2018/19 Idrissa Gueye

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Imagine if it ends up Gana out and Ndayie in?

Carnage

 

[Prevenger17]

but you've held that view for a long time now.

He's held it since Gana stopped being 21. Zat has literally said players stop being good as soon as they hit 30 in the transfer window thread

 

[Osamabindiesel]

I get the shouts to replace him, but let’s not underplay his value here. He would be let got because:

A. He wants a move
B. We have a replacement lined up and Silva decided to go a different direction with the midfield

We won’t find anyone close to the tackler that Gana is. People like to argue he isn’t in the upper echelon of talent, yet he proves them wrong again and again. Whenever something goes wrong, he gets scapegoated as “not being creative enough” as the deepest lying DEFENSIVE midifielder in the side, and that I will never understand. He is a counter attacking sides wet dream, and as of last season, that is what we were.

 

[Bud McBlokeski]

He's held it since Gana stopped being 21. Zat has literally said players stop being good as soon as they hit 30 in the transfer window thread

Someone should tell Ronaldo and Messi then.

 

[4737carlin]

We havent even been able to replace Zouma, not even with Zouma himself, if we cant do that so far i cant see us being able to replace Gueye so easily either.
No chance we can sell him, right now we are still a main player down on last season, priority has to be to at least get back to level and then make additions

 

[CRIMHEAD]

Loads of people said the same about Fellaini absolutely loads of them. It was only because the whole Moyes poaching him and Baines saga left a bad taste in the mouth that towards the end some people were glad to see him go. Wind the clock back a few months before that though and the general view on the fan base was that he was indispensable.

I’m not arguing to replace him like for like. I agree that would be difficult. But our midfield set up isn’t great anyway because it’s based around two players who can only do one thing. Gueye has to play in a certain position to do what he’s good at and due to his limitations on the ball he has to be partnered in the deep midfielder role. Siggurdson has to play at number 10. That means we can only ever really play the 4231 formation. Take either out and we look rubbish. That doesn’t mean that these two are world beaters, it means it’s a poor system. Liverpool or City can play nearly any midfield combination in different formations and still perform well.

Sell Gueye (id sell Siggurdson as well but beggars can’t be choosers) and bring in a player that could allow us to play in a different way. Maybe we wouldn’t get run through as much if we dominated possession better. Perhaps we wouldn’t have such an onus on Richarlison and Siggurdson to score if we had a more creative midfield overall, one that could score goals also, perhaps be effective on set pieces too.

We should see this as an opportunity and I bet Brands has been after having 6 months to prepare for it I suspect.

Our top players will always leave, whether it’s to a mega club in their prime, or to Sheffield United for retirement. It’s only a matter of when. As a fan base we have an irrational fear of effective player trading. We’re still going on about the Rooney and Arteta sales despite them being yonks ago. That lot across the park have sold far more than we have recently yet it’s not done them any harm at all. Chelsea have just sold their best player, United may well do this window, Arsenal do it all the time.

If we had a trophy winning world 11 I’d say fair enough, we might want to hang onto them until the magic goes and it needs a refresh. But this squad needs major major surgery and effective player trading is going to be a huge part of that. Right when we need to be getting on board with Brand’s impressive revamp (which it has been so far), we have a fan base complaining about selling any players (‘it’s just sell to buy’) and especially averse to selling any players that might have value.

Gueye doesn't have to play in a deeper role. I just don't understand how you would think that at all. The team probably played BETTER when Schneiderlin was in the deeper role and Gana got to run around and win balls all over the place. Gana can play the 6 and play as an 8. I personally would like a more versatile player along side of Gana who can play the 6 and 8 as well, that way you can play both 4-3-3 variants that Silva wants to employ - one with a true sitting 6, the other with twin CMs/DMs.

