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The Moment You Knew He Had Failed...

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Daveysgingerlovechild said:
Has Lampard failed?

What are his aims and objectives this season?
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I think his total remit is to stay in the premier league .
On Tuesday it proved that the club is not interested in competing in cups and has no ambition other than starting the first season at BMD in the top division
Will Frank be sacked in the meantime probably not, will Frank be in charge when we start the season at BMD I doubt it.
 
I’m bored of the manager merry go round me. We get rid of managers, then everything changes. The coaching staff, the training, the system, bores me as every new manager starts well enough then slowly but surly it begins to fail. I want another Moyes, someone who stays here beyond a few years and actually builds something.
 
For me you could see the signs he wasn`t up to the job last season.....

Good 3-0 win v Leeds followed up by a 2-0 defeat at Southampton.

Narrow 1-0 defeat to Man City then the next game we go high press and lose 5-0 to Spurs, that was followed up by an impotent loss at home to Wolves chaning from a back to a back 5.

Good win v Newcastle at home playing 4-3-3 followed by a tonking at Palace in the League Cup Quarter Final playing a high press back 5.

Beat Chelsea then beat Leicester and follow that up with an embarassing 0-0 v Watford, I think we were the only team not to score against them at Vicarage Road and they had about 11 players injured or missing. I remember how poor Watford were and this was the game we could have made it safe and Frank didn`t go for it....

We seem to try and get on a run then he will inexplicably change the formation or tactical approach....

We played with a back 5 for the 1st 4 games of this season, 2 defeats to Chelsea and Villa (That appears a bad result now) and draws against Forest and Brentford then he changed it to a back 4, with that back 4 we went on a run drawing with Leeds Liverpool and beating West Ham and Southampton but then we lost to Utd, then the next game he rocks out the 5 at the back and we got beat by Spurs and then reverting back to 4-3-3 v Newcastle which was horrendous.

We played a 4-2-3-1 (Which I believe to be our best formation, one Arsenal also use intensively) v Palace which we won and against Fulham which got us 4 points and we haven`t seen that formation since with defeats to Leicester and Bournemouth twice, the 1st Bournemouth game we played 5 at the back.

So the signs were there with his lack of tactical consistency, no wonder the players have no idea what they should be doing, I think it is unfair to blame the players when you have a manager that flip flops with many formations and systems.

I think the Bournemouth double is the point of no return though.........

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GrandOldSte117 said:
Don't worry, he has set them super low to 'not get relegated' so that we can all say STICK WITH THIS MAN
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paultheblue said:
I think his total remit is to stay in the premier league .
On Tuesday it proved that the club is not interested in competing in cups and has no ambition other than starting the first season at BMD in the top division
Will Frank be sacked in the meantime probably not, will Frank be in charge when we start the season at BMD I doubt it.
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Ste, see Paul's response. I don't know who you mean by 'him'. If by Lampard I suspect he wouldn't have set his own objective(s).

It's a serious question though. How can you say someone has failed without a concrete understanding of their remit?

If it is keep us in the Premier league he has not failed. You could argue he's struggling or even failing. But not yet failed.
 
Daveysgingerlovechild said:
Ste, see Paul's response. I don't know who you mean by 'him'. If by Lampard I suspect he wouldn't have set his own objective(s).

It's a serious question though. How can you say someone has failed without a concrete understanding of their remit?

If it is keep us in the Premier league he has not failed. You could argue he's struggling or even failing. But not yet failed.
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so you think they bought 8 players for him this transfer window to say 'stay in the league please'.

I assume they wanted to comfortably stay in the league.
 

Daveysgingerlovechild said:
Ste, see Paul's response. I don't know who you mean by 'him'. If by Lampard I suspect he wouldn't have set his own objective(s).

It's a serious question though. How can you say someone has failed without a concrete understanding of their remit?

If it is keep us in the Premier league he has not failed. You could argue he's struggling or even failing. But not yet failed.
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Maybe not but that really should not be the remit for any PL club we should be aiming for at least a bit more than that. If we are simply just treading water until BMD is built then I'm sorry but that just isn't good enough and it really is time that once and for all something is done about the owner and board at the top of this club. Everything seems to be hanging on the new stadium which after 3 years still hasn't actually got any funding for it!
 
chrismpw said:
Interested if you reaced this point with Howard Kendall before that Oxford game.
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chrismpw said:
Never claimed he was - but he's clearly intelligent and intelligent people learn to do better.

Alec Ferguson was another manager fans wanted out before he came good ... granted these were back in the days before fans had about 1 month of patience before their social media echo chambers whip them into a hysteria.
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But for all the sense it'll never get through to the 'I want it now' brigade. Building stuff is just for buildings.
 
Simon Buttle said:
Maybe not but that really should not be the remit for any PL club we should be aiming for at least a bit more than that. If we are simply just treading water until BMD is built then I'm sorry but that just isn't good enough and it really is time that once and for all something is done about the owner and board at the top of this club. Everything seems to be hanging on the new stadium which after 3 years still hasn't actually got any funding for it!
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To be honest mate, for this discussion I'm less interested in the 'shoulds', but what actual parameters Lampard has been set.

Lots of shrieking and wailing about failure, but what measures? And who has set them?

If you're saying the fans set expectations, well, that's something different isn't it? They're not clear, consistent and vary week to week.

So what has he been set by the club?
 

knowing your history said:
Think game for Silva was being 2-1 up at Brighton with about 10 minutes left, imploding and losing 3-2 in the end. Disaster of November period followed especially at home (can remember the whole ground singing "sacked in the morning" when 2-0 down at home to Norwich) and he was gone after the latest Anfield capitulation.

Ancelotti one was harder due to being locked out of the ground so can't recall matches as readily. Losing to likes of Newcastle and Fulham 2-0 early in 2022 wasn't great and gave the feeling season would just peter out which it did. Still didn't get close to any sackable game though and just circumstances which has caused carnage of last 18 months.
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To be fair they didn't really implode in that Brighton game, they got properly shafted by an outrageous penalty decision that ended up getting (for the first time ever if i remember rightly) an apology from the pgmo for getting it wrong. That was potentially a real sliding doors moment too, Silva had that big monkey on his back about never coming from behind to win and having a poor away record. Winning that game could have changed the whole narrative.
 
chrismpw said:
Never claimed he was - but he's clearly intelligent and intelligent people learn to do better.

Alec Ferguson was another manager fans wanted out before he came good ... granted these were back in the days before fans had about 1 month of patience before their social media echo chambers whip them into a hysteria.
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I think the level of patience was the same, social media just makes a bigger noise than people grumbling in the pub.
 

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