2019/20 Moise Kean

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I mean, if you're negative about pretty much everything about Everton you're gonna be right most of the time.

The "I was right, I told you so" mentality is so boring...

There’s negative and there’s realistic. I’ve been one of the few on here who have consistently supported Tom Davies and Calvert Lewin in the face of fierce criticism. I’m also one of the few who genuinely believes we’ll win the cup this year.

It’s hard not to say “I told you so” when you get dogs abuse for calling something from the very beginning.
 

Now this I could have agreed with. Dunc could have looked him in the eye off the pitch and said something into his ear rather than ignore him.

Irrelevant though. The conversation after the match and today will determine where the young lad goes from here. He needs to learn from this
Without wanting to sound like an amateur detective or put myself across as a body language expert, I thought Kean's reaction was pretty telling. He looked mildly surprised, but there wasn't the reaction I would expect from someone in that situation. Most players would look absolutely flabbergasted that they were being hauled off after 15 minutes, and would question either the manager or coaches after coming off. He did neither, which makes me think he wasn't overly surprised. That in turn would suggest he may have been told already that he wasn't doing what was needed.
 
It appears so.

I said from the very start there were red flags about this one and der top bloos gave me pelters for it.



I'm not sure, mate.

The fact that Juve were so willing to let him go at such a knockdown price and a top 4 club in Europe's top leagues didn't snap this kid up, a kid of such obvious potential, implies that they perhaps knew something we didn't.


People keep missing the fact that this has been discussed at length already
And he won't get a proper run unless he get's himself fit, starts putting a shift in and turning up on time. All of which he's struggled to do. Shouldn't be too hard should it?

Nobody is judging his playing ability, in fairness we can't. Something far more basic is lacking in his game and that's worrying. Why would any manager play him if he's not doing the basics?



If Juventus wanted to keep him, they would have kept him. Let's not skirt around the truth there, if Juventus really saw a future for this kid, they would have kept him - instead of playing a 33 year old, utterly past it Gonzalo Higuain.

They would have offered him the reassurances he would have had more game time there and they would have given him a contract befitting his reputation. They didn't do any of that. Therefore, when we offered them circa £30m for him, it became a very good deal for them.



Well, for consistency, I shared a similar opinion to Souness at the time. Although he didn't express it how I would have, he did suggest that something about Kean and the transfer didn't appear quite right months ago - and that's kind've how it's played out thus far. It may well turn around but Ferguson and Silva have both had issues with this kid, as have his previous managers - at what point does it become Kean's fault?



I'm not making anything up, it's plain for all to see. The only one with an agenda to push here is you.

Hang on The reputation this kid had at the time was massive if he had 4 years on his contract we would be talking a hell of a lot more in terms of today's insane prices are you forgetting we paid the same amount for Cenk Tosun.

Cenk i hadn't even heard of him until we was linked and Moise being a young kid scoring goals in a top side against good teams was always gonna come with a premium he did score those goals for Juventus he is young and he has scored goals for Italy, So for a talent scout apart from Temperament aside as its much harder to gauge until u have real long term interactions you would be salivating.

The fact his contract was up this summer was realized by every national paper here and abroad and they were all stating it was a great piece of business at the time and that Juventus had missed out on a big pay day further down the line.
£29 mil is a drop in the ocean in today's market prices i dont think Juventus got as an amazing deal as you are stating if we are talking in that moment of time of course now is a different matter all together but everyone seems to be a genius when hindsight comes around.

Overall he clearly has been mismanaged from his time here i for one idolize Dunc but yesterday was wrong and the top managers have shown how to handle these situations by an arm around someone in public to not totally decimate a young kids confidence.
And then have those harsh words in private and air your issues i cant remember the last time anything as harsh as that has happened in recent years to any pro let alone a young lad.

Clearly he had seen Kean in Training and thought he was going to offer something by putting him on the pitch so he cant have had issues with his temperament beforehand and if he did it makes the decision to put him on even more baffling or cynical if this kid has such a bad attitude like everyone seems to be making out.

Rather than total embarrassment at one of the most famous grounds televised around the world and potentially harming any Value Kean potentially had left in the long term for the club.
After all he is also an asset there is more to the game now days as shown by the real top man managers im not sure this hardball approach has a place anymore because the current crop of talent coming through all seem to want to be coddled not scolded i think Dunc needs to adapt rather than the latter.

In my honest opinion of course who doesn't love the hard ass Everton first approach but is it viable in today's climate where everything is about money and media attention especially when the same club is telling someones mother we will look after your son here then doing that on such a big stage.

I genuinely hope that Dunc was just wrapped up in the game so much that it was handled poorly.
 
