6 + 2 Point Deductions

[pfim]

Are Forest in this position as they sold Johnson for £20m more in August? Shpuld tgey have lost £20m on his value to sell by 30th June? I get that its within the rules but surely the fact that they made an extra £20m on a player in a couple months is better for the clubs financial position.

Isnt it a similar argument we used having to sell Richarlison for less as Spurs knew we had to sell by 30th June?

Yeah, they can't book the sale of an asset during the prior fiscal year if it occurs after the reporting date. It's a nonsense defense.

 

[Blue Willy]

If Forest get a big points deduction lets hope it will be applied this season, and not dilly dally over it and make it next.

 

[Ring master]

I thought the whole idea of this new deducted Points stuff is to do it in the same season, not try and drag it into next season. Though as that Table thing that was put up via twitter shows. It should be nowhere near having any chance of sorting after the season ends

 

[Tony’s Carp]

I thought the whole idea of this new deducted Points stuff is to do it in the same season, not try and drag it into next season. Though as that Table thing that was put up via twitter shows. It should be nowhere near having any chance of sorting after the season ends

Yeah it's going to be even more farcical I reckon, the new streamlined process is designed to get an outcome for these cases this season, but with the potential for an appeal to occur after the end of the season things could just degenerate quicker, imagine the last day of the season without clubs even knowing where they stand as the final points totals could be decided in appeal hearings after the event.

Financial Fair Play should always have had off-field consequences at most, fines, embargos or whatever. Whether it's your club or another club up against the wall at any given point, all fans surely want to believe what they see on the pitch, not have sporting outcomes tampered with retrospectively. Nothing will damage The Product more than fans losing faith in what they see on the pitch, and whether that's VAR or this whole FFP points deduction can of worms the PL are killing themselves with needless meddling.

The clubs collectively need together and put a stop to the madness of all this piecemeal on-the-hoof rulemaking and design a robust and consistent set of rules, procedures and punishments for FFP, or scrap it altogether. Although from an Everton perspective that may well come too late.

 

[pfim]

Yeah it's going to be even more farcical I reckon, the new streamlined process is designed to get an outcome for these cases this season, but with the potential for an appeal to occur after the end of the season things could just degenerate quicker, imagine the last day of the season without clubs even knowing where they stand as the final points totals could be decided in appeal hearings after the event.

Financial Fair Play should always have had off-field consequences at most, fines, embargos or whatever. Whether it's your club or another club up against the wall at any given point, all fans surely want to believe what they see on the pitch, not have sporting outcomes tampered with retrospectively. Nothing will damage The Product more than fans losing faith in what they see on the pitch, and whether that's VAR or this whole FFP points deduction can of worms the PL are killing themselves with needless meddling.

The clubs collectively need together and put a stop to the madness of all this piecemeal on-the-hoof rulemaking and design a robust and consistent set of rules, procedures and punishments for FFP, or scrap it altogether. Although from an Everton perspective that may well come too late.

It should just be a transfer ban, length should be subject to the degree of the breach.

Financial penalties don't make sense (clubs in actual financial peril won't be able to afford it, larger clubs/owners will treat it as a tax).

Points deductions involve the interests of too many clubs.

 

[Neiler]

Maybe Forest thought that ambulance chasing was a way out of their impending financial issues and subsequent sanctions. I’m still intrigued as to how they would of been affected by Everton and had recourse for suing our club though, seems utterly laughable.

Wasn't there a deadline for clubs being able to sue us - has that passed now?

 

[RD2910]

It should just be a transfer ban, length should be subject to the degree of the breach.

Financial penalties don't make sense (clubs in actual financial peril won't be able to afford it, larger clubs/owners will treat it as a tax).

Points deductions involve the interests of too many clubs.

I agree with that, if it's genuinely about the sustainability of clubs, some kind of limitation of spending, e.g. a transfer ban, is the only punishment that makes any sense. Financial penalties or points deductions actively threatening clubs' participation in the league just seem ridiculous to me.

 

[Neiler]

Are Forest hinting in their statement they may be close due to accounting treatment of promotion bonuses?? So Everton have some accounting confusion and breached due to a foreign war and building a stadium that will safeguard the clubs future, create jobs and regenerate a deprived area. Forest have some accounting confusion after getting promoted and earning an extra £90mill in revenue and went mad spending it.

Doesn’t sound the same thing.

Not saying we haven’t been run like a circus and made a colossal mess of everything on and off the pitch, but it was quite tiring 18 months ago when anyone that questioned how Forest could buy 63848 players was forcefully reminded they had a load of loan players in the Championship so had to buy players, it was all totally fine.

Also announced the Shelvey loan (and it was shown as a loan on the PL website) before realising they had breached the limit on players out on loan and supposedly immediately terminated his contract (presumably paying him millions) but never told anyone and he joined his new club as a free agent. Smells a lot.

Probably wise they haven’t tried to sue us for £100billion and aired all this in court. Sound just as hopeless as us. In their defence, I bet there were no documented rules about accounting for promotion bonuses under PSR.

Everyone is talking about the Brennan Johnson deal - but if you read the Forrest statements they weirdly highlight promotion bosses to the players.

 

[Tony’s Carp]

Wasn't there a deadline for clubs being able to sue us - has that passed now?

The 28 days from the original verdict has now passed but I imagine that was reset and will be 28 days from the appeal verdict. I don't think this is a major issue anyway.

 

[Neiler]

The 28 days from the original verdict has now passed but I imagine that was reset and will be 28 days from the appeal verdict. I don't think this is a major issue anyway.

Ive no idea mate - is that how the process works.

 

[blulouie]

Wasn't there a deadline for clubs being able to sue us - has that passed now?

Not sure when the deadline was , but I'm sure I read that the Clubs involved were not pursuing it anyway.

 

[Neiler]

Are Forest in this position as they sold Johnson for £20m more in August? Shpuld tgey have lost £20m on his value to sell by 30th June? I get that its within the rules but surely the fact that they made an extra £20m on a player in a couple months is better for the clubs financial position.

Isnt it a similar argument we used having to sell Richarlison for less as Spurs knew we had to sell by 30th June?

That will get short shrift mind - as it sets the precedent retrospectively and for other clubs to abuse in the future.

If they allowed Forrest to do it, why dont we go to the PL and say we complied with RIcharlison in the same circumstances and adhered, arguably loosing 20 mill - which incidentally is about how much breach we were in.

Its ridiculous i know.

 

[pfim]

Everyone is talking about the Brennan Johnson deal - but if you read the Forrest statements they weirdly highlight promotion bosses to the players.

Doesn't make sense either. That's an expense. And one that is known and should be budgeted for.

 

[Tony’s Carp]

Ive no idea mate - is that how the process works.

I would assume so, logically you couldn't have the compensation determined when the original process is still in motion, and the appeal is part of the original process. But logic doesn't seem to really come into it with the PL so who knows. Certainly though the original 28 days has expired.

 

[pfim]

That will get short shrift mind - as it sets the precedent retrospectively and for other clubs to abuse in the future.

If they allowed Forrest to do it, why dont we go to the PL and say we complied with RIcharlison in the same circumstances and adhered, arguably loosing 20 mill - which incidentally is about how much breach we were in.

Its ridiculous i know.

The Maguire tweet supports that they can't claim Johnson's fee as revenue for 06/30/2023. It's not a viable defense.

1. It implies that they broke the PSR number intentionally
2. The reason you can't backdate these transactions is that the guy could have torn an ACL, trucked off to Fiji for a year, been hit by a bus.