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James McCarthy

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Saint Domingo said:
If like to know which other team played all season with two sometimes three defensive miss and still had a very poor defensive record, even more so which team would then have a player wanting a new contract after that. McCarthy was as bad as anyone last season and is hugely responsible for our dour attacking play. He is a good defensive midfielder, but no more, he is not close to being our best player or world class. He is hugely overrated by some Everton fans.
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Whilst i think you're being a bit harsh, you've definitely got a point.

The lad is very passive in some games. The James McCarthy we want is the one who scored the goal vs Utd at home.

He needs to add that tyhpe of thing on a consistent basis before he can be classed as one of our best players imo.
 
kithnou said:
25m for a good player that offers little goal threat? Sweet Lord.
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'tis the going rate, mon amis.

manchester-united-unveil-new-signing-morgan-schneiderlin.jpg
 

EFC78 said:
I disagree that he was bad last season. He was one of our better players but injuries prevented him from having a great season.

Who do you see as our best players then, as I think he is up there, especially in terms of importance to the team? I do take your point about him being over rated slightly though and world class is a ridiculous claim. I also think that those asking for more goals etc are being a bit deluded about what a defensive midfielder's role in the team is though. Does Matic get goals? He's by far the best defensive midfielder in the league. Schweinsteiger got 7 once for Bayern, and other than that the most he got was 5.
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You're forgetting assists. Schweinsteiger has been involved (scoring or assisting) 10+ league goals for pretty much all his Bayern seasons. McCarthy has barely been near 5 as he doesn't look to get forward or pass forward as much as Schweinsteiger. The German is a much more complete player than McCarthy.
 
EFC78 said:
I disagree that he was bad last season. He was one of our better players but injuries prevented him from having a great season.

Who do you see as our best players then, as I think he is up there, especially in terms of importance to the team? I do take your point about him being over rated slightly though and world class is a ridiculous claim. I also think that those asking for more goals etc are being a bit deluded about what a defensive midfielder's role in the team is though. Does Matic get goals? He's by far the best defensive midfielder in the league. Schweinsteiger got 7 once for Bayern, and other than that the most he got was 5.
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I've got no problem with McCarthy's goal tally if he is playing as a sole defensive mid. His limited passing probably wouldn't be a problem either there. Last season though he played with Barry or with Besic added in as well, one of them should have done more and considering Barry can barely move it should have been McCarthy.

Best players? Coleman Baines Jagielka (I would have included Pienaar and Gibson if they were fit all season, I genuinely believe they are two of the most talented and consistent but just not in fitness anymore). The first three are among the league's top defenders and can (usually) maintain top end form over whole seasons. They can genuinely make claims for being in the top three in their position in the league (Jags less so but still a top player).

If McCarthy is playing box to box then he's nowhere near top in the prem, if he's playing DM whilst he's very good he's not in the same conversation as Matic, Carrick, Schneiderlin and maybe even Coquelin.

He's a good player but gets way too much hype for what he does and for me, considering we paid 13 mill for him, he is only just about doing what I would expect a player of that price to do. There are times I think we could have just bought Besic and saved ourselves 13 million for a player who is currently perhaps only slightly superior because of his prem experience. Given Gibsons and now Besic's injuries though it would be stupid to take a big bid. Before that I would have been tempted (nonwithstanding that you don't want to sell good players)
 
SpurtingLesbian said:
err... but that's a promise of a 5% pay rise every year.

what would you do if you didn't get it for two years and everyone else doing the same job as you got paid nearly double what you're getting.?
would you be annoyed
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That's in my contract though, not a promise from honest Bill and Bob.
 

regardless of people ranking him in terms of 'the rest of the league' i believe he is one of our best player. the first day of the transfer window i thought that we might have a problem keeping hold of 'Stones, McCarthy & Coleman' and they have all been linked with moves away. i'll be the first to admit then when we signed McCarthy i raised my eyebrows slightly at the fee, but is worth double that now. just goes to show that even though we don't have billions coming in from the owners (or even millions for that matter) we always seem to improve players in terms of ability and inevitably their price tag. McCarthy could easily go on to captain this beautiful club and thrive to be 'a great'. but this money situation has to be sorted. surely.
 
Layne said:
You're forgetting assists. Schweinsteiger has been involved (scoring or assisting) 10+ league goals for pretty much all his Bayern seasons. McCarthy has barely been near 5 as he doesn't look to get forward or pass forward as much as Schweinsteiger. The German is a much more complete player than McCarthy.
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I'm not doubting that Schweinsteiger has been the better player over his career, but stats aren't everything either.

http://eplreview.com/statistics-topassists.htm#EPL2014-15TopAssists

This has Chris Brunt on 9 assists with the likes of Ozil, Coutinho and Mata on 4 and 5. Doesn't make Brunt the better player.

McCarthy's game is about more than assists and goals. You don't get stats points for preventing goals with tracking back etc and sensing danger. I'd say McCarthy is up there with the best of them for doing that. That's just one aspect of his game where he is very good.
 
EFC78 said:
I'm not doubting that Schweinsteiger has been the better player over his career, but stats aren't everything either.

http://eplreview.com/statistics-topassists.htm#EPL2014-15TopAssists

This has Chris Brunt on 9 assists with the likes of Ozil, Coutinho and Mata on 4 and 5. Doesn't make Brunt the better player.

McCarthy's game is about more than assists and goals. You don't get stats points for preventing goals with tracking back etc and sensing danger. I'd say McCarthy is up there with the best of them for doing that. That's just one aspect of his game where he is very good.
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McCarthy's game is about everything besides assists and goals. That's why people say he's overrated. He's is DM and nothing more but people make out that he has so much more to his game. He's a great DM, times a tackle well, reads the game well and keeps it tidy. But people saying he's one of our best players and irreplaceable is ludicrous to me.
 
You can argue that he's not got all these other dimensions that make the 'complete' player, or something... but on his day he is vital to us and the way we set up - his engine gives freedom to the players in front to be unshackled and more attacking (whether or not they did this was another matter, last season...) when he has somebody disciplined (Barry 2013 edition) alongside to tighten things up.

For me, it's whoever is playing alongside him in our fav formation who can be less slow/crab-like (thinking Gibson when fit/Besic when more 'disciplined') and improve things in that way.
 

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