Andy Van der Meyde??

[monty]

Well I would give VDM a go myself, he cant be much worse than some of our midfield performances of late. Everyone is so pissed off with him for not playing but your also all saying he should never play for us again.

He doesnt fit in with Moyes ethic of work your ass off and fair enough he wont get picked because of that, but to slate him so much just cos he cant make the team is unfair. He isnt the player he used to be, but then he doesnt play football much anymore so he cant be.

I'm as gutted with VDM not working out as all of you, but some of your comments about him go way too far. He's lost his ability, it happens, its not as if he's put the Everton shirt on a pole and burnt it.

I respect you for sticking up for him mate but can you think of a bigger waste of our resources than he has been. On top of that he has the temerity to blame everyone apart from himself, and that is where his trouble lies. I honestly despise the sod nearly as much as rs players as even that lot has shown more regard to David Moyes and our fans than he has. The only reason he hasn't played football, and he hasn't had a football induced injury, is himself. He has had more chances than a one handed shop lifter, he should be ashamed to pick up his wages mate, but he isn't

 

[TX Bill]

I'm sure that I'm in the minority on this but...


...I'd like to see VDM on the pitch at least one more time, if, for no other reason, than just to know that we/he gave it one more try.

If he gets 30-45 minutes of a match and it just doesn't look like he's got it anymore, then at least I'll know it just wasn't meant to work for him here. He can move on at the end of his contract and that'll be that.


BUT


If he gets 30-45 minutes of a match and somehow lights it up and shows that he still has what it takes to play at the highest level, shows some of the class that he's shown in the past, and most importantly, contributes to the Everton cause, then what's the problem?

I would think that those of you in the majority who are slating him due to the size of the wages he's picking up every week would WANT him out on the pitch asap so that we can get SOME kind of return on the initial investment.

As it stands, you're happy to slate him for his wages but don't want him anywhere near the first team.

Bad news, can't have your cake and eat it too. You either slate him for his wages and want some return for Everton's investment or you don't want him near the first team at all. That's fine and logical but the, "Yeah, we're paying him 30k a week AND I don't want him near the first team" just doesn't wash and is frankly getting old.

Wanna have go at a player just to have a go at 'em? I can think of a bunch of clowns across the park that would fit that bill.

Sure, as mentioned before. If he's a disruptive influence within the squad and causes problems, well then yes, you don't let him play over players who are not causing problems in training, in the dressing room, etc. However we're all speculating on VDM's demeanor and attitude in training as well as his work rate as none of us are there day in and day out to actually assess this. Every bit of speculation about VDM in the dressing room and in training on this forum has been just that, SPECULATION.

For me, I've always wanted to see him out on the pitch. I'd say that 50% of the issue he's caused himself and 50% of the issue is all the other crap out of his control (child's health, injuries, home burgled, etc...) Whether you agree with that or not is entirely up to you.

But when push comes to shove, if our squad numbers are thin and players that would normally play are injured, I'd like to see him on the pitch just one more time to see if he can do it.

 

[neonleon]

no-one is having a go for the sake of it. And I don't think there is anything wrong with slating him for his impact on the team so far,or lack thereof.

Moyes is the one who is assessing him. Wanting to see him in the first team and out on the pitch to get a feel if he has anything more to give is just a fans perspective - you want to give him one more chance to see if he can cut it (if you saw him slicing balls and falling on his arse in training every day you'd maybe feel different). It is obvious that Moyes see's his performances every day (or when he turns up for training) and judges him on those - and obviously feels his standard isn't up to the first team; as well as his work rate, dedication and fitness levels.

Considering that we pay 30k odd a week to this player, and we are in the middle of a squad crisis, whereby we need every body we can get, it's hardly churlish for fans (who page his wages via tickets etc.) to be critical of his dedication to the cause and to lament the reality behind the promise of the original signing.

 

[neonleon]

besides you don't want a return of an investment in a player, by playing him, if that is going to be counterproductive to the team as a whole - i.e that makes the team weaker not stronger and we consequently lose games.

we are stuck with this guy - that is the annoying thing. That it is within his grasp to recapture the form and promise he once showed is possible. Sounds like he has too many psychological/lifestyle problems to ever be that player again. But then the stories may be fabricated. The only reality we have is that Moyes considers him as a last resort and has been critical of his application and performances thus far. And we could have done a lot better with the money

 

[TX Bill]

Where my problem lies is with those having a go without wanting to see the initial issues with VDM, however improbable they may be, possibly rectified and seeing him becoming a contributing member of the squad, thereby EARNING his wages.

