New Everton Stadium Discussion

[Tom Hughes]

Sorry if this is a stupid question but here goes. Is there anything from stopping us from taking out the concrete steps at some point in the future and putting new concrete in with bigger treads? Not an ideal way of fixing things, to be sure, but is it doable?

No, it's not a stupid question at all.
It depends on the type of construction. Some can be quite readily reprofiled. With new treads and risers bolted to the steel structural framework. However they might then need to be aligned with existing vomitories etc or in our case be constrained by a fixed super riser that separates the safe-standing and seated areas meaning you may lose a row or rows. If it's a reinforced concrete frame it can be far more difficult to change without starting again.

Generally the prudent/cheapest option would be to use deeper treads from the start.

 

[Toffeelover]

Just out of interest.

 

[WA Toffee]

You're missing the point.

Some people think we're going to hit 60,000 with safe standing, so that will put us on a par with the other big clubs.. But if we get more with safe standing then so can other clubs, IE Tottenham. It's like we're always playing catch up.

Instead we should have made it the baseline. It's not likely to change now but that's always been my feelings the capacity is too low. Too limited. Too cautious. Not ambitious enough. Or rather, the ambitions are not at that level of the so called big clubs.

You're first paragraph is correct. Your second one is just willy waving.
Which would you prefer - Spurs with the biggest club stadium on London, or Chelsea with only the 4th biggest stadium in London, but half a dozen premier leagues and 2 European cups?

 

[WA Toffee]

From my point of view, having a bigger stadium does give us scope for growth interms of attendance and financially, personally I think we`d fill 60k. If ours is 52k with Utd 75k, Spurs 62k, Arsenal 60k, West Ham 60k, City 55k, The RS 53k with some of them set to expand we are at a loss in matchday revenue with the London clubs also charging more for tickets

With the safe standing any increase at BMD will also affect those other clubs, its relative so we still have a massive gap between us and those listed.

I get that people are happy with 52 or 62 standing but I think we should be maximising every opportunity to close that gap and increase income which will increase what we can pay through FFP...

Does that make sense?

It does make sense, but I think the club would have done a lot of research into what is the optimum capacity for us, rather than just plucking a figure out the air. I can't see them willing to spend half a billion pounds on a stadium, only to reduce the capacity because it might shave a couple of million off the cost.

I also think we could attract more than 52000, but I am just completely guessing. And I would also rather see 52000 at full capacity than 62000 with 5000 empty seats

 

[The binman chronicles]

It does make sense, but I think the club would have done a lot of research into what is the optimum capacity for us, rather than just plucking a figure out the air. I can't see them willing to spend half a billion pounds on a stadium, only to reduce the capacity because it might shave a couple of million off the cost.

I also think we could attract more than 52000, but I am just completely guessing. And I would also rather see 52000 at full capacity than 62000 with 5000 empty seats

The point is the club are operating below the standards of our motto, for most of our history we had a bigger ground because we were the bigger club, soon as you start to accept your place 'oooh we are not going to fill as many seats as x, y and z' then we've already lost.

I've always said if we can only afford a 52k stadium at BM then fair enough, if we are doing it because we only think we'll get 50k attendances then that is wrong because Evertonians follow the team like hardly any other given what we have done for the last 26 years. Throw in a bit of success and it would sell out week after week, an empty few thousand during a mid week game in winter shouldn't be the barometer. If we let Wolves, West Ham etc. have bigger attendances than us then we are fighting an uphill battle if we get to a point where we no longer have a sugar daddy to try and make up the difference.

 

[Bluestar]

I

The point is the club are operating below the standards of our motto, for most of our history we had a bigger ground because we were the bigger club, soon as you start to accept your place 'oooh we are not going to fill as many seats as x, y and z' then we've already lost.

I've always said if we can only afford a 52k stadium at BM then fair enough, if we are doing it because we only think we'll get 50k attendances then that is wrong because Evertonians follow the team like hardly any other given what we have done for the last 26 years. Throw in a bit of success and it would sell out week after week, an empty few thousand during a mid week game in winter shouldn't be the barometer. If we let Wolves, West Ham etc. have bigger attendances than us then we are fighting an uphill battle if we get to a point where we no longer have a sugar daddy to try and make up the difference

A stadium too big would be a disaster. Far better to be regularly filling the stadium than having empty seats.

To be honest, I don’t think we could go much above 52k based on my own experience. There isn’t much of a next generation of fan base. My son is in a Liverpool school and there are only three blues in his class. They have all evaporated.

 

[BNJ1878]

I

A stadium too big would be a disaster. Far better to be regularly filling the stadium than having empty seats.

To be honest, I don’t think we could go much above 52k based on my own experience. There isn’t much of a next generation of fan base. My son is in a Liverpool school and there are only three blues in his class. They have all evaporated.

