New Everton Stadium Discussion

[Jacko93]

Indeed. I understand both sides of the argument. The current legislation is called current for a reason. Who knows what the legislation might be in 5/10 years time. Anybody over 45 can remember the pubs closing in the afternoon. Things change.

Concourse capacity regulations won't change, and if they do it will only be a tightening of those regulations.

 

[Davideeyore]

It does make sense, but I think the club would have done a lot of research into what is the optimum capacity for us, rather than just plucking a figure out the air. I can't see them willing to spend half a billion pounds on a stadium, only to reduce the capacity because it might shave a couple of million off the cost.

I also think we could attract more than 52000, but I am just completely guessing. And I would also rather see 52000 at full capacity than 62000 with 5000 empty seats

You'd think so. But I disagree. Of course you can't just build massive caverns I think there's something called a "sweet spot". I think that's 60 plus. I don't tend have much faith in such research from outside organisations on what our optimal capacity should be.

Well, call it what you want, Meis called it size envy. There's a group of stadiums now hitting that sweet spot.
I've no doubt we can fill it. In fact I wanted 65,000 so that we could we're a big club. Just like the way Tottenham have with their stadium.

It doesn't guarantee success as you point about Chelsea. No one thinks that.

5 or 10 thousand empty seats is ugly. You see it in the lower leagues.
I think sections can be hidden away. If needed.

 

[ForeverEverton]

There is nothing in the draft legislation from the SGSA that says a ratio greater than 1:1 can't be used, it just needs to satisfy certain design considerations. Which we will.

https://sgsa.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/SG01-Safe-Standing-in-Seated-Areas.pdf

I think the point people are making is if we got to 62k with safe standing the other clubs will get the same % uplift which still leaves us miles behind in terms of matchday revenue, as we still are at the moment, unless we are set for the highest ticket prices in the north...

 

[Moderatelywarmwater]

When is the construction of the stadium due to begin? Do we have a date/time for this?

And how long are these ground works due to last? They look not far of completion

 

[AsiaAsia82]

I think the point is also how little match day revenue is compared to tv money. Empty seats filled occasionally end up being expensive, better to have a packed house to help with success on the pitch

 

[RobSpurs]

Tottenham would not be able to increase capacity through safe standing.

Their concourses etc are designed to hold what their current capacity is at a maximum.

Don't think this is true. I think there is some headroom built in for capacity increases if - in future - safe standing is allowed at greater than 1:1 ratio. I'm not sure how big an increase we'd get, but I believe the stadium is "futureproofed" in that sense.

Of course, it'd also rely on the council allowing us a greater capacity which is far from certain.

 

[toffee66]

For those of us old enough to remember us winning stuff and being one of the biggest clubs in the country it is tough to admit to ourselves that those days are done.

The football money age naturally favours the London clubs as London is one of the great global cities. Chelsea have benefitted from the BEST location and will likely always have a choice of billionaire owners. City won the owner jackpot and will be big for as long as they remain invested. United and Liverpool have enough historic European success to sustain them, but even they have had difficult times and may well have more in the future. Even Arsenal & Spurs are scrambling to stay relevant despite London weighting and a substantial wealthy % in their fanbase.

The likes of us and Villa are not competing at that level any more despite our histories and may never do so again, at least not consistently. It is depressing but the chosen capacity probably accurately reflects our reality. Neither of my kids have more than a vague theoretical interest in us. We have alienated much of the next generation of our potential support. We might come to think BMD is too big...

 

[John from Bootle]

I think the point people are making is if we got to 62k with safe standing the other clubs will get the same % uplift which still leaves us miles behind in terms of matchday revenue, as we still are at the moment, unless we are set for the highest ticket prices in the north...

Hasn't Jacko already addressed this? Other clubs won't necessarily be able to increase the capacity of their stands because the concourses might not be suitable for more people.

In fact he's intimated there's a whole host of clubs who would not be able to increase capacity of stands

It's not a problem that will affect Everton in the new stadium though. It would seem we have 'future proofed' in that regard.

 

[Bluestar]

That's as maybe, but the 3 Evertonians are probably much more likely to go the match than those who support the Dark Side. Most young LFC supporters could find Anfield on a map. I've been hearing the "we won't have any young support soon" argument since I started going in the mid 70's. I got to the ground early for the Derby and was amazed at the large groups of young Evertonians going the match together in groups. On a more general note BMD will boost our younger support as it will be easier to get tickets. A mate of mine's lad switched allegiances when he saw the light, for a while load of reasons. It's nowhere near as bad as painted in that regard

I’m just giving my example and whilst you may think the young blues are more likely to go, disagree. My son isn’t interested in the heartache so I never take him.

I just don’t think we would fill anything much more than. 52k.

 

[Bluestar]

For those of us old enough to remember us winning stuff and being one of the biggest clubs in the country it is tough to admit to ourselves that those days are done.

The football money age naturally favours the London clubs as London is one of the great global cities. Chelsea have benefitted from the BEST location and will likely always have a choice of billionaire owners. City won the owner jackpot and will be big for as long as they remain invested. United and Liverpool have enough historic European success to sustain them, but even they have had difficult times and may well have more in the future. Even Arsenal & Spurs are scrambling to stay relevant despite London weighting and a substantial wealthy % in their fanbase.

The likes of us and Villa are not competing at that level any more despite our histories and may never do so again, at least not consistently. It is depressing but the chosen capacity probably accurately reflects our reality. Neither of my kids have more than a vague theoretical interest in us. We have alienated much of the next generation of our potential support. We might come to think BMD is too big...

That is my feeling and experience. The kids just aren’t interested. PS5 is far more fun.

 

[Dddddd]

For those of us old enough to remember us winning stuff and being one of the biggest clubs in the country it is tough to admit to ourselves that those days are done.

The football money age naturally favours the London clubs as London is one of the great global cities. Chelsea have benefitted from the BEST location and will likely always have a choice of billionaire owners. City won the owner jackpot and will be big for as long as they remain invested. United and Liverpool have enough historic European success to sustain them, but even they have had difficult times and may well have more in the future. Even Arsenal & Spurs are scrambling to stay relevant despite London weighting and a substantial wealthy % in their fanbase.

The likes of us and Villa are not competing at that level any more despite our histories and may never do so again, at least not consistently. It is depressing but the chosen capacity probably accurately reflects our reality. Neither of my kids have more than a vague theoretical interest in us. We have alienated much of the next generation of our potential support. We might come to think BMD is too big...

I know quite a lot of lads now who’s kids don’t support Everton and they say they can’t force them into a life of misery.

I even know someone who’s kid supported Liverpool on the sly.

We’re losing a generation of fans - the only way to entice them is to actually get them to the games and that means affordability, available seats and free tickets for schools.

 

[Dddddd]

That is my feeling and experience. The kids just aren’t interested. PS5 is far more fun.

They got to go into school and hear about Salah, Ronaldo, De Bruyne and have got to fire back with Demari Gray (no offence Demari)

 

[Bluestar]

They got to go into school and hear about Salah, Ronaldo, De Bruyne and have got to fire back with Demari Gray (no offence Demari)

I think there are more Man U fans in his class than blues.

 

[Eggs]

I know quite a lot of lads now who’s kids don’t support Everton and they say they can’t force them into a life of misery.

I even know someone who’s kid supported Liverpool on the sly.

We’re losing a generation of fans - the only way to entice them is to actually get them to the games and that means affordability, available seats and free tickets for schools.

….winning games and being successful is the main way. You see fans in their 40s now from around the country who were raised in the mid-80s.

 

[MickA]

You'd think so. But I disagree. Of course you can't just build massive caverns I think there's something called a "sweet spot". I think that's 60 plus. I don't tend have much faith in such research from outside organisations on what our optimal capacity should be.

Well, call it what you want, Meis called it size envy. There's a group of stadiums now hitting that sweet spot.
I've no doubt we can fill it. In fact I wanted 65,000 so that we could we're a big club. Just like the way Tottenham have with their stadium.

It doesn't guarantee success as you point about Chelsea. No one thinks that.

5 or 10 thousand empty seats is ugly. You see it in the lower leagues.
I think sections can be hidden away. If needed.

Sunderland are a great case study in this regard. Decent resurgance then they expanded the stadium again.

Even in the PL for their last few years they were giving thousands of tickets away per match. You could pick and choose any game to go to and that meant the sales model collapsed. I'm no marketing expert but I'd imagine the 'sweet spot' means having a healthy demand for tickets that the Club price for every game.