2024/25 Sean Dyche - Sacked

[Clarky cat]

That’s not relevant because Luton were sat on about 25 points.

Are Forest still in a relegation fight because they were the last two seasons and haven’t hit 40 points yet?

I think you need to fact check this mate, there is no way Real Luton could have been challenging for the title and already in the champions league places with that points tally

 

[MACCA75]

That is still better than relegation fodder. Those players are better than most relegated teams players. Not world beaters, but decent, though Doucoure shouldn't be starting now either imo

We don't have a squad to compete for Europe but we definitely aren't a relegation squad, and though it helps to look at the minutiae of the squad, player by player, the fact remains football is a team sport and the glue is the manager and his tactics. Harrison and Calvert Lewin are perfect examples of Dyche not playing to their strengths. McNeil in the middle is probably his best position but he isn't a world beater there, for sure. Look at the other squads around us. Another manager could get more from this squad that he is and he more or less admits it at this stage with his 'like this when I got here' somebody else's fault attitude.

Right now his football and attitude is a terrible way to finish out at Goodison. We need an injection of positivity, and overlapping fullbacks!

Which one of Doucoure, McNeil or Harrison are better than players in relegation teams? Because all 3 have been relegated.
See also Pickford, Tarkowski, Gana and Keane. This is a poor squad of players.

And I accept the manager is awful too.

 

[GrandOldTeam]

No one really knows but usually in these things occams razor is the most likely cause.

Branthwaite played the majority of last season ahead of Keane (who was the least utilised defender in the entire squad) and was straight back in once fit this season only to break down with injury again. Dyche is also on record calling Branthwaite and Tarkowski partnership outstanding multiple times.

Now although no one knows for sure, if I had to guess the reason he’s not playing right now it would be because perhaps he’s not at the fitness level he was, or the staff want to give him longer to recover from this injury given his latest relapse. Or perhaps because of his injury his form in training hasn’t been as good as it was last season. We don’t know, and I know people will say why is he on the bench if he’s not fit but an 80% fit Branthwaite is still a more useful option than some kid from the academy. It doesn’t mean you start him though if it’s not needed. Obviously if Branthwaite keeps getting overlooked then there may be another reason but at this point we just simply don’t know.

We also don’t know though that he’s being kept out because Dyche loves ‘keano’. If he is that is a huge mistake but quite frankly we don’t know so I’m not sure why people are shrieking about it every other post. It’s just taking the worst case possible outcome and presenting it as definitive proof, there’s not evidence to back it up.

It's weird.

Shared this on here late August;

... since then, he come in - then promptly injured.

Apparently he's fit now, but there was a lot of them claims over the summer too.

 

[Raino85]

Seeing mixed reports on when the takeover will be complete, ranging from mid November to late December. Would be nice to know.

A 6 week window is pretty accurate for a takeover

 

[blulouie]

Let's say Dyche leaves tomorrow.

And say... Potter comes in.

Nothing changes besides that.

Can't agree with this part.

Btw I'm not advocating getting Potter , but things would change.

For a start I believe there would definitely be a "new manager bounce"
Then we should have a manager focused on winning games & not conceding possession & initiative before a ball is even kicked.
This team looks beat with the hoofball tactics this manager plies his trade in.
They look to me like some have downed tools and had enough of these archaic tactics.

So for me things would definitely change , the option is don't change and more of the same.

 

[twoblue]

How do you know that is what his remit is, there’s nobody at the top to give him his remit so I’m not sure how you can make that assumption.

Last year was dour football but he had us minus deductions in a very comfortable position so wouldn’t it stand to reason that this year you would expect progress.

He hasn’t progressed the style of play, results are similar than last year and the mood about the place continues to be dreadful.

His style of play concedes the ball, home or away we do not want to control the ball or press. He would rather stay in shape, defend and hope to score. I know staying in the premier league is important but I pay my money to go and enjoy watching Everton play football and it is so depressing watching us getting passed off the park by Fulham! We are all entitled to our opinions on the manager but it seems the majority of the fan base has had enough of his dour style of play.

It’s not even like his style is serving up wins, we can barely keep a clean sheet and we don’t score. I keep reading people say there’s some dreadful teams in the league who are worse than us, what a sad indictment of where we are that our survival has and continues to be hinged on there being 3 worse teams, it’s been to long we have had anything to be proud of.

TBF he hasn’t being given any funds to suggest the remit isn’t survival.
Moshiri isn’t present as you point out, but he knows the value of this club is determined on us being a premier league side.
Therefore if the owner investing in the squad, I can deduce staying up and reducing spending is his remit.

 

[Saint Domingo]

It's weird.

Shared this on here late August;

View attachment 280507

... since then, he come in - then promptly injured.

Apparently he's fit now, but there was a lot of them claims over the summer too.

If he’d come back in and relapsed badly we’d be looking at a season defining moment, and not in a good sense. In terms of the entire club it would be pretty ruinous if we have any plans to sell him this summer (no one is paying 70 mill for a CB with recurrent unspecified injuries). If that had happened I’m sure a lot of people would be on here calling Dyche an idiotic dinosaur for risking him. He goes the other way and he’s getting pelters for that too.

Ultimately we just don’t know as we don’t have as detailed information on fitness etc. as the club staff will have.

 

[Raino85]

Which one of Doucoure, McNeil or Harrison are better than players in relegation teams? Because all 3 have been relegated.
See also Pickford, Tarkowski, Gana and Keane. This is a poor squad of players.

And I accept the manager is awful too.

Gueye & Pickford got relegated 8 years ago mate, thats not really very relevant.

Klopp got relegated with Mainz

 

[Saint Domingo]

TBF he hasn’t being given any funds to suggest the remit isn’t survival.
Moshiri isn’t present as you point out, but he knows the value of this club is determined on us being a premier league side.
Therefore if the owner investing in the squad, I can deduce staying up and reducing spending is his remit.

We’re operating a sell to buy/loan policy from a starting position of 19th in the league. We’re the only club doing that over the last few seasons. This seems to have been completely forgotten in some of these discussions.

‘We’re an attractive proposition’ - until that changes, we’re not, and that’s nothing to do with Sean Dyche. Why would any decent manager stake their reputation on operating under those constraints when they could go to another PL team, or team in Europe, and be given much more resources and not have to sell their best players. They won’t. So until Friedkin changes that equation, nothing much will change long term. Player quality is the number one determinate of league position.

 

[Simon Buttle]

Can't agree with this part.

Btw I'm not advocating getting Potter , but things would change.

For a start I believe there would definitely be a "new manager bounce"
Then we should have a manager focused on winning games & not conceding possession & initiative before a ball is even kicked.
This team looks beat with the hoofball tactics this manager plies his trade in.
They look to me like some have downed tools and had enough of these archaic tactics.

So for me things would definitely change , the option is don't change and more of the same.

Exactly, go back a week and you had three separate players arguing with the manager during the game about gameplay instructions. Something simply MUST change and fast as the players look fed up and a large portion of the fanbase are certainly fed up. I'm sick of hearing the nonsense "oh there is nobody to sack him" utter rubbish, we have a DoF who is in charge of the clubs footballing operations, that's part of his job. I do also get the money side of it and its a big factor for us at the moment but as I said something must change asap or this could become very painful and very toxic if it drags out over the rest of the season.

 

[MikeH72]

Gueye & Pickford got relegated 8 years ago mate, thats not really very relevant.

Klopp got relegated with Mainz

What’s worse than having a squad full of relegated players?

Adding in a twice relegated manager into the mix, of course.

 

[Simon Buttle]

We’re operating a sell to buy/loan policy from a starting position of 19th in the league. We’re the only club doing that over the last few seasons. This seems to have been completely forgotten in some of these discussions.

‘We’re an attractive proposition’ - until that changes, we’re not, and that’s nothing to do with Sean Dyche. Why would any decent manager stake their reputation on operating under those constraints when they could go to another PL team, or team in Europe, and be given much more resources and not have to sell their best players. They won’t. So until Friedkin changes that equation, nothing much will change long term. Player quality is the number one determinate of league position.

The rules in this country dictate that clubs need to sell players as much as they buy them so as to be able to balance the books for PSR purposes, even the big clubs have to sell players. Look at Newcastle with their money, they went on a spending spree but didn't really have the wiggle room nor did they sell any existing players which had a knock on and left them short last summer. Also Managers/coaches can't just spend their way out of trouble/situations every season, there comes a point where if they want the big salaries then they need to just get stuck in and show what they are made of.

 

[Paul Rideout]

Which one of Doucoure, McNeil or Harrison are better than players in relegation teams? Because all 3 have been relegated.
See also Pickford, Tarkowski, Gana and Keane. This is a poor squad of players.

And I accept the manager is awful too.

Using that logic Richarlison is crap because he got relegated with Watford.

Roy Keane - horrific player (relegated with Forrest)

Juninho - dross (relegated with Boro)

I don’t think being relegated necessarily means you’re a bad player, though it also doesn’t mean you’re a good player either tbh lol… there is a correlation but I don’t think it applies to the better players in the team. Of which McNeil, Pickford, tarkowski & doucoure were in their teams

The manager and the recruitment team need firing from a cannon though, because they’re the easiest to fire and replace over an entire team.

 

[MikeH72]

Using that logic Richarlison is crap because he got relegated with Watford.

Roy Keane - horrific player (relegated with Forrest)

Juninho - dross (relegated with Boro)

I don’t think being relegated necessarily means you’re a bad player, though it also doesn’t mean you’re not a bad player either tbh lol.

The manager and the recruitment team need firing from a cannon though, because they’re the easiest to fire and replace than an entire team.

Big Red won the Champions League with about 4 relegated players in the team.

 

[pfim]

Using that logic Richarlison is crap because he got relegated with Watford.

Roy Keane - horrific player (relegated with Forrest)

Juninho - dross (relegated with Boro)

I don’t think being relegated necessarily means you’re a bad player, though it also doesn’t mean you’re a good player either tbh lol… there is a correlation but I don’t think it applies to the better players in the team. Of which McNeil & doucoure were in their teams

The manager and the recruitment team need firing from a cannon though, because they’re the easiest to fire and replace than an entire team.

Certainly. But when you collect 5, 6, 7 of those types of players, you're not exactly attracting top talent.