Andy Gray - Everton legend?

[blueblue]

To me the word legend is thrown around far too easily. Andy Gray was at our club for a relatively short period in his career and came at a time when many considered his best days as a player were gone.
As with Peter Reid is was the ingenuity of Howard Kendall who resurrected both careers
Gray was a great signing for us for a shortish while and was a big character in a dressing room of big characters.

A big influence in an important time in our history..yes, a legend...no.

West,Royle,Labone, Ball ,Kendall, Harvey,Southall,Reid, Ratcliffe and others besides imo are legends but not Andy Gray.

 

[squonk]

He was a player that contributed a good few goals for a season and a bit. He deserves credot for that. That credit was totally wiped out when he used Everton's managerial vacancy in 1998 to bump his own wage demands with Sky. Then he went into deficit by joining in with some frenzied mob attack on our current manager when he was struggling this season.

You can sugar coat his overall impact if you like, I'll just stick to weighing up all the facts - warts and all.

suggesting getting Lukaku more involved = joining a frenzied mob attack LOLZ

 

[Dario Terracotta]

He was a great player in a great team for us. Not sure about Legend. Unless you say they all where because of the success. As a pundit i was not too keen tbh.

I'd say any player who has contributed in a significant way to a success particularly a league title is deserving of legend status,then you have your Dixies,Labones,Ballys etc who are uber legends I suppose

 

[blue_aussie05]

He was a player that contributed a good few goals for a season and a bit. He deserves credot for that. That credit was totally wiped out when he used Everton's managerial vacancy in 1998 to bump his own wage demands with Sky. Then he went into deficit by joining in with some frenzied mob attack on our current manager when he was struggling this season.

You can sugar coat his overall impact if you like, I'll just stick to weighing up all the facts - warts and all.

I think the general consensus amongst every fan I know is that this is the case with Gray, but I've got no idea if this was actually true or not. I've not got any evidence to say he was definitely offered the job, or that he definitely wasn't.

It seems to be one of those club myths, similarly to what happened later that season between Kendall, who was appointed instead of Gray, and Gary Speed. No fan has any idea whether Kendall's account of why he sold Speed is true or not.

Just as an aside, if one of the stories doing the rounds about Speed's departure is true - that Kendall lied about Speed refusal to play, and then hung him out to dry - does this make Kendall any less of a cnut than Gray, for knowingly selling Speed down the river, leading to him getting abuse every time he returned to Goodison, if Speed had actually done nothing wrong?

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Was the final piece in the puzzle when he came here I think

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

His contribution has been overshadowed by his post Everton media work: using the club to bump a pay rise from Sky back in 1998, and then last season trying to unseat our manager.

He's a wrong un.

How is being critical of the manager trying to unseat him?

You complain when ex Kopite players like Aldridge are "on message" and are essentially club cheerleaders

You can't expect ex Everton players to be constantly banging the drum when there's legitimate critiscm that needs to be made

 

[blue_aussie05]

How is being critical of the manager trying to unseat him?

You complain when ex Kopite players like Aldridge are "on message" and are essentially club cheerleaders

You can't expect ex Everton players to be constantly banging the drum when there's legitimate critiscm that needs to be made

There's also a vast difference between Gray and Aldridge. Yes, both are former players for their respective clubs, but Aldridge is a local RS who supported them as a kid, whereas Gray isn't an Everton fan, and, as others have pointed out, was only with us for a season and a half anyway. Gray has no intrinsic loyalty to Everton, whereas Aldridge does for the RS

Anyway, I don't think Gray was trying to unseat the manager at all, just relaying justified criticism of his approach this season. It wasn't different to anything most fans on here were saying, if I remember rightly

 

[4737carlin]

How is being critical of the manager trying to unseat him?

You complain when ex Kopite players like Aldridge are "on message" and are essentially club cheerleaders

You can't expect ex Everton players to be constantly banging the drum when there's legitimate critiscm that needs to be made

Agree with this, as for Gray and Lukaku what came across to me was Gray seeing we had a problem and wanting Everton to correct it for the benefit of the club, something a lot of the fans also picked up on.
The media is full of idiots who are scared to say anything negative or go up against a manager in case it comes off bad for them, Gray deserved some credit there for saying on a wide public platform something that many of us would of like to say but don't have the reach that his article did.

 

[davek]

He questioned the manager this season as did a lot of fans and people in the media,and being a pundit I don't have a problem with that.
Nobody really knows if he was actually offered the job as manager and what really was said behind closed doors but I suppose you can dress things up to suit if you don't like somebody.
At the end of the day we are lucky to have lived through our greatest ever time supporting everton and Andy Gray was a big part of that.
You can pick holes and knock the man but I am so thankfull to have been a season ticket holder during them times and embrace everything about it

I dont knock his contribution during that period, I do question elevating him above and beyond others in that team as he was a bit part player in our glorious 80s spell. And post football career he's been a parasite on Everton and a pest in equal measure.

 

[davek]

suggesting getting Lukaku more involved = joining a frenzied mob attack LOLZ

Wasn't just that though was it?

Wading in with stuff about being 'too soft' and 'cant defend'.
He has a lot to say about the Everton managership for someone who turned his back on it.

 

[davek]

How is being critical of the manager trying to unseat him?

You complain when ex Kopite players like Aldridge are "on message" and are essentially club cheerleaders

You can't expect ex Everton players to be constantly banging the drum when there's legitimate critiscm that needs to be made

All about timing. And his stunk. He intervened for his own purposes not ours.

 

[davek]

I think the general consensus amongst every fan I know is that this is the case with Gray, but I've got no idea if this was actually true or not. I've not got any evidence to say he was definitely offered the job, or that he definitely wasn't.

It seems to be one of those club myths, similarly to what happened later that season between Kendall, who was appointed instead of Gray, and Gary Speed. No fan has any idea whether Kendall's account of why he sold Speed is true or not.

Just as an aside, if one of the stories doing the rounds about Speed's departure is true - that Kendall lied about Speed refusal to play, and then hung him out to dry - does this make Kendall any less of a cnut than Gray, for knowingly selling Speed down the river, leading to him getting abuse every time he returned to Goodison, if Speed had actually done nothing wrong?

Not urban myth mate. He applied and then walked away. http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football-gray-shocks-everton-by-rejecting-job-1257731.html

 

[blue_aussie05]

Not urban myth mate. He applied and then walked away. http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football-gray-shocks-everton-by-rejecting-job-1257731.html

OK mate. It was before the days of the internet, and I was in the States at the time who weren't interested in 'soccer' at the time, so missed all the hyperbole surrounding Kendall's appointment.

For the record, I never wanted Gray anyway. Would have preferred Bobby Robson at the time. Wasn't Johnson promising us a world class foreign manager? Then offers the job to Gray, then Kendall. Shambles...

 

[blue_aussie05]

@davek what's your take on why Gary Speed left the club?

 

[Khalekan]

There's also a vast difference between Gray and Aldridge. Yes, both are former players for their respective clubs, but Aldridge is a local RS who supported them as a kid, whereas Gray isn't an Everton fan, and, as others have pointed out, was only with us for a season and a half anyway. Gray has no intrinsic loyalty to Everton, whereas Aldridge does for the RS

Anyway, I don't think Gray was trying to unseat the manager at all, just relaying justified criticism of his approach this season. It wasn't different to anything most fans on here were saying, if I remember rightly

From what I recall of that article Andy was spot on.

Same with Kevin Ratcliffe whom was also lambasted on here for daring to say the King was buck nekkid during the Philosophyball crisis which held us back during our winter of discontent.

Boys like Andy and Ratters have earned the right to point out where they think we are going wrong.