6 + 2 Point Deductions

[Jokerdan]

By social good he means the advancement of the big teams particularly Liverpool and United. Everyone else outside the top 6 is virtually irrelevant, just find 14 cannon fodder teams each season to fill the fixtures and its job done.

That thought struck me when reading the old Telegraph (or was it the Grauniad?) article. Everton have been at the very forefront of 'social good' for years and are helping regenerate an abandoned and desolate area of the city which will have far reaching benefits for generations to come as well as currently providing jobs to thousands of local trades people.

And, to all intents and purposes, our expenditure in this respect has placed the Club into a position of dire jeopardy much of it due to reasons beyond our control.

Our neighbours, however, exert pressure on their immediate community by, essentially, buying up property and/or forcing people out of their homes to enable them to expand the infrastructure of their own stadium.

But, of course, this is the RS so every one looks the other way.

 

[Blue Smoke]

From what i can gather, we are going down the good causes route at goodison after the move as well arent we?

 

[MikeH72]

Sorry to disagree but I very much doubt that unless the appeal amends the sanction that any points will be returned or indeed the two charges ( which will probably be the last ones under the current rules ) won’t go through the current process.

Whilst I understand and agree with your view about the £19.5 million sum in the overall scheme of things not being that great the IC took the view that it was indeed that’s what they stats and interestingly consider the target to be nil meaning the sum exceeded was £124.5 million .

In terms of sporting advantage sorry on this one the IC don’t state there wasn’t any sporting advantage they state three things one that such sporting advantage can’t be quantified. Which yes in isolation could be read to mean there wasn’t any but elsewhere in the written reasons they state to exceed the £105 million limit by inference gives a sporting advantage over those clubs who have managed their finances “ more responsibly “
The third mention talks about such sporting advantage becoming an aggravating factor if such an overspend was cynical but the IC concluded that if that to treat it in such a way would in effect be double counting

I have said from day one this shouldn’t have been subject to a points deduction and still feel that is right but if you read the written reasons in detail it seems probable that :

1) Had Everton had admitted the charge from day one 2) Not advanced some bound to be discounted sums such as the claim re stadium interest 3) Filed expert witness re the transfer market that didn’t get amended during the commission put the relevance and validity of evidence into disrepute and to be honest seems that it was inherently full of flaws

Then it’s possible, no probable that the points deduction would have been reduced on mitigation.

How many points are your rotten club gonna be deducted do you think mate?

 

[RufusCat]

This delay is getting ridiculous to be fair.
Have the tribunal seen all the evidence and witnesses? How long does it then take to make a decision? There's only 3 members of the panel from what I recall and the hearing was held over 2-3 weeks ago.
What is going on? Has the decision been made and if so what is the delay? Is it political timing? Are the PL waiting for a good day to bury bad news or are they still trying to source safe houses for the panel members and Masters. He strikes me as someone who would glory in the attention if the panel upholds the original ridiculous decision.
Somebody somewhere must have an idea of where we are in the whole process and what the next stage is and when.

I think if the original decision had been fully upheld an announcement would have been made by now. It appears they are pondering the impact of any changes that have been made, and how best to word any announcement so that they are not seen as being unfair previously. Good luck with that.

 

[WestStandLower]

How many points are your rotten club gonna be deducted do you think mate?

That is the 64k$ question.

To be honest I am somewhat surprised that either the PL or the FA hasn’t charged us already but that suggests to me that the matters are far more complex than a PSR charge that or 1) the investigation is struggling to get confirmation from Chelsea’s records that will reach the burden of proof or 2) There are discussions on going re a settlement. If that’s so there will be significant mitigation

If we do get charged I would imagine that the charges will be more akin to incorrect submission of information and that probably would bring with it circa 10-15 points but as I pointed out the other day the most recent example of a club being charged and sanctioned for such a misdemeanour was Brighton who get a financial penalty largely mitigated because they self reported.