Moise has two choices now.
Option 1: sulk, throw a strip and demand a move, most likely to a lesser team than us and try and rebuild his reputation.
Option 2: let this incident light a fire up his arse, put the hard graft in, force his way into the side, score goals and make himself unstoppable...
time will tell which option he chooses
 

People keep missing the fact that this has been discussed at length already


Hang on The reputation this kid had at the time was massive if he had 4 years on his contract we would be talking a hell of a lot more in terms of today's insane prices are you forgetting we paid the same amount for Cenk Tosun.

Cenk i hadn't even heard of him until we was linked and Moise being a young kid scoring goals in a top side against good teams was always gonna come with a premium he did score those goals for Juventus he is young and he has scored goals for Italy, So for a talent scout apart from Temperament aside as its much harder to gauge until u have real long term interactions you would be salivating.

The fact his contract was up this summer was realized by every national paper here and abroad and they were all stating it was a great piece of business at the time and that Juventus had missed out on a big pay day further down the line.
£29 mil is a drop in the ocean in today's market prices i dont think Juventus got as an amazing deal as you are stating if we are talking in that moment of time of course now is a different matter all together but everyone seems to be a genius when hindsight comes around.

Overall he clearly has been mismanaged from his time here i for one idolize Dunc but yesterday was wrong and the top managers have shown how to handle these situations by an arm around someone in public to not totally decimate a young kids confidence.
And then have those harsh words in private and air your issues i cant remember the last time anything as harsh as that has happened in recent years to any pro let alone a young lad.

Clearly he had seen Kean in Training and thought he was going to offer something by putting him on the pitch so he cant have had issues with his temperament beforehand and if he did it makes the decision to put him on even more baffling or cynical if this kid has such a bad attitude like everyone seems to be making out.

Rather than total embarrassment at one of the most famous grounds televised around the world and potentially harming any Value Kean potentially had left in the long term for the club.
After all he is also an asset there is more to the game now days as shown by the real top man managers im not sure this hardball approach has a place anymore because the current crop of talent coming through all seem to want to be coddled not scolded i think Dunc needs to adapt rather than the latter.

In my honest opinion of course who doesn't love the hard ass Everton first approach but is it viable in today's climate where everything is about money and media attention especially when the same club is telling someones mother we will look after your son here then doing that on such a big stage.

I genuinely hope that Dunc was just wrapped up in the game so much that it was handled poorly.
Kean has lots of talent but certainly there seems to be a question mark over some aspects of his game or his character or we simply would not have been able to sign him.

Pretending the issues are not there won't help him as a player. I hope the shock he got yesterday is a wake up call.

If anybody seriously believes that Ancelotti will treat him in a different manner and suddenly get a totally reformed player they are in dreamland. All of the great players had great character and work ethic. Ancelotti will demand the same from Kean.

My hope is that Kean realises exactly the cross roads he is at in his career.
 
There’s negative and there’s realistic. I’ve been one of the few on here who have consistently supported Tom Davies and Calvert Lewin in the face of fierce criticism. I’m also one of the few who genuinely believes we’ll win the cup this year.

It’s hard not to say “I told you so” when you get dogs abuse for calling something from the very beginning.

Well done for backing DCL all the way mate

I'd hate to see what him losing your support would look like.

He’s had several seasons now, Marcus. This isn’t based off a few games. It’s a lack of improvement over a long period of time. Patience has been granted. Patience that he wouldn’t get at the truly top clubs, where the bar is set higher.

Fans are quite rightly asking us to raise the bar higher than DCL. Stop giving him the 9 shirt. Stop giving him starts. Raise the bar and he either steps up with it or he doesn’t.

It’s frustrating. He hasn’t shown anywhere near enough to warrant the game time that he’s had. Wouldn’t make the bench at any other team with top 6 aspirations, let alone teams actually in the top six.

If we stuck him on the transfer list tomorrow, I’m not sure many PL teams would show interest, even at a modest fee like £10m. Sheffield United at a push?

That's not an excuse. And if it is, it really shouldn't be.

We need to demand better quality than DCL, Tosun and Niasse.

To what extent might you apportion some of that blame for that on DCL?

Surely you have to be in a position to receive the ball in order to receive a pass?

With all due respect to Dom, he has all the guile and movement of a loggerhead turtle with lead boots on.

DCL isn’t Tammy Abraham. Stick DCL in that Villa side last season and he wouldn’t have been half as prolific, and they wouldn’t be in the Premier League now

Abraham is far more clinical. I don’t think he’s a top striker or ready to play for England yet but he’s a far better finisher than DCL will ever be. Needs fewer chances to score and, even at Villa last year, his movement has been much improved.

DCL is a grafter and I like him but as a striker, his level will always be a bottom half Premier League club. He’s another Connor Wickham (another youngster touted for great things).
Out of interest, which PL teams would ‘snap him up’?

Brighton and Sheffield United at an absolute push and I’m not convinced he’d start for them two.
 
74011
 


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