now.

There’s just no way a business case stacks up for these players. A pace player, who works well in a high pressing system (which neither of them play), has too many miles in the tank already (e.g Firmino is no longer good enough for either of them) so might decline very quickly after 30, demands a huge fee in the market (which neither can afford), will have no resale value, only Salah has any commercial value, they will demand a huge wage because they’re already on that at Liverpool and none of them are better than some of the players already in place (Hazard).

Compare that with targets like Haaland , Sancho, Mbappe. All have their primes ahead of them, all would probably cost the same. The Dortmund lads might even be on lower wages. All have huge commercial value as the next stars of the game. They’ll hold any resale value for longer if they become unwanted at some point.

If you’re an exec in the boardrooms of Madrid or Barcelona it’s not even a question. A star for the now and future or for the same price a player on the decline? Top clubs don’t buy those types of players.

My view is that Salah will agitate for a move, and not get it, but will use it to get a better deal at Liverpool, which Klopp will give him to keep his team happy. Firmino knows he’s not moving upwards anywhere now so will angle for a longer deal and Mane probably will do the same. Klopp will then go off into the sunset as soon as he stops winning and leave that front three, Thiago, Henderson, Van Dijk, all on eye watering contracts and all in decline for the next manager to sort out.
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Lots of sense in that mate.

For the record, come the summer they will be 29,29 & 30. We have seen fees for players of that nature have collapsed through the pandemic (see how Allan went from being quoted at 70m to going for close to 20m in a year).

They have missed the boat a bit. Ultimately they are were too inflexible in 2018 with Firmino and then Mane. They could have probably got 50-60m for Firmino and maybe 75m for Mane. Both would have shown a good profit and would have had good value out of both (approaching doubling of money). From a football standpoint it has been worth it given the trophies they've won, but they've been lumbered with 3 depreicating assets when I think they were hoping for 100m+ in sales.

I actually think Salah fancies Madrid. Of the 3 he is the one with most commercial appeal and the only who they might break the bank for. But they won't do it alongside a massive fee. It may be that he takes his big contract at Liverpool for the next 2 years, then leaves for even bigger wages and a hefty sign on fee for Madrid at the end of the contract.

The spanner in the works to all of this is Klopp. Lots of reports he's off at the end of next season from well connected journalists. A bit like Ferguson before him at United, he will likely do whats bets for the next 18 months. From a squad building standpint they should probably look to move a couple on for the fees they can get for them this summer. He may drag his heels, and leave them in the difficult scenario where they are either tied down to prohibitive long term deals, or worse they are all left with 1 year left eying up moves.
 
What
Shevin Keedy said:
Apparently he got in touch with Gerry Pacemaker"s family; supposedly not happy with them releasing news of his death on what should have been Tarbuck's celebratory night. There was an evening of programmes to be shown in honour of Tarbuck's unique wit and humour and he felt that the news took the shine off it somewhat.

He had a right pop at Gerry's widow by all accounts.
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What?! Who has said this? Disgusting if true unless I'm missing a joke here
 

Tipp blue said:
United are rubbish.. it's a disgrace the decisions they've been getting, dragged into the champions league last season via a penalty a game. The FA want nothing more than a United - Liverpool title race and they have made it totally obvious that it's being manufactured.
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For the first time tv viewing figures went down last season, personally I thought it was down to a scripted and manufactured season, when man u got all the decisions viewing figures went up again, I said before last season ended it will be a bog standard liverpool side up against a very poor man u side, Gary Neville called it the tv show , the club with most tv audience is going to be right up there.
 

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