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I found this interesting, from the NY Times

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I suspect more Republicans to come out against Bush as his presidency draws to a close. The Republicans are currently beset not just by wars between factions (business versus evangelicals versus centrist McCainiacs, which could be patched up if electoral necessity demands it), but by fundamental philosophical divisions. Liberated from the need to defend Mr Bush from his enemies, Republicans are asking difficult questions that have lain buried for years. Should they return to Reaganism or ditch it? Is there room in conservatism for worries about global warming, prison rape or water-boarding? And what role should faith play in conservative politics? If the Republicans are defeated in November, these arguments will become a cacophony.
 
How do you think things will scan out Bruce?, I honestly have little idea who stands for what now in the states, celebrity seems to count more than policies.

I can see a similar meltdown happening within the Labour party, demands to ditch conservatism for a return to more socialist principles..........................nost of this is caused by the public getting wise to war and its social cost in lives and finance.
 
One thing I do, is disregard everything that comes out of celebrities mouths as it is all bullshit. If we believe Cameron Diaz, she insinuated that if Bush was re-elected in 04 then he would legalize rape (stemming from the partial-birth abortion issue). That was my favorite insane thing said during that whole campaign. The sad thing is people will believe that [Poor language removed].

I am not a fan of the Democrats, as they are too liberal for my liking, and personally I am eager to see McCain get the Republican nod, especially after he was declared politically dead 9 months ago. I seem to agree with most of his views on the issues so it is natural I want him in.

Obama is super left-wing, and I couldn't stomach either Edwards or Hiliary (a third Hilary term....urgh! No thanks!)

Now I have said my (little) peice, I respect others opinions on the subject.
 

One thing I do, is disregard everything that comes out of celebrities mouths as it is all bullshit. If we believe Cameron Diaz, she insinuated that if Bush was re-elected in 04 then he would legalize rape (stemming from the partial-birth abortion issue). That was my favorite insane thing said during that whole campaign. The sad thing is people will believe that [Poor language removed].

I am not a fan of the Democrats, as they are too liberal for my liking, and personally I am eager to see McCain get the Republican nod, especially after he was declared politically dead 9 months ago. I seem to agree with most of his views on the issues so it is natural I want him in.

Obama is super left-wing, and I couldn't stomach either Edwards or Hiliary (a third Hilary term....urgh! No thanks!)

Now I have said my (little) peice, I respect others opinions on the subject.

Fascinating, the political divide seems to be more apparent your side of the pond than here
 
Bad news.

The minute I saw that the article was in the NY Times, I didn't bother reading it.

Why you ask?

Back in the day, the Times actually took pains to hide their liberal bent but in present time, they don't even bother. They are no longer the "paper of record" and the only people that read it are the liberal establishment.
 
thing is... we've had a Messianic nutter in charge too.... it's just that ours was more articulate.

The key point that I picked up, hidden 1/2 to 2/3rds of the way through the article, was the reliance on the vote from those ignorant of the issues. I have no problems with those who are right wing because they understand the issues and decide it's the right way to go (I disagree, but I don't have a problem), but the ill-informed, and ignorant vote (and we've got our fair share over here too) holds considerable sway over there, and the media (Fox especially) keeps them on the right track (pun intended)

[Tex and Dylan... we've had the media debate once already, wanna skip it on this thread?(y)]

It's always a concern that the man with his 'finger on the button' thinks he's on a mission from God, just goes to show, you don't need to be a bit ethnic, or wear a tea towel on your bonce to be a fundamentalist..
 
No, let's start up another media debate Blair.

The previous one just didn't last long enough for my liking... :lol:

(You need to be posting more often sir. You been busy lately?)
 

thing is... we've had a Messianic nutter in charge too.... it's just that ours was more articulate.

