Everton Youth Teams Thread

[bluebrotha77]

For the uninitiated, what exactly is the Dallas Cup?

The Dr Pepper Dallas Cup, commonly known as the Dallas Cup, is an annual international football tournament for invited youth teams. The tournament was established in 1980[1] and is held in Dallas, Texas, with FC Dallas serving as its host club. Gordon Jago, an unofficial ambassador for USA soccer, is considered the "father" of the Dallas Cup. Coritiba F.C. is the current champion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Cup

 

[mightymoyes]

Perfect Week For Evans

by Adam Hill @Everton 30 March 2016 11:04

Young Everton midfielder Antony Evans has described his first international week away with England as ‘perfect’.
The Fazakerley-born youngster made his England Under-18s debut against Austria during the recent international break - coming on as a second half substitute.
In the next match on Easter Sunday, Evans started against the Republic of Ireland, capping off the performance with his first international goal in a 4-1 win.

“It was really good to get a debut against Austria,” Evans told evertontv. “To get my first start against Ireland, and then to get my first goal - it was perfect.”

Evans believes the good start against Ireland set the team up for the rest of the match.

“We took an early lead, then they got a penalty - which they missed. I felt as though that made the game easier for us – and then we battered them.”

The move that lead to his first international goal was started by an Everton Under-21s teammate.

“Tom Davies pinched it off them at the half way line, played it to our striker, and he rolled it back to me, so I took a touch, and placed it to the bottom right corner,” he recalled.

Having his Everton teammates Davies and Nathan Holland helped Evans settle in around the players, and the Everton connection didn’t stop there - with former Everton academy coach Neil Dewsnip leading the England Under-18s coaching setup.

“Having Nathan and ‘Davo’ there really helped,” continued the 17-year-old. “I just sat with them and eased my way in, but once I got to know the lads, it was so much easier.

“Neil said he was proud of me, since I had known him since I was small. He helped me settle in as well, with a bit of banter – which the lads laughed at. He is a really good coach

 

[SerenityNigh]

The Dr Pepper Dallas Cup, commonly known as the Dallas Cup, is an annual international football tournament for invited youth teams. The tournament was established in 1980[1] and is held in Dallas, Texas, with FC Dallas serving as its host club. Gordon Jago, an unofficial ambassador for USA soccer, is considered the "father" of the Dallas Cup. Coritiba F.C. is the current champion.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Cup

Further, @kithnou

List of Supergroup champions[edit]
Year Champion Country
1980 Texas Longhorns SC United States
1981 Royal Navy England
1982 Lagos Stars Nigeria
1983 NSL Select Canada
1984 NSL Select Canada
1985 Trebor Lions Nigeria
1986 Comets United States
1987 Tahuichi Bolivia
1988 Tahuichi Bolivia
1989 Tahuichi Bolivia
1990 Tahuichi Bolivia
1991 Dynamo Moscow Russia
1992 West Ham England
1993 Real Madrid Spain
1994 Real Madrid Spain
1995 São Paulo Brazil
1996 Vitória Brazil
1997 Vitória Brazil
1998 San Lorenzo Argentina
1999 Corinthians Brazil
2000 Corinthians Brazil
2001 UNAM Pumas Mexico
2002 Nottingham Forest England
2003 Tigres Mexico
2004 Atlético Paranaense Brazil
2005 Atlético Paranaense Brazil
2006 Dallas Texans United States
2007 São Paulo Brazil
2008 Liverpool England
2009 São Paulo Brazil
2010 Cruzeiro Brazil
2011 Eintracht Frankfurt Germany
Tigres Mexico
2012 Coritiba Brazil
2013 Fulham England
2014 River Plate Argentina
2015 Coritiba Brazil

+ 2016 Everton, England

 

[blueloon]

There was an interesting piece the other day about Nicky Butt ,now Man U Academy director, saying how they were going after attracting the best youngsters in Europe this summer. This is almost the opposite of what we generally do , attract and bring on local or British youngsters with the odd foreign youngster . This makes sense given you really need to have an extensive, and expensive, foreign scouting system in place for it to be successful.