That's the result of 25+ years of decline under the leadership of the greatest living Evertonian.

 

[Jacko93]

I fully understand this, but having the capability does not mean we will be able to use it until legislation is changed.
I do not believe the authorities will ever permit greater than1:1 in this country and even if they do it will only be after a considerable time is allowed for 1:1 to prove its safety.

There is nothing in the draft legislation from the SGSA that says a ratio greater than 1:1 can't be used, it just needs to satisfy certain design considerations. Which we will.

https://sgsa.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/SG01-Safe-Standing-in-Seated-Areas.pdf

 

[Tipp blue]

From my point of view, having a bigger stadium does give us scope for growth interms of attendance and financially, personally I think we`d fill 60k. If ours is 52k with Utd 75k, Spurs 62k, Arsenal 60k, West Ham 60k, City 55k, The RS 53k with some of them set to expand we are at a loss in matchday revenue with the London clubs also charging more for tickets

With the safe standing any increase at BMD will also affect those other clubs, its relative so we still have a massive gap between us and those listed.

I get that people are happy with 52 or 62 standing but I think we should be maximising every opportunity to close that gap and increase income which will increase what we can pay through FFP...

Does that make sense?

As was pointed early on in the process, once you get to 50 odd thousand the extra seats don't make much sense financially, they are the most expensive to install and then become cheapest to sell as they are miles from the pitch. Clubs don't rely on match day income these days adding an extra 10K seats isn't going to push us over the top in terms of FFP becoming a non issue, the only thing that will do that is constant CL qualification the money that comes with that and the increased sponsorship that inevitably follows.

 

[PhilM]

That's the result of 25+ years of decline under the leadership of the greatest living Evertonian.

Aye, young Evertonians are the product of their parents and/or wider family as it's not like we're winning young fans over with our footballing success.

On the other hand, and rather sadly, that shower across the park will be continuing to keep their numbers or actually swelling as fans move over to them.

Many of us older fans have witnesses success, as did our parents and their parents; there are young blues today with parents who've never seen us lift a trophy.

As a result, I do personally think that 52k is probably a fair figure when you consider it objectively although while admitting that it does somewhat go against NSNO.

 

[muckers]

You're missing the point.

Some people think we're going to hit 60,000 with safe standing, so that will put us on a par with the other big clubs.. But if we get more with safe standing then so can other clubs, IE Tottenham. It's like we're always playing catch up.

Instead we should have made it the baseline. It's not likely to change now but that's always been my feelings the capacity is too low. Too limited. Too cautious. Not ambitious enough. Or rather, the ambitions are not at that level of the so called big clubs.

Tottenham would not be able to increase capacity through safe standing.

Their concourses etc are designed to hold what their current capacity is at a maximum.

If Safe standing legislation was changed to allow more that one person per seats, we would be the biggest beneficiaries.

 

[Bluestar]

That's the result of 25+ years of decline under the leadership of the greatest living Evertonian.

It is.

We have under performed at every key moment in the last twenty five years and have eroded our club. We have slipped out of the elite.

The stadium is now so important to our future. At some point our performances must change or we will simply fade into obscurity.

 

[degsy]

I

A stadium too big would be a disaster. Far better to be regularly filling the stadium than having empty seats.

To be honest, I don’t think we could go much above 52k based on my own experience. There isn’t much of a next generation of fan base. My son is in a Liverpool school and there are only three blues in his class. They have all evaporated.

52,000 will do...like we have a choice...If we go full on commercial, surge pricing like Uber might come in

 

[Dr Baxter]

I

A stadium too big would be a disaster. Far better to be regularly filling the stadium than having empty seats.

To be honest, I don’t think we could go much above 52k based on my own experience. There isn’t much of a next generation of fan base. My son is in a Liverpool school and there are only three blues in his class. They have all evaporated.

That's as maybe, but the 3 Evertonians are probably much more likely to go the match than those who support the Dark Side. Most young LFC supporters could find Anfield on a map. I've been hearing the "we won't have any young support soon" argument since I started going in the mid 70's. I got to the ground early for the Derby and was amazed at the large groups of young Evertonians going the match together in groups. On a more general note BMD will boost our younger support as it will be easier to get tickets. A mate of mine's lad switched allegiances when he saw the light, for a while load of reasons. It's nowhere near as bad as painted in that regard

 

[Dr Baxter]

Tottenham would not be able to increase capacity through safe standing.

Their concourses etc are designed to hold what their current capacity is at a maximum.

If Safe standing legislation was changed to allow more that one person per seats, we would be the biggest beneficiaries.

Indeed. I understand both sides of the argument. The current legislation is called current for a reason. Who knows what the legislation might be in 5/10 years time. Anybody over 45 can remember the pubs closing in the afternoon. Things change.