The key point that I picked up, hidden 1/2 to 2/3rds of the way through the article, was the reliance on the vote from those ignorant of the issues. I have no problems with those who are right wing because they understand the issues and decide it's the right way to go (I disagree, but I don't have a problem), but the ill-informed, and ignorant vote (and we've got our fair share over here too) holds considerable sway over there, and the media (Fox especially) keeps them on the right track (pun intended)

[Tex and Dylan... we've had the media debate once already, wanna skip it on this thread?(y)]

It's always a concern that the man with his 'finger on the button' thinks he's on a mission from God, just goes to show, you don't need to be a bit ethnic, or wear a tea towel on your bonce to be a fundamentalist..

Let's be very clear however about the main difference between the two.

I didn't read the article but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that the God that Bush follows and the "god" that the radical islamics follow are two totally different things.

Bush's God won't ever be telling him to "push the button" in order to eliminate those don't believe a certain religion, to wipe out infidels who won't convert, or in an effort to make the entire world a "Christian" world. Furthermore, it amazes me that people say they're just as scared of Bush because he's a Christian yet pay no attention at all to the fanatics who have openly called for the destruction of Israel and won't rest until it happens.

A very, very big difference between the two indeed so let's not confuse the two.



(Sorry, after re reading, sounded like I was having a go at you Blair. That line I bold faced is what we hear so much from the left wingers over here, the most recent being Rosie O'Donnell saying that "Radical Christianity" was just as dangerous as "Radical Islam." Sure Rosie, next time you see some "radical Christians" fly jetliners into buildings, let us know. At any rate, didn't want to come across as "shooting the messenger.")
 
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Let's be very clear however about the main difference between the two.

I didn't read the article but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know that the God that Bush follows and the "god" that the radical islamics follow are two totally different things.

Bush's God won't ever be telling him to "push the button" in order to eliminate those don't believe a certain religion, to wipe out infidels who won't convert, or in an effort to make the entire world a "Christian" world. Furthermore, it amazes me that people say they're just as scared of Bush because he's a Christian yet pay no attention at all to the fanatics who have openly called for the destruction of Israel and won't rest until it happens.

A very, very big difference between the two indeed so let's not confuse the two.



(Sorry, after re reading, sounded like I was having a go at you Blair. That line I bold faced is what we hear so much from the left wingers over here, the most recent being Rosie O'Donnell saying that "Radical Christianity" was just as dangerous as "Radical Islam." Sure Rosie, next time you see some "radical Christians" fly jetliners into buildings, let us know. At any rate, didn't want to come across as "shooting the messenger.")

hehe, you know I don't take stuff personal, with a face like this, how could I?

But sorry Tex, I gotta...

You're quite right, there is a HUGE difference... you see there is a limit to the damage that Al Quaeda and all of their fundamentalist buddies can do. 9/11 as horrific as it was will have taken years to bring to bear, for a total casualty figure of under 5000. (This is no way to diminish the tragedy of the event, we're no strangers to terrorist atrocities on this side of the pond ... ironically, many of which were part subsidised by US- based, Christian, Republican 'Charities' during the 70s and 80s.. however, the point is, that this is approaching the pinnacle of what an organisation such as Al Quaeda can achieve)

Young George however, is not encumbered by logistical or financial shortfalls, he has more resources available and at his disposal than any other man on the planet. The fact that he 'trusts his gut', or his faith, rather than the facts, is something of a concern therefore.

Even more of a concern was his reaction to the Intelligence community report on Iran. Had evidence of working towards WMDs been found, you could understand a hardening of line, however, when it was reported that Iran had made no effort whatsoever to develop a Nuclear Capability, George insisted that it proved they were a threat, because 'they might start at any time'... to be blunt, it doesn't matter what the Int was, he had already decided the way things were going to play, the facts - as inconvenient as they were, could just go hang.

Fortunately, he's not long in office, and McCain is a far better option for your side of the political spectrum, he has some understanding of the realities of war for a start, and a fundamental grip on reality too (which will make a change) ... my own view is that your country could do with at least 4 years under President Obama... you'll be surprised what a difference internationally a change can make (Hillary's already been in twice).
 
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