 

[CRIMHEAD]

We havent even been able to replace Zouma, not even with Zouma himself, if we cant do that so far i cant see us being able to replace Gueye so easily either.
No chance we can sell him, right now we are still a main player down on last season, priority has to be to at least get back to level and then make additions

I don't think Mina is going to be much of a drop off from Zouma. Our defensive setup was quite good last year and with an improvement in set piece defense - Mina will help - and with a bit better ball retention from our attack, we should be even better. Mina is also better with the all than Zouma and more of a threat on set pieces. He also knows the tactics, this wouldn't be like bringing in someone completely new to replace Gana. Mina vs. Zouma might not be a drop off at all, but the drop off from Gana to someone else might be cliff-like. I have no problem replacing him at some point, but not now.

My guess it that we won't spend the big money Chelsea will ask for Zouma and we instead get a cheaper alternative like Soumaoro, who is really good and a terrific fit. He's quick, super strong, good in space, very active, and although he's not tall, his aerial numbers are off the charts. He's a very conservative player with the ball, but he'd be a lovely fit off the bench and as a spot starter. He's probably going for less than 20M and I think he'd be an ample replacement.

 

[JimmyK]

This is basically it. There seems to be a view propagated that it's either;
1) Gana is an excellent player or
2) We should sell Gana if the right offer comes in.

To me both can be true at the same time. In truth I am not sure we have the luxury of always hanging onto our players, irrespective of price if we want to be successful. I know it sounds counter intuitive, but if you can let people go at the right time then you can buy better players.

Our position is very similar to sides in the Bundesliga, Spain or even France who have to overcome teams above them who can greatly outspend them. In all cases they do not mirror what the sides above them do as they'd be doomed to failure. Sides like Atletico Madrid, Sevilla, Dortmund, Schalke, Monaco etc have all had enormous success on the back of this approach. They have a functional and cold view of a player and when a price point is met they go.

So you have to look at the player in question and ask does it make sense for them to leave now? In Gana's case, probably. He is 29 and still has a lot to offer but is not getting any younger and coming off the back of an excellent end to the season. Someone will pay good money. Fast forward 12 months and we don't know where we will be with him.

I'd also suggest a gentlemans agreement came that he could go, and you generally kill moral of a team going back on those. He was excellent last season but pretty poor the season before as well.

My view is, if Gana goes, we could have Delph at a similar age and wages come in for next to nothing. The 30+ million profit on the deal could then pay for Malcolm, or Kean or Leao or an other. To me thats smart business.

If a good offer doesn't come in, I'll be happy to keep him too, but I don't think we can be turning down £30 + million for 29 year old midfielders.

Central midfield is - in my opinion at least - the most important position on the pitch. It's where games are won and lost, if you lose the midfield battle you will invariably lose the game. If Brands' masterplan is to replace Gana with Delph (a significantly inferior player for me, the same age, about the half the price but on higher wages) so that we can spend a bit more on another winger, he's not the DoF I was hoping he was.

If we decide to let him go to bring in one of the boss sounding French players the FIFA lids are always on about it's a different matter, but to swap him for Delph would be absolute madness in my eyes. It really needs to be noted here that Andre Gomes (who I love) is one of the slowest 25 year olds I've ever seen. He covers ground extremely slowly and literally fouls more often than he successfully tackles. He NEEDS legs next to him, or we are in all sorts of trouble from a defensive viewpoint.

 

[Zatara]

He's held it since Gana stopped being 21. Zat has literally said players stop being good as soon as they hit 30 in the transfer window thread

May 25, 2016

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Nymzee said:
If we're still on about Sidibe at Lille he's a RB they just have no one good at LB and he was second choice to Corchia at RB. Good player but can't compare him to Amavi in the LB spot.

If we were going to sign a RB i would hope its this chap https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenny_Tete

When you say you cant compare him to Amavi do you mean Amavi is better or just that one should be playing RB? Seems that sidibe played alot of games at LB last season and some big bids going on for him?

If amavi gets over his injury hed be a great signing as would idrissa gueye from villa

 

[COYBL25]

He's held it since Gana stopped being 21. Zat has literally said players stop being good as soon as they hit 30 in the transfer window thread

It`s like Logans Run for footy players, once they hit 30, they whither and die lol

 

[catcherintherye]

Central midfield is - in my opinion at least - the most important position on the pitch. It's where games are won and lost, if you lose the midfield battle you will invariably lose the game. If Brands' masterplan is to replace Gana with Delph (a significantly inferior player for me, the same age, about the half the price but on higher wages) so that we can spend a bit more on another winger, he's not the DoF I was hoping he was.

If we decide to let him go to bring in one of the boss sounding French players the FIFA lids are always on about it's a different matter, but to swap him for Delph would be absolute madness in my eyes. It really needs to be noted here that Andre Gomes (who I love) is one of the slowest 25 year olds I've ever seen. He covers ground extremely slowly and literally fouls more often than he successfully tackles. He NEEDS legs next to him, or we are in all sorts of trouble from a defensive viewpoint.

I see them as similar players in terms of levels.

As for wages Delphs will be ball park the same as Ganas and I can't imagine we would pay anything like 20 million for Delph. I could see a loan deal.

 

[Darth Toffeeman]

I get the shouts to replace him, but let’s not underplay his value here. He would be let got because:

A. He wants a move
B. We have a replacement lined up and Silva decided to go a different direction with the midfield

We won’t find anyone close to the tackler that Gana is. People like to argue he isn’t in the upper echelon of talent, yet he proves them wrong again and again. Whenever something goes wrong, he gets scapegoated as “not being creative enough” as the deepest lying DEFENSIVE midifielder in the side, and that I will never understand. He is a counter attacking sides wet dream, and as of last season, that is what we were.

Griezmann is 28 and has just gone for £107m.

Age shouldn't matter if the player is a key contributor.

I would be gutted to lose Gana. Without him and Zouma the densive solidity of the end of the season evaporates and we are back to trying to find a formula that works and wasting potentially another season.

 

[COYBL25]

Central midfield is - in my opinion at least - the most important position on the pitch. It's where games are won and lost, if you lose the midfield battle you will invariably lose the game. If Brands' masterplan is to replace Gana with Delph (a significantly inferior player for me, the same age, about the half the price but on higher wages) so that we can spend a bit more on another winger, he's not the DoF I was hoping he was.

If we decide to let him go to bring in one of the boss sounding French players the FIFA lids are always on about it's a different matter, but to swap him for Delph would be absolute madness in my eyes. It really needs to be noted here that Andre Gomes (who I love) is one of the slowest 25 year olds I've ever seen. He covers ground extremely slowly and literally fouls more often than he successfully tackles. He NEEDS legs next to him, or we are in all sorts of trouble from a defensive viewpoint.

You forgot to mention that Delph seems to pick up a fair few injuries, where as Gana doesn`t.

The current back up options of Davies and Schneiderlin doesn`t even bear thinking about, should we sign Delph and he gets injured.

I can`t get my head around why some people are so keen to sell one of our players of the year and such a pivotal member of the team.

 

[JimmyK]

I see them as similar players in terms of levels.

As for wages Delphs will be ball park the same as Ganas and I can't imagine we would pay anything like 20 million for Delph. I could see a loan deal.

I like Delph but Gana's a much better midfielder for me. Reports are that City want £15m, and their reported wages are different by £15k a week. I feel like your post is just kind of saying what you'd like to be the case, and ignoring what actually is the case.

 

[CRIMHEAD]

Central midfield is - in my opinion at least - the most important position on the pitch. It's where games are won and lost, if you lose the midfield battle you will invariably lose the game. If Brands' masterplan is to replace Gana with Delph (a significantly inferior player for me, the same age, about the half the price but on higher wages) so that we can spend a bit more on another winger, he's not the DoF I was hoping he was.

If we decide to let him go to bring in one of the boss sounding French players the FIFA lids are always on about it's a different matter, but to swap him for Delph would be absolute madness in my eyes. It really needs to be noted here that Andre Gomes (who I love) is one of the slowest 25 year olds I've ever seen. He covers ground extremely slowly and literally fouls more often than he successfully tackles. He NEEDS legs next to him, or we are in all sorts of trouble from a defensive viewpoint.

Spot on.