Financial Fair Play investigation

[Goat]

I think its partially true. They would have probably sent them off and got them passed. I suspect they have come under pressure from teams, and may be panicking.

This is hypothetical, but it is worth considering, would teams have a conflict of interest in wanting Everton to be punished?

I think the whole league saw us take the pee, hell we joked on here about how much pee we took.

Some clubs clearly dont want the PL sniffing around, but other clubs, who have followed the rules, I can imagine they would be pretty pissed that Everton was allowed to take the mick.

 

[Blue peter]

I think its partially true. They would have probably sent them off and got them passed. I suspect they have come under pressure from teams, and may be panicking.

This is hypothetical, but it is worth considering, would teams have a conflict of interest in wanting Everton to be punished?

Yes they would and we have given them the ammunition to place pressure on the PL

 

[catcherintherye]

So maybe the City case made these people speed up the time in which they bring cases?

Simple question mate.

Do you think we broke FFP/P&L rules?

Perhaps, but that wouldn't answer why they have left accounts are over a year old.

Honestly my answer is I'm not qualified to make that judgement. The regulator is, and if the regulator felt they were broken I would expect that to be communicated within a reasonable time frame (say 12 months maximum).

I dont really understand PL rules. They are pretty nonsensical, contradictory and seem to go against many standard practices in the world outside of football.

I think the accounts are bad. I dont see any sense in plucking an arbitrary figure on the P&L and punishing struggling businesses who may be below that figure. That seems a very odd way to operate as a regulator, and anti-competitive.

 

[Davideeyore]

View attachment 207401

Likely the league have just referred it to satisfy the clubs complaining, the PL have always backed Everton over P&S and haven't wanted to punish them.

Is it me or is there some conflicting reports on the stance of other PL clubs? Can you have it both ways by sticking the knife in to Everton and complaining to the PL ouch that's a bit harsh on Everton!

Yes, but without Moshiri there is no BMD. He's funded the lot with no other funding model available. He also cleared/capitalised all of our previous debts from years of ineptitude, when the club's relative stock was in a managed decline, papered over only by Moyes building teams from nothing, having to sell to buy. We were overtaken in terms of infrastructure and income by all of our peers and several more besides. The same chairman found a mug who was prepared to part with his cash (and his mate) and who fancied playing absent landlord(s). Bk promptly blew his warchest too, and we've still not recovered. This is just all of that coming home to roost.

Completely agree Tom, Moshiri came in and conveniently for those running the club previously, was able to clear the previous debts and launch the club in to a new era (!) where we could start to bridge the gap on our peers and compete in the transfer market. The trouble is he's kept the same board by and large, same chairman, and has played his part too in the way the club has been poorly run. Moshiri has no football brains. I can scarcely believe he's a bona fide accountant.

With Moshiri he's the money man pure and simple. If indeed it is his money and not his counterparts. It's been a complete ckkk up. We've had our Sliding Doors moments over and and over it's a bit like Groundhog Day. Sorry for the puns

 

[davek]

The worry I have is the Tories are utterly useless, and incapable of scoring this own goal, which for any rational person would be to suspend the PLs license to govern, and immediately end all flawed investigations the corrupt organisation are undertaking on bizarre rules.

That's what a reasonable government does. They wont though, as they are cowardly scum.

Spot on mate.

 

[turner]

I‘m just absolutely speculating here (as we all are) but is it possible that the PL have adopted a similar tactic for a pre/post Covid income average to more accurately quantify the uncrystalised Covid losses?

For example if EFC say match day revenue was down, say £25m (pulled out of thin air) but pre & post Covid suggests the impact was more like £10m, then the PL have a more robust case to build their allegations on. This would not excuse the PL in not communicating this new strategy, but historic context places those uncrystalised losses in much clearer focus.

The covid year should have been ignored for p&s. The world shut down, games were stopped for a long period, the euros were cancelled. Games were played behind closed doors. Players got sick, some probably never got back to their previous level (Godfrey's situation being suspicious in this case). It's madness to me that they have taken that year into account.

'the rules apply the same to everyone' :
Covid would disproportionately affect some teams rather than others depending on myriad different circumstances. Perhaps we could have sold some of our high earners in that period. Even supposedly well run clubs were trying to furlough staff.

I'm not for one minute suggesting our board aren't divs, but that year was so anomalous in the football world (nothing like that has happened since the wars) that it seems completely mad to include that year in the financial rules.

We'll end up with a bigger punishment than the 6 clubs that tried to topple the league completely.

 

[Goat]

Perhaps, but that wouldn't answer why they have left accounts are over a year old.

Honestly my answer is I'm not qualified to make that judgement. The regulator is, and if the regulator felt they were broken I would expect that to be communicated within a reasonable time frame (say 12 months maximum).

I dont really understand PL rules. They are pretty nonsensical, contradictory and seem to go against many standard practices in the world outside of football.

I think the accounts are bad. I dont see any sense in plucking an arbitrary figure on the P&L and punishing struggling businesses who may be below that figure. That seems a very odd way to operate as a regulator, and anti-competitive.

I guess we have different ideas of how quickly these things happen.

I imagine its a very long-drawn-out process.

I mean it takes years for most criminal/civil cases to go to court, the legal process and even to a degree the business world doesnt operate in normal time frames.

 

[PhilM]

My answer to that is id guess 90% of the league break the rules but they employ people smart enough within their clubs to manipulate the numbers or find 'loopholes'

This is the difference between ourselves and City too. They, with the financial might and resources from the state, will be able to contest any charges.

At a minimum, they'll have them tied up for years and years. On the other hand, we don't have such might and have already shown to be inept in many ways.

Whether it's motivated from pressure by other clubs or political channels, we have opened up the opportunity to bend us over through our own incompetence.

 

[roydo]

Can you have it both ways by sticking the knife in to Everton and complaining to the PL ouch that's a bit harsh on Everton!

Think you are reading it the wrong way round mate. Some clubs will say we spent a few bob last summer that we should not have been allowed to. Cos the PL said we were ok. 9 months later the PL aint so sure.

 

[Goat]

Is it me or is there some conflicting reports on the stance of other PL clubs? Can you have it both ways by sticking the knife in to Everton and complaining to the PL ouch that's a bit harsh on Everton!




Completely agree Tom, Moshiri came in and conveniently for those running the club previously, was able to clear the previous debts and launch the club in to a new era (!) where we could start to bridge the gap on our peers and compete in the transfer market. The trouble is he's kept the same board by and large same chairman, and has played his part too in the way the club has been poorly run. Moshiri has no football brains. I can scarcely believe he's a bona fide accountant.

With Moshiri he's the money man pure and simple. If indeed it is his money and not his counterparts. It's been a complete ckkk up. We've had our Sliding Doors moments over and and over it's a bit like Groundhog Day. Sorry for the puns

The problem lies with people reading newspaper articles and assuming what they write is true.

The fanbase/We are totally blind regarding all this, for 1 we havent even seen the accounts yet.

 

[Damo_1878]

I am not referring to that set of accounts.

Well this is the monitoring period that has set it off

 

[Goat]

Think you are reading it the wrong way round mate. Some clubs will say we spent a few bob last summer that we should not have been allowed to. Cos the PL said we were ok. 9 months later the PL aint so sure.

I think the biggest problem is, did the Premier League OK the accounts? Or did they just take them off us and say "We will get back to you".

 

[catcherintherye]

I think the whole league saw us take the pee, hell we joked on here about how much pee we took.

Some clubs clearly dont want the PL sniffing around, but other clubs, who have followed the rules, I can imagine they would be pretty pissed that Everton was allowed to take the mick.

I imagine lots of teams are going to be angry they get relegated and want to try and reverse that. Which is their right. It's a bit odd as theyve pretty much all outspent us for this period (the last 2 years) but I can understand them looking out for their interests.

What is not acceptable though, in any sort of liberal society, with any notion of due process and transparency, is a regulator to be guided by this sentiment.

As I indicated, it is a conflict of interest. You cannot expect a fair process where this exists, and only totalitarian states operate legal systems in such a way.

We can all be angry about lots of things. It doesnt give you the right to get guilt against someone on the basis of that. Theres a process to be followed.

 

[catcherintherye]

Well this is the monitoring period that has set it off

Yes. And if you go back to the first point, that set of accounts are not listed on that page, because the club hasnt released them yet.

 

[windymiller]

I always love these threads as it reveals how many accountants, sports lawyers and financial regulators there are amongst our fanbase. It's also amazing to me that the venn diagram of football tactics experts, transfer specialists and financial regulators overlap almost perfectly.

Or, maybe, just maybe, none of us have a scooby and all of these tense discussions are just droplets of urine in the breeze.

Clearly, we have been run very poorly, clearly there will be some sort of consequence, but I'll guarantee not a soul on here knows what it'll be.