That just doesn't make a whole lot of sense now does it?

We agree that Moyes would have had him out on the pitch long ago if he warranted a place on merit and obvious that he hasn't.

But I'll refer back to my comment regarding speculation. You stated that, "he feels his standard isn't up to the first team; as well as his work rate, dedication, and fitness levels."

That's pure speculation on the work rate and dedication. No one really knows what his work rate and dedication has been like in training. I'd speculate that he hasn't been picked due to fitness and injuries recently but then I don't really know either.

Look, I'm not VDM's biggest fan by any means (although it may appear that way to many) but I'm one of those that would like to see him earn his wages and the only way he can really do that is on the pitch. If we're past that point, then we're past that point but I'll go back to the point of my original post which was that I'd just like to see him play one more time to see what he could do for us.

 

[TX Bill]

I agree that Moyes certainly wouldn't put him out there if he would be a factor in us losing games and certainly that where we are in the table leaves us little room for error.

Perhaps we'd have a better chance of seeing him play if we were mid table and didn't have the fear of relegation. Then Moyes could "take the risk" of putting VDM out there for a half here and a half there.

But I wouldn't argue that this is not a time for Moyes to "experiement" if you will as every point is valuable in our chase for that fourth spot in the table.

 

[Welton Toffee]

As Pete Doherty once sang (ironically probably whilst on drugs)... "what a waster, what a f***ing waster"

 

[thebluesheep]

Van Der Meyde

Did anyone see the shot he had at half time on wednesday??

he smashed the bar from the left wing about 35 yards out

obviously you cant see much at half time but what we did see looked promising.

i say give him 20 minutes when were up 2-0 at blackburn.

 

[neonleon]

But I'll refer back to my comment regarding speculation. You stated that, "he feels his standard isn't up to the first team; as well as his work rate, dedication, and fitness levels."

That's pure speculation on the work rate and dedication. No one really knows what his work rate and dedication has been like in training. I'd speculate that he hasn't been picked due to fitness and injuries recently but then I don't really know either.
.

well for someone who has been fined for persistently missing training, was barred from the training ground for 2 weeks and fined 50k for not turning up, Has had an incident of spiking (which sounds dubious). Has been widely reported by fans to be drinking the night away at various gaffs in the pool - most notably the albert dock. Someone whose fitness levels were there for all to witness the last time he played for us - sweating his arse off after five minutes like a sunday pub team player the day after a saturday night bender.

i think we can extrapolate from that data, some of it first hand, that his dedication, work rate and fitness levels aren't the same as arteta or AJ, or vaughan or osman or any of them.

http://www.evertonfc.com/news/archive/fresh-start.html

one of about four "fresh starts" (if you don't believe me do a search for him on the OS) VDM has had. Interestingly he blames himself. Why would he do that, if he had shown 100% commitment and dedication? It would just be a case of misfortune then. He knows and Moyes knows he's [Poor language removed] about.

David Moyes at the time he fined him (not his first fine, he got one for being out the night he was spiked as well):

"Andy has had numerous warnings about this type of thing - we won't tolerate it any more."

Obviously not an isolated incident which again, however apocryphally proves his dedication and work rate has been substandard. Injuries continue to plague him, which is obviously why he's not got a game recently.

yes, I still want him to make it. And given our injuries, its now or never. Its not like he'll get within a million miles of the team when everyone is fit.

 

[TX Bill]

Part of my frustration lies with Moyes.

I mean if it's really as bad as you said (and yes, some of that can be verified by VDM's own words) the it begs the question as to why they haven't jettisoned him yet.

They're gonna have to pay him anyway. Let him go either:

A) Outright and pay him or...
B) Have some sort of buyout of his contract at a pro-rated amount and try to save a few dollars.

Either way, VDM gets a "fresh start" unless he himself believes his career to be over.

I mean Moyes can't possibly be keeping him around only to use his situation as a lesson to others could he?

Does Moyes really think there's still a chance for him?

I mean that's what's so baffling about the entire situation for me. If everything that he's purportedly done is true, teams have let players go for a fewer indiscretions. And Moyes doesn't strike me as a manager who wouldn't let him go.

So what is it that's keeping Moyes from offloading him?

It's what keeps me up at night... (just kidding)

 

[SuitsBlue]

It appears he has been a beligerent [Poor language removed].

I wonder how the initial meeting went before he actually signed

moyes - ''i like hard workers, that play for the entire team, there are no [Poor language removed] cats at this club, if you can promise me your full commitment and full effort then i'll be happy for you to come and be part of my everton side''

When all is said and done, hes let moyes down, he let the club down, hes let the fans down, hes let football down, he let his family down, and he has let himself down.

There is no more abused talent than one that is wasted.

Im glad the club has learned about the golden handshake culture that saw slaven bilic swan off with over a mill to sign for zagreb the day after. Im all for moyes punishing lay-about-[Poor language removed] by excluding and making an example of them, why pay him off, keep him here on the money he will get one way or the other and further compound his so called misery.

(ps, i got the vbookie on him scoring before christmas, part of my frustration with him is that i want him to actually care. he doesnt, and thats not on!)

 

[TX Bill]

It appears he has been a beligerent [Poor language removed].

I wonder how the initial meeting went before he actually signed

moyes - ''i like hard workers, that play for the entire team, there are no [Poor language removed] cats at this club, if you can promise me your full commitment and full effort then i'll be happy for you to come and be part of my everton side''

When all is said and done, hes let moyes down, he let the club down, hes let the fans down, hes let football down, he let his family down, and he has let himself down.

There is no more abused talent than one that is wasted.

Im glad the club has learned about the golden handshake culture that saw slaven bilic swan off with over a mill to sign for zagreb the day after. Im all for moyes punishing lay-about-[Poor language removed] by excluding and making an example of them, why pay him off, keep him here on the money he will get one way or the other and further compound his so called misery.

(ps, i got the vbookie on him scoring before christmas, part of my frustration with him is that i want him to actually care. he doesnt, and thats not on!)

At the risk of upsetting club chemistry and being a trouble maker in general?

I don't see it being that way. There's got to be another reason Moyes is keeping him with the club.

 

[monty]

I'm sure that I'm in the minority on this but...


...I'd like to see VDM on the pitch at least one more time, if, for no other reason, than just to know that we/he gave it one more try.

If he gets 30-45 minutes of a match and it just doesn't look like he's got it anymore, then at least I'll know it just wasn't meant to work for him here. He can move on at the end of his contract and that'll be that.


BUT


If he gets 30-45 minutes of a match and somehow lights it up and shows that he still has what it takes to play at the highest level, shows some of the class that he's shown in the past, and most importantly, contributes to the Everton cause, then what's the problem?

I would think that those of you in the majority who are slating him due to the size of the wages he's picking up every week would WANT him out on the pitch asap so that we can get SOME kind of return on the initial investment.

As it stands, you're happy to slate him for his wages but don't want him anywhere near the first team.

Bad news, can't have your cake and eat it too. You either slate him for his wages and want some return for Everton's investment or you don't want him near the first team at all. That's fine and logical but the, "Yeah, we're paying him 30k a week AND I don't want him near the first team" just doesn't wash and is frankly getting old.

Wanna have go at a player just to have a go at 'em? I can think of a bunch of clowns across the park that would fit that bill.

Sure, as mentioned before. If he's a disruptive influence within the squad and causes problems, well then yes, you don't let him play over players who are not causing problems in training, in the dressing room, etc. However we're all speculating on VDM's demeanor and attitude in training as well as his work rate as none of us are there day in and day out to actually assess this. Every bit of speculation about VDM in the dressing room and in training on this forum has been just that, SPECULATION.

For me, I've always wanted to see him out on the pitch. I'd say that 50% of the issue he's caused himself and 50% of the issue is all the other crap out of his control (child's health, injuries, home burgled, etc...) Whether you agree with that or not is entirely up to you.

But when push comes to shove, if our squad numbers are thin and players that would normally play are injured, I'd like to see him on the pitch just one more time to see if he can do it.

Love you Tx but I can't abide him mate

 

[TX Bill]

I know man, I know.

Sometimes I wonder what's wrong with me.

 

[neonleon]

good job your not his bird.

he'd keep cheating on you and staying out all night, you'd cry yourself to sleep, but still keep giving him "one more chance."