But it did get me thinking - I wonder what our recently appointed Academy Director , Dr Peter Vint is up to , haven't seen anything from him since his start in January. All our previous Academy Directors , Hall, Irvine, Devine have been steeped in football knowledge and Everton, Vint is completely different , his previous job was with with the US Olympic team and with a background focussing on performance analysis and developing high performance in athletes . It was heralded as a pioneering appointment , which was actually to me quite pleasing that we were trying something different , although I'm a great fan of the work Alan Irvine did in his time from a more traditional background. It's odd though that he hasn't raised his head much, even in the Dallas win where rightly the credit has been given to Kevin Sheedy ,Phil Jevons and the other coaches, you would hope he had some input into preparing them for the 5 matches in 8 days that occurred. Anybody seen anything on him that I've missed?

 

[blueblue]

Whereas I am sure that Everton will still attract the best of local talent, the search for the best young players is now worldwide.
I can see clubs setting up academies like Finch Farm in different continents and trying to develop talent there and only the very best will ever come to the academy at FF.

 

[catcherintherye]

Whereas I am sure that Everton will still attract the best of local talent, the search for the best young players is now worldwide.
I can see clubs setting up academies like Finch Farm in different continents and trying to develop talent there and only the very best will ever come to the academy at FF.

Do you think that would be a positive development though Blueblue?

Liverpool as a city and a metropolitan area is sizeable and probably the richest source of talent per head of anywhere in the UK. There are also only two league teams in that area currently.

It is always telling seeing the differences in approach from us and Liverpool, in that they often have lots of foreign lads even at under 18. I am nervous about this.

I think we are showing year on year, when you look at lads like Williams, Davies, Ledson, Walsh, Kenny, Dowell all from the local area the talent will always be there it's about how you develop them. How much time, energy and resources could have to be spent bringing a similar crop of 18 year olds over?

I quite like the Ajax model and is partly why I would be delighted to see De Boer here. They do scout young players but sightly older than academy are group and filter them into their own teams. I think we have done that quite well already with the likes of Besic, Deulofeu & Stones.

As for Butt it seems a strange statement. It is a "statement of intent" sort of remark without a lot of thought going into it. United are getting whacked on local talent by City, yet are still churning out more first teamers. If I was him my focus would be on trying to pinch City players at age 15/16 on the basis that they maximise their chance of first team football. Much like Liverpool, why do they need to scout across Europe? I'm not sure what it means.

 

[SerenityNigh]

Whereas I am sure that Everton will still attract the best of local talent, the search for the best young players is now worldwide.
I can see clubs setting up academies like Finch Farm in different continents and trying to develop talent there and only the very best will ever come to the academy at FF.

Still have work permit issues, though?

 

[SerenityNigh]

There was an interesting piece the other day about Nicky Butt ,now Man U Academy director, saying how they were going after attracting the best youngsters in Europe this summer. This is almost the opposite of what we generally do , attract and bring on local or British youngsters with the odd foreign youngster . This makes sense given you really need to have an extensive, and expensive, foreign scouting system in place for it to be successful.

But it did get me thinking - I wonder what our recently appointed Academy Director , Dr Peter Vint is up to , haven't seen anything from him since his start in January. All our previous Academy Directors , Hall, Irvine, Devine have been steeped in football knowledge and Everton, Vint is completely different , his previous job was with with the US Olympic team and with a background focussing on performance analysis and developing high performance in athletes . It was heralded as a pioneering appointment , which was actually to me quite pleasing that we were trying something different , although I'm a great fan of the work Alan Irvine did in his time from a more traditional background. It's odd though that he hasn't raised his head much, even in the Dallas win where rightly the credit has been given to Kevin Sheedy ,Phil Jevons and the other coaches, you would hope he had some input into preparing them for the 5 matches in 8 days that occurred. Anybody seen anything on him that I've missed?

Is Venkman's job the sort where the results are obvious and direct, like a scout, or more indirect and less obvious like strength trainer? Not exactly sure what he does, but thought his position was more the latter.

 

[Dharma]

There was an interesting piece the other day about Nicky Butt ,now Man U Academy director, saying how they were going after attracting the best youngsters in Europe this summer. This is almost the opposite of what we generally do , attract and bring on local or British youngsters with the odd foreign youngster . This makes sense given you really need to have an extensive, and expensive, foreign scouting system in place for it to be successful.

