The problem is with this statement is that these are his favourites.
Doucoure and McNeil being the biggest failures for both technical ability and a complete lack threat.
One of them was awarded in £65k pay rise as well
2023/24 Sean Dyche
- Thread starter Brett Angell Delight
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Doucoure and McNeil being the biggest failures for both technical ability and a complete lack threat.
One of them was awarded in £65k pay rise as well
Some of his best mates and favourites on the pitch are the worst culprits. “Tarky” is an embarrassment of a captain. The club captain Coleman also likes to give it massive about how much he loves the club yet loves it so much that won’t retire from international duty so he can play in friendlies and qualifying dead rubbers, rather than save his already ruined legs to help us survive relegation. Michael Keane has seen off about 6 managers since he’s been here. If he’s referring to the likes of these lads when he talks about players throwing managers under the bus then fair enough, but I’ve got a feeling he isn’t.
Interesting thing about the cycle of poor mentality through a series of managers.
There must be a core group here for several years in that case. They would be:
Pickford
Coleman
Keane
Andre Gomes
Calvert-Lewin
Gueye, possibly, he's been and gone, but is mates with Coleman for example.
That's the thread. The ones here since Koeman and Silva. All part of the circle around the plug hole.
So if Jesus Dyche is right, these lot need purging.
There must be a core group here for several years in that case. They would be:
Pickford
Coleman
Keane
Andre Gomes
Calvert-Lewin
Gueye, possibly, he's been and gone, but is mates with Coleman for example.
That's the thread. The ones here since Koeman and Silva. All part of the circle around the plug hole.
So if Jesus Dyche is right, these lot need purging.
Eggsyblueskin
Player Valuation: £40m
The same complaint is levelled at the players as each manager fails, despite the turnover of players , which suggests to me it is the recurring problem of poor managerial appointments rather than some inherent ‘culture ‘ peculiar to Everton , which is able to remain active despite changing squads.
It must be a ghostly disembodied presence lurking in the corners of the dressing room awaiting its moment to pounce and sow discord.
I’m afraid the true answer is that a manager loses the trust of the players if his tactics and instructions are failing to produce results.
If there is anything peculiar to Everton it may be that the expectations of the crowd are higher than most , and their patience increasingly shorter.
It must make it a miserable experience for the players having to fail in front of such a demanding set of supporters , and at some point they lose belief in the managers ability steer them to success.
Successive managers have lost the dressing room here because they were poor appointments to begin with and ill suited to the the demands of the supporters.
Ferguson1878
Player Valuation: £25m
I used to blame the likes of schniderlin Delph etc but their not even there anymore
ForeverEverton
Player Valuation: £40m
What is this core of players we are blaming?
Can only be the likes of Pickford, DCL, Keane, Gomes, Coleman, Patterson, Godfrey, Onana, Gueye, Garner. Some of these players have only had Dyche & Lampard as manager so can`t blame them.
Beto, Chermiti, Danjuma, Young, Harrison all arrived this year and I`d imagine players like Mykolenko, Doucoure, McNeil and Tarkowski are firmly in the Dyche camp.
Let`s call them out, can`t blame them as a collective when half haven`t even spanned the last 3 managers. Only players left since Ancelotti days are Pickford, Virginia, Keane, Godfrey, Coleman, Doucoure, Gomes & DCL... So which of these is the bad apple and trouble maker?
Sorry mate I can’t countenance any defence that’s part of the problem and the easy ride, isn’t a culture amongst the players, or certainly a cohort.
Say Dyche has lost the dressing room, as Frank did, as That Yoke did, as Carlos disintgratrated in the last 10 games under a generational manager, as capitulated vs Mordor under Silva.
The evidence is there. I’ve been saying for what seems an enternity here, I made a thread called Everton cowards here about 4 years ago. There is a bad culture at the club.
Do I want a manager that see it and names or do I want one that colludes with it as we progress toward oblivion.
It could be Dave from Knowsley in the pub, saying what Dyche said and I’d still agree, he said exactly what I’ve been thinking from the first half vs Burnley.
In a way Dyche is irrelvent to this whether he stays or goes - the problem remains in my opinion. We stay on the hamster wheel. Im sick of it and the stupidity of it.
These players don’t deserve your loyalty in what they’ve given you in the two last performances, I’m defo not accepting it.
Simon Buttle
Player Valuation: £50m
Doucoure is another one, gave up under Lampard (remember him refusing to warm up and sitting on the ball) now gone weird since signing a new contract, I just know he is a wrong un, I'm sure of it.
ForeverEverton
Player Valuation: £40m
You nailed it right there, played really well till the point we triggered the extension in his contract... in hind sight that was a big big mistake and he has fooled all of us.
You can disagree with a manager, hate a manager, want to leave the club
But this shows a complete lack of professionalism and says more about a persons character than anything else
And after doing that, and less than 12 months later you get awarded with a new contract, taking your wage from £70k to £125k a week says everything you need to know about culture. Being poor is rewarded.
Ah yes, another one of Dyche’s favourites. Hopefully he follows up his strong words with actual actions, and drops a few of the wasters.
I personally don't subscribe to it being one thing.
I'll be players (quality and mentality)
Management (the coach/manager PLUS the wider structure)
Executive/strategy
An unholy mix.
But yeah, there's a core there that only know mediocrity as a pinnacle and the bottom of the table as the norm.
Big Sams Undies
Player Valuation: £15m
The culture of failure comes from the top of the organisation and it’s been chronic for 30 years.
It’s not just the on-pitch side of things, take a look at the disgraceful financial situation we’re in. Again, we could go back years for examples… Remember the Vibrac loans that our beloved late Chairman used to take out yearly? Or the money he borrowed from his mates on the quiet?
With such pathetic creatures running the show, what chance have we got on the pitch really?
efcste97
Player Valuation: £10m
It's all well and good turning it on the players, to some degree they fully deserve it, the issue I've got is it's got to the point were he's sending them out to fail due to his dull, bland ineffective way of trying to 'win' football matches
The players are aware as much as we are that it's not working and that we've been found out, the whole persisting with the same style of play, formation and personnel has probably meant they've lost a bit of faith in him, things need to change fast. This bizarre strategy of calling the players out stinks of getting the excuses in early, their should be no public statement essentially admitting you're not liked in the dressing room, especially not at such a important time in the season, I get he's looking for a reaction but it could backfire big time.
It doesn’t have to be specific players, sometimes the most talented plAyers can be the problem. Players come players go. But it’s an endemic culture. Someone can be a good player somewhere else, come into a bad culture and just disintegrate, a crap player can leave here and improve elsewhere - hello Maupay. It’s that integration that dictatex a prevailing mentality and as football is a team game it becomes systemic. The existential and structural piece doesn’t help. But the evidence on the pitch is there consistently, do you not feel this repetition, do you not feel that it’s futile. If we do the same thing again - what changes….massive evidence that nothing will, we will just have this conversation again in 8-12 months. The common denominator is this team and its culture.
I don’t think you can look at the past two performances and indeed the body of what 5 managers and say that the players and the culture isn’t a significant variable, it’s rank and there in front of our eyes at the moment.
100% agree with Dyche, or could be anyone, it’s exactly what I’ve been thinking, whether he himself stays or goes - I think changes very little, fundamentally in the points I’m making, in fact it just perpetuates the cycle.
We’ve all see it, lived through and living it, he just named it,
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