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Teachers' Strike!

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That's one of the supposed benefits of flipping the classroom, so rather than deliver a 'lecture' to the pupils during the day, and they do exercises via homework at night, they watch the lecture online at home, then go through exercises during class, where the teacher can then provide individual support.

If you reward a teacher with progression, aren't you then taking that teacher out of the classroom? I don't know that many head teachers actually teach much, as they're in what is essentially a management position (which they may well not be trained for either).

Yes, you are, but you improve the underlying system so that everything improves organically over time. So the cream rises to the top, but the personnel under them are better developed too. Everything goes up a notch.

What you've got to remember is that these very same teachers went through the same system to become teachers, so they inherently have the weaknesses the system promotes. For example, most teachers are weak at maths in Britain because the maths system in Britain they went through is weak.

So that's why it needs to organically change. Just offering teachers money to do their jobs better isn't going to work, because most don't have the ability to raise their game - despite the delusion that teachers are feckless and lazy, the vast majority work their arses off. They're the proverbial "dogs of war" who keep trying but don't have the tools to do the job.

So it's a generational improvement that is needed. The system needs to be adapted, not for instant results, but long term, so the next generation of teachers are starting on the right foot.

This starts from early intervention in childhood, detailed in the Allen Report, to encourage good learning and emotional practice from an early age, strong attachments, good frameworks, less red tape for teachers, an aim to teach the subject rather than tickbox the syllabus, performance development based on career progression, identifying strengths and weaknesses etc.

That's why I'm disagreeing with FLHD - yes, you can identify that teachers aren't at their most efficient, and it's easy to slate them for it, but you have to look at the tools they are given and the overall system that has allowed them to exist rather than just wave a bit of money at them in the hope they respond to it.
 
An example re: unsociable shift patterns, in fact 2......

1 family... 1 copper, 1 Int Care Nurse. Both work shifts and kids spend a lot of time at Elderly Grandmothers, sometimes theyre on same shifts so theyll sleep there all week, not that often but every now and then.

Diff family.... Both Coppers, On shifts. Kid spends a lot of time at after school clubs, now he's 11 its become 'home alone' as they'll only get home at 6pm. Sometimes at grandparents as both on nights, very often 1 is on nights on the friday & 1 working Sat, so for most of sat 1 is sleeping & he's effectively 'home alone,' not allowed out until parent wakes up. I suspect a lot of this is overtime tbh as nobody gets EVERY fri night/ sat day on their shift pattern.


Would there be different rules for those kids as their parents are 'key workers ?' I know for fact that the Holiday rules weren't adhered to in both cases, as they claimed that they could only get time off in term time at the same time. It enabled them to go to Florida/Disney much cheaper, now others that gave the same reasoning were turned down flat, they still went away like (1 went with them to disney) but the difference is that some were authorised and some weren't.
 
Slightly off topic, but not much. Re the maths problem Reidy had, came across that aswell, and facepalmed when I helped my lad with History revision; the syllabus covered stuff that happened when I was alive ffs!!
 
Do you think it's both fair & acceptable for a teacher who really makes a difference in the classroom & deliver excellent results, due to their hard work, commitment & dedication (& I'm sure most, if not all of us, have encountered teachers who fall into this category)....are earning the same, as those teachers who lack their drive & passion & deliver below average results? (& I'm equally sure that most of us, will have seen teachers who fall into this category also)

Surely over time, this would prove to be a massive frustration if you were in the former category?

Agree with this.

I had some great teachers who went the extra mile and would often go without lunch and would stay behind several hours after school to provide extra help for students. I had other teachers who didn't give a toss, put in embarrassingly little effort and several were downright obnoxious and one in particular was nothing more than a bully. In retrospect, as a student I just presumed that like in most other professions, the good teachers were paid more and the bad teachers were paid less.

It's not hard to distinguish between a teacher who really does go that extra mile and a teacher who doesn't care, and sure there are some in between. I can't for the life of me see why one shouldn't be allowed to be paid more than the other for doing pretty much the same job.
 
Agree with this.

I had some great teachers who went the extra mile and would often go without lunch and would stay behind several hours after school to provide extra help for students. I had other teachers who didn't give a toss, put in embarrassingly little effort and several were downright obnoxious and one in particular was nothing more than a bully. In retrospect, as a student I just presumed that like in most other professions, the good teachers were paid more and the bad teachers were paid less.

It's not hard to distinguish between a teacher who really does go that extra mile and a teacher who doesn't care, and sure there are some in between. I can't for the life of me see why one shouldn't be allowed to be paid more than the other for doing pretty much the same job.

You'd have to pretty stupid not to agree that the best deserve more money than the worst in any walk of life, so that's not what is really up for debate.

The issue is how do you actually avoid teachers like that existing in the educational system itself? Do you just offer financial incentive to improve at the end of the road, in the hope that teachers are just deliberately lacking motivation because of money - or do you improve the whole road a teacher undertakes when going into the profession to increase standards overall and give them meaningful, developmental reasons for being a better teacher?
 

I think the fact that the best teachers career paths automatically seems to take them out of the classroom is partially the issue here tbh. Maybe the pay scales should make it possible for great teacher to remain doing great work & being paid what they could earn by moving into a more administrative role?

As for the financial carrot not making bad teachers into good ones, maybe not, but as with any PRP plan, there always has to be a consequence for failure, otherwise they're useless. So it'd either expose them & result in ultimately their dismissal, or they'd be given the resource required to improve their performance to an acceptable level.

That's not a PRP plan though, that's a developmental review, which are already undertaken in schools - but need improving. That'd be part of the review of the system overhaul required and, indeed, is detailed in that Vorderman review earlier and in hundreds of other journals and articles.

Nobody is denying that poor teachers need to be weeded out, and effective systems need to be in place to do just that, but the emphasis should be on effective teacher training and development as well as a performance review technique that is based on ability, not pay.

In other words, enhancing the system the teachers are in so that they're in the best position to do their job.

You wouldn't believe how multi-faceted child development is. The efficiency of the teacher is just one strand of it, so you can sharpen that up and have the best system in the world aimed at net result teaching, but if the other strands are faulty then the whole thing crashes on its head. The whole thing needs a serious root and branch overhaul - from child protection, parental involvement, government practice, assessment techniques, secure attachment promotion, socio-cultural progression... the lot. We're lacklustre pretty much all round.
 
I'm no expert but the problem with the performance related pay, is how it's triggered.

How is it assessed?

If its against school performance, if I was a talented teacher at a 'lesser' more challenging school, I'd be encouraged to join a more 'successful' school.

If its against individual performance, that'll be tricky to measure and at the discretion of heads of departments, who have a budget they'd like to protect.
 
You'd have to pretty stupid not to agree that the best deserve more money than the worst in any walk of life, so that's not what is really up for debate.

The issue is how do you actually avoid teachers like that existing in the educational system itself? Do you just offer financial incentive to improve at the end of the road, in the hope that teachers are just deliberately lacking motivation because of money - or do you improve the whole road a teacher undertakes when going into the profession to increase standards overall and give them meaningful, developmental reasons for being a better teacher?

I think the only way to avoid them being in the educational system is to sack them for being ****, personally. For some, teaching isn't for them, and all the training in the world will not change that.

Unfortunately, I think we have a culture where we assume that all teachers deserve to be teachers, and therefore some really poor teachers get away with having a secure job because nobody would dare sack them.

I think we need to be more efficient at weeding out those who simply aren't good enough to be teachers and we need to have a pay structure that rewards those who do go the extra mile.
 
I'm no expert but the problem with the performance related pay, is how it's triggered.

How is it assessed?

If its against school performance, if I was a talented teacher at a 'lesser' more challenging school, I'd be encouraged to join a more 'successful' school.

If its against individual performance, that'll be tricky to measure and at the discretion of heads of departments, who have a budget they'd like to protect.

That's exactly the issue - all they can realistically and consistently use right now are exam scores, which is a flawed method for obvious reasons.

My view is that you'd assess performance by progression towards new qualifications whilst in the job. So you assess the teacher skill itself on a consistent basis, so there's no place to hide.
 

Starting to get worried here, I'm not sure if the thread title is "Teacher's Strike" or "Teachers, Strike!".

Those staple guns are pretty lethal tbh.


Lethal
$(KGrHqJ,!rgFDq-J6rrJBQ7CFIyKHQ~~60_35.JPG


One Arl Bag English Teacher had the aim of Phil Taylor with 1 of those, a lad lobbed it straight back & within 5 minutes the Head had broke both his fav. cane and some bones in the lads hand cos he hit him that hard.
 
Lethal
$(KGrHqJ,!rgFDq-J6rrJBQ7CFIyKHQ~~60_35.JPG


One Arl Bag English Teacher had the aim of Phil Taylor with 1 of those, a lad lobbed it straight back & within 5 minutes the Head had broke both his fav. cane and some bones in the lads hand cos he hit him that hard.

I got a Littlewoods catalogue lobbed at me once.

The teacher was actually busy reading the catalogue and got annoyed because we were talking.

#AllSaints4Life
 

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