But it did get me thinking - I wonder what our recently appointed Academy Director , Dr Peter Vint is up to , haven't seen anything from him since his start in January. All our previous Academy Directors , Hall, Irvine, Devine have been steeped in football knowledge and Everton, Vint is completely different , his previous job was with with the US Olympic team and with a background focussing on performance analysis and developing high performance in athletes . It was heralded as a pioneering appointment , which was actually to me quite pleasing that we were trying something different , although I'm a great fan of the work Alan Irvine did in his time from a more traditional background. It's odd though that he hasn't raised his head much, even in the Dallas win where rightly the credit has been given to Kevin Sheedy ,Phil Jevons and the other coaches, you would hope he had some input into preparing them for the 5 matches in 8 days that occurred. Anybody seen anything on him that I've missed?

Think he's been trying out the new bedrooms at Finch Farm.

 

[blueblue]

Do you think that would be a positive development though Blueblue?

Liverpool as a city and a metropolitan area is sizeable and probably the richest source of talent per head of anywhere in the UK. There are also only two league teams in that area currently.

It is always telling seeing the differences in approach from us and Liverpool, in that they often have lots of foreign lads even at under 18. I am nervous about this.

I think we are showing year on year, when you look at lads like Williams, Davies, Ledson, Walsh, Kenny, Dowell all from the local area the talent will always be there it's about how you develop them. How much time, energy and resources could have to be spent bringing a similar crop of 18 year olds over?

I quite like the Ajax model and is partly why I would be delighted to see De Boer here. They do scout young players but sightly older than academy are group and filter them into their own teams. I think we have done that quite well already with the likes of Besic, Deulofeu & Stones.

As for Butt it seems a strange statement. It is a "statement of intent" sort of remark without a lot of thought going into it. United are getting whacked on local talent by City, yet are still churning out more first teamers. If I was him my focus would be on trying to pinch City players at age 15/16 on the basis that they maximise their chance of first team football. Much like Liverpool, why do they need to scout across Europe? I'm not sure what it means.

Catcher.
I m not sure there is much choice in the matter. The game has gone global and all the big clubs in our catchment area realise that good players can be found locally but also all over the world. From what I read on threads like this clubs like Man City are spending huge amounts in attempts to hoover all the best local talent.
We can't afford to focus on the local areas alone. We have to chase talent all over the world.

 

[blueloon]

Is Venkman's job the sort where the results are obvious and direct, like a scout, or more indirect and less obvious like strength trainer? Not exactly sure what he does, but thought his position was more the latter.

Erm , not sure if that's a typo or wishful thinking mate , Dr Peter Venkman is the guy from Ghostbusters , pretty smart , funny and able to take out all kinds of supernatural villains . Sadly we appointed Dr Peter Vint ( ok guys , no Martinez rants please) but yes his background is sports science, performance development so more indirect input.

From what I read on threads like this clubs like Man City are spending huge amounts in attempts to hoover all the best local talent.
We can't afford to focus on the local areas alone. We have to chase talent all over the world.

But there's the rub as they say. There's no way we can compete with City in the hoovering up stakes - e.g. They paid a reported £12 mill to Fulham for the then 18 year old Patrick Roberts, who's quite a prospect, and in January shipped him out to Celtic for an 18 month loan. Chelsea have 30 odd players out on loan many on the continent at clubs like Vitess Arnhem. We can't compete with them money wise but I did see once that we had someone called "Head of Europe Scouting " on the staff. We do a reasonable amount of foreign scouting going by the youngsters we've brought in , but usually it's been as a result of a connection with the club , or we've seen him play. E.g. We brought in a guy from River Plate last year after seeing him in Dallas tournament but sent him back. Others include Henen, Leandro, Tarashaj, and the 16 year old Finn Miko Vertanen. Our problem is we're fishing at the cheap end of the pool, 250k ish for Henen and Leandro is not much of a risk but you get what you pay for usually and unlikely that those two will ever play say 10 PL games for us.
Mix it up is my preference. Keep developing local talent and aim to become the club of choice in the N West for developing players, fill any gaps with UK youngsters bought in,e.g. Stones, Galloway, Holgate, Foulds and if we go abroad be very selective ,not scatter gun , pay a multi million fee if necessary and take a risk now and again.

