PL2 or Central League

[ClausThomsen]

I don't think a Central League return or any major change to the structures of Reserve or U23 football makes much of a difference.

It all comes down to money. Even the poorest PL club is incredibly wealthy compared to the majority of their foreign counterparts. Even in the dominant European leagues there are only a handful of clubs who are capable of spending at the levels of a bottom end PL club.

A lack of finance means it's a necessity that a club has to look at all it's resources to put together a squad. That necessity means that patience is required with young player and trust has to be put in them while they develop as first team footballers.

In England it's easier and quicker to drop a few million and look to resolve the situation immediately than chance a young player on a regular basis. The competitive open age football that they need is often found through loan spells.

 

[degsy]

Imagine the fume if a player coming back from injury, aggravated the injury in a reserves game.

Like players on the comeback trail Never! pull up in a first team game.

Kick the physio up the bum and dock hjs wages, for putting him out too early.

 

[degsy]

Posters of an older vintage will remember pre-Academy days of Everton A & B teams playing in the Lancashire Leagues and the Reserves in the old Central League. None of this football was age restricted & increasingly I’ve been debating to myself whether PL2 is actually fit for purpose, or whether a return to Central League format might be a better development route for our youngsters.

In recent times I noticed how our U23 team struggled playing against foreign youngsters who compete weekly in open-age football. The old Central League was where your fringe 1st teamers and those coming back from injury played games with a real competitive edge. They were joined by promising youngsters playing alongside and against seasoned professionals. A great learning ground.

Critics suggested the older pro’s were blocking the path for youngsters coming through & PL2 was born, but now there are voices suggesting this format is uncompetitive with youngsters playing in a comfort zone & not being stretched.

With no age restricted fixtures to complete at U23, a re-structuring would maybe allow clubs to better manage the number of young professionals they keep. The most promising rewarded with contracts, allowing them to be tested in a competitive open-age league.

My suggestion is maintaining the Academy system but re-introducing an open-age element to replace existing PL2 format.

Totally agree.

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

Like players on the comeback trail Never! pull up in a first team game.

Kick the physio up the bum and dock hjs wages, for putting him out too early.

That's kind of the point, though, isn't it? Players are risked by being thrown back into the first team, because financially so much more is at stake these days based on league position, etc. The days of teams exhibiting the patience to ease players back in through reserve games are well gone. If they're fit enough to play, they play the big games, otherwise sit out completely.

Not saying I agree with the approach, necessarily, but I firmly think that's the way it is.

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

Ultimately I think @Eggs intention with this thread is noble, but a few have hit the nail on the head when they mention cash/business:

- Clubs want all players (assets) contributing financially - Either indirectly via success on the pitch, or via loan fees and wages off the books

- The pittance generated by these extra games wouldn't make a dent in the above point

- Players, unless they are playing for one of the REALLY big boys in Europe, want themselves in the shop window pretty much at all times. They're never going to risk injury playing reserves football, and missing out on their next big move

The question remains, then, how do we encourage homegrown youth development? The only idea that springs to my mind is enforcing some kind of ban on loaning U23 players within 12/24 months of purchase, so you can't stockpile like Chelsea, for example. If you buy U23s you HAVE to have them playing in the first XI or U23s, alternatively you fill the gaps with more academy players who you CAN then loan if your cup runneth over, meaning that more English players are getting a run out in the lower leagues.

 

[barneygumble]

I'd argue that whilst the U23's was a great idea, it's just meant that clubs have abused their power really, and took a lot of the fight out of some of the players.

Look at some of the lads who we've had recently in the U23's, Harry Charlsey, left us aged 23, having made one appearance in the first squad, in a dead rubber in Europe. It's evident he won't make it at Everton, so why keep him? Let other lads prove their worth. Same with Broadhead, and sadly what seems like Bowler too (we paid nearly £4.5m for him too, didn't we?).

My point is, that if they get to 21 and aren't near the first team, it's such a pointless exercise for me.

 

[Joey66]

I'm not sure modern footballers would take to playing reserves matches

Tough Luck ......

 

[Martin Alvito]

No mate they are employees, they are under contract. They do as asked. This pampering and allowing them to dictate what they will and won't do is half the problem these days. The club pays the wage they doa s they're told.

The problem is that if you treat your players like that, word gets around and you start having trouble attracting new ones.

Even back when you could get away with such things, that was a problem. It was why Knight didn't win the NCAA title every year at Indiana, because Lord knows he was a better X's and O's coach than anyone else. The best talent quit coming there.

 

[NathDogg]

I think @Eggs shout is exactly what is needed, for the younger players coming through and for the more experienced pros coming back from injury or out of favour.

I never played at too high a level in my younger days, mostly Saturday and Sunday league, but I know I learned so much more about the game when I played against any team containing some experienced older players, who had been around the block and seen it all. Some had played to league level back in the day, and it showed.

I may have had the edge on fitness on some of them, but I never had the football smarts to compete, and was schooled many times, and learned loads about positional play/tactics/snidey stuff - it's that which I think a proper reserve league would teach the academy kids.

It would have to help the experienced players as well - a decent reserve league would allow managers to actually see what these guys were doing against better opponents, instead of bossing kids around in the U23s.

 

[Raino85]

Posters of an older vintage will remember pre-Academy days of Everton A & B teams playing in the Lancashire Leagues and the Reserves in the old Central League. None of this football was age restricted & increasingly I’ve been debating to myself whether PL2 is actually fit for purpose, or whether a return to Central League format might be a better development route for our youngsters.

In recent times I noticed how our U23 team struggled playing against foreign youngsters who compete weekly in open-age football. The old Central League was where your fringe 1st teamers and those coming back from injury played games with a real competitive edge. They were joined by promising youngsters playing alongside and against seasoned professionals. A great learning ground.

Critics suggested the older pro’s were blocking the path for youngsters coming through & PL2 was born, but now there are voices suggesting this format is uncompetitive with youngsters playing in a comfort zone & not being stretched.

With no age restricted fixtures to complete at U23, a re-structuring would maybe allow clubs to better manage the number of young professionals they keep. The most promising rewarded with contracts, allowing them to be tested in a competitive open-age league.

My suggestion is maintaining the Academy system but re-introducing an open-age element to replace existing PL2 format.

You now have larger squads and more substitutes availible which then gives access for more 'seasoned profesionals' to get minutes instead of playing in a reserve game.
Also temas with super quality squads like Chelsea & Man City will see a training game with an elite squad as more benificial than a reserve fixture against also rans

 

[Lanolin]

I'd argue that whilst the U23's was a great idea, it's just meant that clubs have abused their power really, and took a lot of the fight out of some of the players.

Look at some of the lads who we've had recently in the U23's, Harry Charlsey, left us aged 23, having made one appearance in the first squad, in a dead rubber in Europe. It's evident he won't make it at Everton, so why keep him? Let other lads prove their worth. Same with Broadhead, and sadly what seems like Bowler too (we paid nearly £4.5m for him too, didn't we?).

My point is, that if they get to 21 and aren't near the first team, it's such a pointless exercise for me.

I understand what you mean, but I think that's just a symptom of the issue rather than the cause. The real issue is that when you have an entire squad of players in every year group, you're bound to have 99% who are not viable first team possibilities. Charsley as an example basically stopped Joe Anderson from playing a handful of games for the under 23s. Anderson was never really someone who was going to end up challenging Digne, so it really made no difference, other than allowing the people who take an interest in the youth teams to get excited about someone new for all of 2 games before they write them off.

 

[Groucho]

Posters of an older vintage will remember pre-Academy days of Everton A & B teams playing in the Lancashire Leagues and the Reserves in the old Central League. None of this football was age restricted & increasingly I’ve been debating to myself whether PL2 is actually fit for purpose, or whether a return to Central League format might be a better development route for our youngsters.

In recent times I noticed how our U23 team struggled playing against foreign youngsters who compete weekly in open-age football. The old Central League was where your fringe 1st teamers and those coming back from injury played games with a real competitive edge. They were joined by promising youngsters playing alongside and against seasoned professionals. A great learning ground.

Critics suggested the older pro’s were blocking the path for youngsters coming through & PL2 was born, but now there are voices suggesting this format is uncompetitive with youngsters playing in a comfort zone & not being stretched.

With no age restricted fixtures to complete at U23, a re-structuring would maybe allow clubs to better manage the number of young professionals they keep. The most promising rewarded with contracts, allowing them to be tested in a competitive open-age league.

My suggestion is maintaining the Academy system but re-introducing an open-age element to replace existing PL2 format.

I miss going to the odd reserve game at Goodison.

 

[davids]

Totally agree . '' The old Central League was where your fringe 1st teamers and those coming back from injury played '' Exactly what is needed ,been saying it for years. Moyes said it too..
Also ,these games should be played at Goodison to give the young ones some experience. We have enough local support to pull in a few thousand fans .

The old 60s season ticket used to have free entry to all the Central League games. A and Bs played at Bellfield midweek. Those were the days.

 

[Street end man]

The old 60s season ticket used to have free entry to all the Central League games. A and Bs played at Bellfield midweek. Those were the days.

My first season ticket as a kid was in the 70's and reserve games were still included then. Most of the reserves had played for the 1st team so the quality was high.

 

[davids]

My first season ticket as a kid was in the 70's and reserve games were still included then. Most of the reserves had played for the 1st team so the quality was high.

Always a decent turnout when a couple of the first team had a game back after injury.