2018/19 Cenk Tosun

[COYBL25]

Niasse and Tosun mate?
You're advocating the inclusion of Niasse whilst peddling the "Gylfi is cack" idea in the other thread?

Very bizarre for someone like you.

Whisper it quietly but I sense AGENDA

 

[evertonarntwe]

Based on what they have both done in an Everton shirt sure why not?

They have a similar ratio, they both have strengths, they both have weaknesses. Long term I would like to think Tosun is the better rounded player but based purely in appearances for Everton I feel like Niasse is more of a threat as I always get the feeling that he is going to make something happen.

I think both are useful players, is that so hard to believe?

what a ridiculous comment, by that logic jagielka is better than mina then based on what he's done in an everton shirt, mirallas is better than theo based on what he's done in an everton shirt

niasse is a threat, ive said that, he is a good finisher I've said that, but he's not a threat because he's good at football he's a threat because he's a nuisance, he brings mistakes out of defenders/goalies because he works hard, again not that that's a bad thing but that doesn't make him a good footy player either, he just works a lot harder than others to compensate for his obvious lack of talent

 

[blueblue]

what a ridiculous comment, by that logic jagielka is better than mina then based on what he's done in an everton shirt, mirallas is better than theo based on what he's done in an everton shirt

niasse is a threat, ive said that, he is a good finisher I've said that, but he's not a threat because he's good at football he's a threat because he's a nuisance, he brings mistakes out of defenders/goalies because he works hard, again not that that's a bad thing but that doesn't make him a good footy player either, he just works a lot harder than others to compensate for his obvious lack of talent

We have no idea yet what Minna will be like, we all hope for the best but with all foreign players it is a gamble.
If not for the world cup we would probably have paid no more than 15m for him. Hopefully he will be a star and if he does as well as Jagielka has done over the last decade I will consider it money well spent.

 

[Jags]

He was kept on the bench for half of his time here, in a really negative team. Since then he has played one game, where we were a man down for almost an hour, in a more attacking set up. He assisted the second goal.

He isn't an out and out goalscorer like Lukaku or Yakubu but his all round game is probably the best of any striker I have seen play for us (since 2004).

I back him to score 15 this year if he has 35+ starts, which is just fine

 

[Papa Shango]

what a ridiculous comment, by that logic jagielka is better than mina then based on what he's done in an everton shirt, mirallas is better than theo based on what he's done in an everton shirt

niasse is a threat, ive said that, he is a good finisher I've said that, but he's not a threat because he's good at football he's a threat because he's a nuisance, he brings mistakes out of defenders/goalies because he works hard, again not that that's a bad thing but that doesn't make him a good footy player either, he just works a lot harder than others to compensate for his obvious lack of talent

It's not a ridiculous statement at all as they are both playing at the same time and have produced similar results compared to your examples where you are comparing new players to those who did their best work for us years ago!

No, he is a good football player because he is a professional footballer who has scored goals everywhere he has played at all levels. This is not just down to being a nuisance and running about a bit and its no accident. He doesn't work any harder or less harder than anyone else, he is intelligent when pressing the ball and knows how to force a mistake out of players. You make your own luck. Equating just skill or "talent" to being good at football is pretty simplistic thinking. It's all about the end result at the end of the day isn't it? And Niasse delivers results (regardless of how he goes about it) which makes him, in my opinion, a good player.

I suppose it depends on what you judge a player on when deeming them to be good though?

 

[evertonarntwe]

I suppose it depends on what you judge a player on when deeming them to be good though?[/QUOTE]

being able to control or run with the ball being up there like, good technique helps

 

[Papa Shango]

It's not like he can't do either of those things though is it?

Everything helps to some extent! There are loads of things that can make a good footballer. Morgan Schnieiderlin for example is a very talented footballer in terms of his basics are sound. It takes more than just that though. I like having a player who has a more "unique" set of attributes to call on. Again doesn't make him a bad footballer, just a different one.

 

[widnesblue]

Watched the Wolves match in Turkey surrounded by Galatasary fans on Saturday. They were shocked he had a quiet game and was shocked he never got involved in the game. They were saying they was glad to see the back of him when he left Beskitas.

 

[Lanolin]

He was kept on the bench for half of his time here, in a really negative team. Since then he has played one game, where we were a man down for almost an hour, in a more attacking set up. He assisted the second goal.

He isn't an out and out goalscorer like Lukaku or Yakubu but his all round game is probably the best of any striker I have seen play for us (since 2004).

I back him to score 15 this year if he has 35+ starts, which is just fine

I actually disagree completely with that.

From what I've seen of him, he's the archetypal penalty box striker. He seems to do very very little in games in a general sense but when he gets chances he's pretty good at making them count. Don't get me wrong like, he's what I would normally call a 'good footballer' (in that he is technically proficient at most things and has no glaring weaknesses) but what about his game would you say elevates him above previous strikers? He reminds me most of Jelavic in that he's neat and tidy and will finish if you give him chances, but I think he's miles off being as good as Lukaku as an all round player because he lacks the speed and strength that makes Lukaku so dangerous. It's also worth remembering that Lukaku is a much better footballer than people give him credit for, as well as his direct assists (he got 9 for United last year) he creates a lot of goals for others with his movement - see Belgium's winning goal in the WC quarter final for a great example.

None of that is intended as a criticism of Tosun by the way. I like him and I agree that scoring 15 goals would be excellent, I just don't think I've seen anything to suggest he's got much more to his game than being a danger round the box.

 

[carolinablue232]

Good enough for me for now

Top teams have a world class striker and he ain’t one but we’ll have to get lucky to find one again

I like Cenk but it does bother me when teams like Chelsea have 3 strikers that would all start for us. United, same. Arsenal with 2. Spurs have Kane. City have Jesus and Aguero. It’s just obviously the area we’re still lacking enough quality.

 

[toffeejack]

I like Cenk but it does bother me when teams like Chelsea have 3 strikers that would all start for us. United, same. Arsenal with 2. Spurs have Kane. City have Jesus and Aguero. It’s just obviously the area we’re still lacking enough quality.

And yet for some reason, half of our fan base wanted lukaku gone strangely enough.

I really like cenk too, but as you highlight if we want to really challenge he should probably be our second best striker at best.
Thankfully looking forward to next summer, we'd probably be looking at buying 2 or 3 starters max which means we could splash a massive wod of cash on a top striker should we attract one.

 

[Armaghtoffee]

Niasse should never start a game.

No he shouldn’t but he has proven effective at getting something from a game that has is getting away from us.

For me, a valued squad member.

 

[Zatara]

Dont care what people say Jamie Vardy is twice the player.

Batshuyai, Bacca & Willian Jose would all be upgrades aswell.

Would love to ship both him and Calvert Lewin out. Lukaku would have bagged a hatful against that Wolves defence.

Vardy is too old...why even discuss him?
Bacca is on the way downhill...has been for 2 seasons
Jose...who knows
Bats is an awful player

 

[Jags]

I actually disagree completely with that.

From what I've seen of him, he's the archetypal penalty box striker. He seems to do very very little in games in a general sense but when he gets chances he's pretty good at making them count. Don't get me wrong like, he's what I would normally call a 'good footballer' (in that he is technically proficient at most things and has no glaring weaknesses) but what about his game would you say elevates him above previous strikers? He reminds me most of Jelavic in that he's neat and tidy and will finish if you give him chances, but I think he's miles off being as good as Lukaku as an all round player because he lacks the speed and strength that makes Lukaku so dangerous. It's also worth remembering that Lukaku is a much better footballer than people give him credit for, as well as his direct assists (he got 9 for United last year) he creates a lot of goals for others with his movement - see Belgium's winning goal in the WC quarter final for a great example.

None of that is intended as a criticism of Tosun by the way. I like him and I agree that scoring 15 goals would be excellent, I just don't think I've seen anything to suggest he's got much more to his game than being a danger round the box.

I think you may be right in that Lukaku is quicker and maybe has more intelligent movement (not maybe, he does), but if I was giving a ball to feet, with the striker's back to goal, I would back Tosun every time. I think this is his main strength, and it should be to the benefit of Richarlison and Walcott, who are both goalscoring wingers, rather than touchline hugging wingers or creative wingers.

Richarlison's second was a great example of this, held the ball just long enough to completely occupy the defender. If that was Lukaku it had bounced off of his shins and was a Wolves throw.

 

[Papa Shango]

And yet for some reason, half of our fan base wanted lukaku gone strangely enough.

Come on! No they didn't!

They may not have been massive fans of him but nobody actually wanted him gone in an ideal world.