 

[SerenityNigh]

But there's the rub as they say. There's no way we can compete with City in the hoovering up stakes - e.g. They paid a reported £12 mill to Fulham for the then 18 year old Patrick Roberts, who's quite a prospect, and in January shipped him out to Celtic for an 18 month loan. Chelsea have 30 odd players out on loan many on the continent at clubs like Vitess Arnhem. We can't compete with them money wise but I did see once that we had someone called "Head of Europe Scouting " on the staff. We do a reasonable amount of foreign scouting going by the youngsters we've brought in , but usually it's been as a result of a connection with the club , or we've seen him play. E.g. We brought in a guy from River Plate last year after seeing him in Dallas tournament but sent him back. Others include Henen, Leandro, Tarashaj, and the 16 year old Finn Miko Vertanen. Our problem is we're fishing at the cheap end of the pool, 250k ish for Henen and Leandro is not much of a risk but you get what you pay for usually and unlikely that those two will ever play say 10 PL games for us.
Mix it up is my preference. Keep developing local talent and aim to become the club of choice in the N West for developing players, fill any gaps with UK youngsters bought in,e.g. Stones, Galloway, Foulds and if we go abroad be very selective ,not scatter gun , pay a multi million fee if necessary and take a risk now and again.

Seems then like there's an opening in the market for catching "small" and "late-developing" talents that or any others that will be off the radar for "big clubs" and their mega-academies. It might fit well for Everton to advance further in this regard, with more £1-3M "punts" like Stones, Galloway, Holgate, or Foulds to compliment the academy lads.

 

[blueblue]

Seems then like there's an opening in the market for catching "small" and "late-developing" talents that or any others that will be off the radar for "big clubs" and their mega-academies. It might fit well for Everton to advance further in this regard, with more £1-3M "punts" like Stones, Galloway, Holgate, or Foulds to compliment the academy lads.

We are not alone in watching that market and again clubs like City can come in and offer the kind of money that most clubs cannot afford.

However, I think we need to look at the big picture/long term.
The owners of clubs like City and Chelsea may be wealthy but have no intention of continuing to pour hundreds of millions in buying expensive players every year.
The academies are being developed in the hope that less money will be spent rather than more.

 

[atrottel]

Puff piece on Everton Academy from a recent school presentation (includes the Mr Vint mentioned above):

 

[catcherintherye]

Catcher.
I m not sure there is much choice in the matter. The game has gone global and all the big clubs in our catchment area realise that good players can be found locally but also all over the world. From what I read on threads like this clubs like Man City are spending huge amounts in attempts to hoover all the best local talent.
We can't afford to focus on the local areas alone. We have to chase talent all over the world.

I do understand your point and I am not against recruiting the best talent globally. I just worry about the feasibility of it. What age group are we talking, as it remains very difficult to pull under 16's from abroad across without running the risk of huge fines. Likewise you can get some under 18's but invariably you have to pay (relatively) big fees and often huge wages and sign on fees. I do wonder what impact that has on other young players in the academy. You have a settled and successful group of lads up to 16 and then look to start bringing star names in once they are 18 who are paid more than the rest of the squad are put together.

You are right to talk about the different approach City and Chelsea have taken. However I see their attempts to recruit internationally as a sign of weakness not strength. For Chelsea, post Terry they have brought no local lad through their academy. I simply think recruiting lots of highly paid teenagers attempts to cover for a weakness in their system. Likewise with City the local talent has really dried up. it's a bit different for City as they are hovering up the best local talent but are really struggling to bring anyone through.

The obvious point it would seem to me is that the more time they allocate to recruiting international players the harder it becomes for local talent. The solution to their problem appears to be spending even more which then goes on highly paid talent.

Alternatively since moving to FF in particular we have shown a pretty decent conveyor belt. Likewise we have Connolly, Holland, Ledson, Yates, Davies, Kenny, Evans who are all regularly capped by England youth teams and lads like Walsh and Dowell who are very well thought of. All of them are within 30 minutes drive of our stadium. The questions I would ask are;
1) How much effort/money/time would it take to recruit a similar group of young players/internationals from abroad?
2) Could that money be more efficiently spent on local talent?

I think what I shows to me, is that there is more than enough talent within the local area for us, and our strength is tapping into that. That's not to say it shouldn't be counter balanced by bringing others in, but I do think you need to be careful. How would the above lads moral have been impacted if we'd have brought in a series of very highly paid foreign youngsters who are on a similar level to them?

The biggest worry I have for Everton currently is Manchester City. Their best player in their under 16's (who may leave) used to be with us. They've got another great prospect from Huyton in the same year group. We should not be losing out on those players and we do need to think of ways to try to combat City on that.