Dyche out Moyes in.

[Drico]

Notice that the Wham fans are wondering whether they should have let him go now.

Maybe strategically we should get him in and watch West Ham sink below us again.

I am no advocate for Moyes - he did a good job for us for years before taking us as far as he could - but if he had won us a trophy we would have built him a statue. West Ham have delusions of grandeur. He won them a European pot and got spat out for his troubles. I'm all for ambition, but one wonders what they thought they could really achieve and if it wasn't a huge overstretch. Carlos Kickaball is certainly not proving as shiny and attractive now as he, apparently, was then...

 

[CielosGrises]

I am no advocate for Moyes - he did a good job for us for years before taking us as far as he could - but if he had won us a trophy we would have built him a statue. West Ham have delusions of grandeur. He won them a European pot and got spat out for his troubles. I'm all for ambition, but one wonders what they thought they could really achieve and if it wasn't a huge overstretch. Carlos Kickaball is certainly not proving as shiny and attractive now as he, apparently, was then...

Difficult to judge whether a club is under or over achieving - in both ours and Whams case - I reckon Moyes was just about overachieving - making him difficult to replace without an injection of revenue and a manager in the next tier.

 

[LEONARD]

 

[matty1878]

this thread needs binning with dunce
dyche

 

[Rita_Poon]

Moyes Moyes Moyes

Imagine the HT shows...

 

[Mercedes]

Can't get any worse!!

 

[Bedfordblue]

Not interesting at all. I just feel like the first couple of seasons he was just getting his feet under the table. It really started to become 'his' team by that point. Some of the key figures for that season being Yobo, Martyn, Cahill and Bent - all Moyes signings.

For me, that's when his work was just starting to bear fruit. Was 11th our lowest place finish under him after that season?

Correct

Since 01/02 Ave pos 8th
Since 02/03 (1st full season?) Ave pos 7th
Since 04/05 (highest placing and ignoring his worst during his 2nd full season) Ave 6th
Since 03/04 (inc the 17th place you discount) Ave = 7th.
For me I think it’s a reasonable assessment to say his ave league position was 7th during his tenure, but of course some people will choose to find a reason to discount some seasons.

 

[John from Bootle]

Correct

Since 01/02 Ave pos 8th
Since 02/03 (1st full season?) Ave pos 7th
Since 04/05 (highest placing and ignoring his worst during his 2nd full season) Ave 6th
Since 03/04 (inc the 17th place you discount) Ave = 7th.
For me I think it’s a reasonable assessment to say his ave league position was 7th during his tenure, but of course some people will choose to find a reason to discount some seasons.

I mean the numbers can't lie. If 7th was his average position then that's what it was.

There's always context though, and trajectory.

 

[JP5]

Stop trying to crawl back into the womb folks, he was here then he left, he moved on and so should we. Plenty of decent managers out there, the likes of Southampton, Wolves, Brighton etc. seem to find football minded managers almost every single time?

Wolves.

 

[Bedfordblue]

I mean the numbers can't lie. If 7th was his average position then that's what it was.

There's always context though, and trajectory.

So my original point was he averaged a league position corresponding with his wage spend, however having just checked i was wrong, his average wage spend was 10th in the league so on that point strictly speaking he did out perform for the squad wage bill (NB this excludes manager wages - for a fair bit of his tenure he was the highest earner but I don’t have that data)

Season	Wage bill position	League position
01/02	13	15
02/03	14	7
03/04	10	17
04/05	10	4
05/06	11	11
06/07	9	6
07/08	11	5
08/09	11	5
09/10	8	8
10/11	9	7
11/12	10	7
12/13	10	6

Personally I still don’t buy the paupers act though, yes his squads outperformed their wages (contrary to my initial belief) but the narrative was we were the leagues skintest club, when we were not.
Yes, someone with throw some figures in about transfers and I’ll acknowledge he found some gems at low fees, (as well as a few stinkers) but that opens up a debate about squad values that i cba with today . Ie just because he paid £1.5m for Cahill doesn’t mean he didn't have an attacking midfielder worth considerably more.
As for trajectory, i get where you are coming from but i think he took us as far as he could and had a self imposed glass ceiling simply due to his personality, outlook and tactics.

---

 

[John from Bootle]

So my original point was he averaged a league position corresponding with his wage spend, however having just checked i was wrong, his average wage spend was 10th in the league so on that point strictly speaking he did out perform for the squad wage bill (NB this excludes manager wages - for a fair bit of his tenure he was the highest earner but I don’t have that data)

Season	Wage bill position	League position
01/02	13	15
02/03	14	7
03/04	10	17
04/05	10	4
05/06	11	11
06/07	9	6
07/08	11	5
08/09	11	5
09/10	8	8
10/11	9	7
11/12	10	7
12/13	10	6

Personally I still don’t buy the paupers act though, yes his squads outperformed their wages (contrary to my initial belief) but the narrative was we were the leagues skintest club, when we were not.
Yes, someone with throw some figures in about transfers and I’ll acknowledge he found some gems at low fees, (as well as a few stinkers) but that opens up a debate about squad values that i cba with today . Ie just because he paid £1.5m for Cahill doesn’t mean he didn't have an attacking midfielder worth considerably more.
As for trajectory, i get where you are coming from but i think he took us as far as he could and had a self imposed glass ceiling simply due to his personality, outlook and tactics.

---

Again, there's a context to the wages thing though. That context is how much was spent on transfers. There's always a bit of 'deadwood' knocking around most squads, or certainly players who are down the pecking order. Moyes probably ended up having to keep more of those types around than some other clubs.