 

[UltraVires]

How much are they, mate?

I dunno, I just looked to buy one myself and realised nobody was selling them. I’ve not got the energy to look into making them myself, just wanna buy one and wear it to the game and maybe a London work trip as I pass near the PL HQ when I do go.

 

[linderoth]

Today is the day

 

[Victus]

 

[MACCA75]

That is the 64k$ question.

To be honest I am somewhat surprised that either the PL or the FA hasn’t charged us already but that suggests to me that the matters are far more complex than a PSR charge that or 1) the investigation is struggling to get confirmation from Chelsea’s records that will reach the burden of proof or 2) There are discussions on going re a settlement. If that’s so there will be significant mitigation

If we do get charged I would imagine that the charges will be more akin to incorrect submission of information and that probably would bring with it circa 10-15 points but as I pointed out the other day the most recent example of a club being charged and sanctioned for such a misdemeanour was Brighton who get a financial penalty largely mitigated because they self reported.

All the talk I’ve heard is that they will relegate you. Possibly into league 2.

 

[degsy]

Row brewing over Liverpool and Manchester United's involvement in Premier League chief executive search

Rivals of the two most successful teams in English football are concerned they had an 'unofficial veto' during recruitment process

www.telegraph.co.uk

This Masters bloke is a waaaaay bigger tosser than we all first thought

 

[knowing your history]

Is that officially how it's calculated? I haven't seen a source for it.

Regardless, we don't know what charge or charges have been made against Forest, nor our second charge.

In the official statement in November it actually did say if you're proven to have breached FFP it's -6 automatic deduction. Just like going into administration is -9 (-12 in the other leagues).

So I think that's going to be near impossible to get back given the club were charged with it, admitted the breach and it was proven by independent panel.

The extra four points on top....that needs to have been far more scrutinised so that's where this top KC comes in hopefully.

See what next week brings. Or even today.

 

[ToffeeTim]

In the official statement in November it actually did say if you're proven to have breached FFP it's -6 automatic deduction. Just like going into administration is -9 (-12 in the other leagues).

So I think that's going to be near impossible to get back given the club were charged with it, admitted the breach and it was proven by independent panel.

The extra four points on top....that needs to have been far more scrutinised so that's where this top KC comes in hopefully.

See what next week brings. Or even today.

The 6 points is not an official policy. There is no official, formal, sanction policy.

So I think it definitely can be challenged on appeal.

 

[MikeH72]

In the official statement in November it actually did say if you're proven to have breached FFP it's -6 automatic deduction. Just like going into administration is -9 (-12 in the other leagues).

So I think that's going to be near impossible to get back given the club were charged with it, admitted the breach and it was proven by independent panel.

The extra four points on top....that needs to have been far more scrutinised so that's where this top KC comes in hopefully.

See what next week brings. Or even today.

It’s not as simple as this though. If the mitigating factors are taken into consideration, which they should be, then we’re not even in breach.

 

[knowing your history]

The 6 points is not an official policy. There is no official, formal, sanction policy.

So I think it definitely can be challenged on appeal.

I guess Premier league are saying it has to start somewhere just as Administration became -10 at some point in the 90s? I'm not sure that was always the case as sometimes clubs like Maidstone and I think Aldershot went bust and just resigned from the league?

Only Portsmouth have ever gone into administration in the top flight for decades as with the money coming in it is near impossible but it happened to them and of course nearly the RS in 2010, think they were only a day or two away given Hicks and Gillett had run them into the ground.

When these new rules came in and charges started they should've communicated more clearly it would be a six point deduction if found guilty with then a sliding scale of increase penalty depending on the breaches. Unless as you say they just made it up on the spot which of course should be challenged....

 

[Cake]

Joe Thomas from the Echo at Brighton talking to Football Focus says the appeal was “essentially in the Court room.”

No it wasn’t you @&£”#%.

NNNYYAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRGGGHHH!