Roberto Hongo
Player Valuation: £225k
There is zero connection between getting in a refs face and winning a football match.
Liverpool have won more trophies because they are better at football.
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Today's Football 2015 / 16
- Thread starter Azza
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There is zero connection between getting in a refs face and winning a football match.
Liverpool have won more trophies because they are better at football.
All the big teams are known as being "cheaters", so I fail to understand how you believe that.
Roberto Hongo
Player Valuation: £225k
Sorry, but I think all the big teams are known as being good.
Yeah, they are knowo for being good, and they never cheat, they're always good guys. Always playing fairly, never playing the ref, rolling around, waving imaginary cards and receiving dodgy penalties and the lot in return.
I mean, look at their players, obviously would never cheat in any way.
No, totally honest.
Penalty, by the way. How about the next one?
Foul, by the way.
Honesty and fair play.
Yup, none of the bigger teams ever cheat.
I can go on forever here, hopefully you get my point.
To win you need to do ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING to win. Good guys legitimately finish last in football. Be nasty, be mean, win games. Atletico are doing it right now - they're one of the nastiest teams around, yet are probably gonna play in the CL final. Do they have good players? Yes.
Also as to the players argument - do we have also technically great players - yes. Lukaku, Barkley, Stones, Baines, Deulofeu and Mirallas (when he's arsed/plays) would probably fit in most of the biggest teams around Europe, and play well. Do they keep on being good guys? All except Del (who does the occasional attempt to win a foul) and Mirallas (who is a bit of a tw@ in general) - yup. Where are we now? Bottom half, not competing for anything. Where are the most average Liverpool football team now consisting of random players and Jordan Henderson? EL semi final, could still finish top 5. Do they have all better players than us? Not even in the slightest. Do they have a fantastic (sadly) manager who makes them play and never stop and try to win at all costs? Yup, they do. Are they prepared to do it all, just for that win? Yup.
So keep on wanting to win like a gentleman, those days are long gone.
D
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It's an interesting view. Look at Leicester, I think player for player (apart from the obvious, Kante, Mahrez and Vardy) they are comparable with most bottom half teams in the Premier League. I don't think that it's neccessarily the best players that make the best teams. Real Madrid have always had a team full of superstars and in the past couple of decades, they haven't exactly dominated either domestically or in europe.
The best teams, in my humble opinion, are reflections of their manager. I don't think that we are "an honest team" in the way you paint us though. We've had our fair share of bookings for simulation and the Funes Mori tackle was as dirty as they come. I personally don't feel that our players lack the "will" to win, we have fighters but we lack in too many other area's to have had any sustained success. I would suggest it's a combination of poor tactics, poor man management and poor players. Just a few of the reasons why change is required from top to bottom.
No I agree, but in general we are always good guys - Neville (damn him) a few years ago even went as far as to tell a ref to not book an opposition player, and our current captains are always really nice people.
Mori got red carded for his tackle, that's probably a yellow at best if he played for United, Chelsea or even Liverpool. And it's a reflection on the player, not the team. Him, Joel and Besic look like they want to win and do well more than nearly everyone else. And I agree on the managers as well - Chelsea are nasty, but so was Mourinho, same for Atletico. Yet they win things. And Real stopped dominating around Pep's time, he was/is simply superior as a manager to anyone they've had, probably except Mourinho, and even he got beat quite often, but Barca were, and still are, known as massive snides.
And, with all due respect, Leicester are having a freak season, playing tactically amazing, in a similar way to Atletico actually, without being as dirty. That's the raw desire to win things, and it's something we lack. We don't lack absolutely all, obviously, but we lack the needed amount. I mean, in the last few months we looked arsed for a total of 45 minutes and have won one game - against Villa....
meanwhile in Copa LibertaDoggy action...
Roberto Hongo
Player Valuation: £225k
Yeah, they are knowo for being good, and they never cheat, they're always good guys. Always playing fairly, never playing the ref, rolling around, waving imaginary cards and receiving dodgy penalties and the lot in return.
I mean, look at their players, obviously would never cheat in any way.
No, totally honest.
Penalty, by the way. How about the next one?
Foul, by the way.
Honesty and fair play.
Yup, none of the bigger teams ever cheat.
I can go on forever here, hopefully you get my point.
To win you need to do ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING to win. Good guys legitimately finish last in football. Be nasty, be mean, win games. Atletico are doing it right now - they're one of the nastiest teams around, yet are probably gonna play in the CL final. Do they have good players? Yes.
Also as to the players argument - do we have also technically great players - yes. Lukaku, Barkley, Stones, Baines, Deulofeu and Mirallas (when he's arsed/plays) would probably fit in most of the biggest teams around Europe, and play well. Do they keep on being good guys? All except Del (who does the occasional attempt to win a foul) and Mirallas (who is a bit of a tw@ in general) - yup. Where are we now? Bottom half, not competing for anything. Where are the most average Liverpool football team now consisting of random players and Jordan Henderson? EL semi final, could still finish top 5. Do they have all better players than us? Not even in the slightest. Do they have a fantastic (sadly) manager who makes them play and never stop and try to win at all costs? Yup, they do. Are they prepared to do it all, just for that win? Yup.
So keep on wanting to win like a gentleman, those days are long gone.
Yeah Klopp hasn't given an average squad belief, confidence and a willingness to work hard.
That and being good at togger wins you games.
Not all this forza snide BS.
Next time they get a dodgy penalty, just like nearly every single time, are you going to be against it?
Every time you go "oh cmon ref never a penalty/foul/yellow/red" - do you think it just happens and it's not connected to them giving the ref an ear full at any opportunity?
Alright mate, keep dreamin'. x
Roberto Hongo
Player Valuation: £225k
Haha alright mate. Can't wait to see us flying up the table next season winning pens for fun, under Big Dunc with a midfield pairing of Besic and Cattermole.
Best example is Jags. Top defender but not a nasty bone in his body. Only about 12 yellows in 300 plus games.. (plus he times his tackles well).
Of course the RFM tackle was terrible, late, snidey, stupid - and cos we were 2-0 down and all over the place. A stupid thing to do but at least he looked like he gave a fk - just misplaced judgement though and didn't help the team in any wy.
We'd get nowhere with TwCattermole and Besic as they are both walking yellow cards..
Of course the RFM tackle was terrible, late, snidey, stupid - and cos we were 2-0 down and all over the place. A stupid thing to do but at least he looked like he gave a fk - just misplaced judgement though and didn't help the team in any wy.
We'd get nowhere with TwCattermole and Besic as they are both walking yellow cards..
Seem to recall Clattenburg putting a yellow away and issuing a red on the behest of his bestie Stevie-G...
Roberto Hongo
Player Valuation: £225k
Sorry fella I thought you were saying being snide wins you matches, I disagree.
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