Everton Youth Teams Thread

[Raino85]

…I’ve been posting for a long time suggesting the problem is more likely to be recruitment than coaching & even then, I honestly think there’s a lack of talent because kids don’t play footy to the extent we did.

We read regular bashing of Unsworth for the blockage at U23 level, but we aren’t having a decent run in the FA Youth Cup at U18. It suggests to me the quality isn’t there.

The strategy of bringing in promising youngsters from elsewhere (Stones, DCL, Lookman, Holgate, Branthwaite et al) seems to be the way to go.

I was thinking moer on the 16/17 scale, and especially all over europe!
Were are the young irish kids that teams like Norwich seem to bring through every couple of years? Do we have people looking over there?
We did get burned with the 'buying 3 or 4 18 year olds' a couple of years ago with Bowler, Adineran, Foulds & Gibson! So i wonder if that is on our radar....looking at those lads, though that just looked like lazy scouting!

I go through Man Citys under 23s (i know it is Man City so far far easier to get these lads in) but they have signed Edozie from Milwall u18s, Delap from Derby u18s, Rogers from West Brom u18s, Bazunu from Shamrock Rovers, Gbadebo from Leicester u18s, Esbrand from West Ham u18s, Gomes fro m PSG youth, Lavia from Anderlecht, ....i can go on and on! Thats not inclusing the 2 Brazilian lads they have just signed.

As i said, as a kid, City coming in would be hard to turn down, as some kids also tend to treat them as how the U.S kids treat college football, its a great place to learn and get coached, and at the end you have a good selection of teams to go to at the end!
City obviously have the City group, which again, is an atractive proposition for kids, they already have a network of clubs willing to take these lads on loan to furthar there progression!
But surely a couple of very talented kids from all over the country world would think of us as an attractive proposition.

Last summer we saw a very talented Wigan youth team get pretty much tore apart by clubs like Leeds, Brighton & Spurs! Were we looking at these lads? Did we think they wern't better than what we had? Did we not have the budget to bring them in?

I saw a post earlier which sparked my thoughts on this, it was the one were Brighton said there target was 30% of first team minutes come from the academy.
What's our MO? Do we even have one? Or is it all just separate teams and a bit of a club for everyone to hang around?

 

[mightymoyes]

 

[Noble Savage]

Eggs , thoughts ?

 

[Eggs]

Eggs , thoughts ?

…a little surprised, @blueloon & others will know more.

Highly thought of 18months ago when around the first team, I thought his star had fallen last season. He’s decent but he’s quite small. I just think if we’re bringing a new RB in & keeping Coleman then giving John 2 years doesn’t make a lot of sense.

 

[Naylor56]

I’d take Martinez back best football we have played for years. He was given no money for defenders during his reign.

 

[mightymoyes]

I’d take Martinez back best football we have played for years. He was given no money for defenders during his reign.

think you're in the wrong thread but you clearly missed his last season, terrible, terrible football

 

[Nymzee]

I’d take Martinez back best football we have played for years. He was given no money for defenders during his reign.

He spent £110m pre-Moshiri when we were skint.

He had money to sign defenders.

 

[davids]

I was thinking moer on the 16/17 scale, and especially all over europe!
Were are the young irish kids that teams like Norwich seem to bring through every couple of years? Do we have people looking over there?
We did get burned with the 'buying 3 or 4 18 year olds' a couple of years ago with Bowler, Adineran, Foulds & Gibson! So i wonder if that is on our radar....looking at those lads, though that just looked like lazy scouting!

I go through Man Citys under 23s (i know it is Man City so far far easier to get these lads in) but they have signed Edozie from Milwall u18s, Delap from Derby u18s, Rogers from West Brom u18s, Bazunu from Shamrock Rovers, Gbadebo from Leicester u18s, Esbrand from West Ham u18s, Gomes fro m PSG youth, Lavia from Anderlecht, ....i can go on and on! Thats not inclusing the 2 Brazilian lads they have just signed.

As i said, as a kid, City coming in would be hard to turn down, as some kids also tend to treat them as how the U.S kids treat college football, its a great place to learn and get coached, and at the end you have a good selection of teams to go to at the end!
City obviously have the City group, which again, is an atractive proposition for kids, they already have a network of clubs willing to take these lads on loan to furthar there progression!
But surely a couple of very talented kids from all over the country world would think of us as an attractive proposition.

Last summer we saw a very talented Wigan youth team get pretty much tore apart by clubs like Leeds, Brighton & Spurs! Were we looking at these lads? Did we think they wern't better than what we had? Did we not have the budget to bring them in?

I saw a post earlier which sparked my thoughts on this, it was the one were Brighton said there target was 30% of first team minutes come from the academy.
What's our MO? Do we even have one? Or is it all just separate teams and a bit of a club for everyone to hang around?

Brands doesn't appear to have put any clear strategy in place.

 

[catcherintherye]

…I’ve been posting for a long time suggesting the problem is more likely to be recruitment than coaching & even then, I honestly think there’s a lack of talent because kids don’t play footy to the extent we did.

We read regular bashing of Unsworth for the blockage at U23 level, but we aren’t having a decent run in the FA Youth Cup at U18. It suggests to me the quality isn’t there.

The strategy of bringing in promising youngsters from elsewhere (Stones, DCL, Lookman, Holgate, Branthwaite et al) seems to be the way to go.

I do wonder if areas like Liverpool have also been hit a bit more than others as well, which were once absolute football hotbeds have been hit more by the decline than other areas? You still get a lot of players, but maybe not as much to the same degree as younger people gravitate towards their computers.

I say this having looked at Scotland the other night and thought of the outstanding footballers they brought through over the years. Over quite a close period of time you have Law, Gray, Dalglish, Mccoist, Sharp etc. Seems to be a lot less of it in Glasgow as well and you wonder if the next generation of football players are not as disproportionately skewed towards working class areas (which is a real shame). The game has undoubtedly became more commodifed and gentrified over the last 3 years and that might be one consequence.

I know I have touched on recruitment and coaching before, and I think overall we do pretty well but we probably don't view the type of player we need well enough. There always seems to be a big focus on how many players are making a living from the game etc, which is obviously a great positive but adds very little value to the club as you get very little money for players going below the championship. I see sides in Europe who generally do well at selling players on seem to focus on the sorts of players the top teams are after- big, powerful and quick. I'm not sure if there's enough focus on that from an academy standpoint. A real desire to push those players who have the above unique combination if that makes sense?

 

[Eggs]

I do wonder if areas like Liverpool have also been hit a bit more than others as well, which were once absolute football hotbeds have been hit more by the decline than other areas? You still get a lot of players, but maybe not as much to the same degree as younger people gravitate towards their computers.

I say this having looked at Scotland the other night and thought of the outstanding footballers they brought through over the years. Over quite a close period of time you have Law, Gray, Dalglish, Mccoist, Sharp etc. Seems to be a lot less of it in Glasgow as well and you wonder if the next generation of football players are not as disproportionately skewed towards working class areas (which is a real shame). The game has undoubtedly became more commodifed and gentrified over the last 3 years and that might be one consequence.

I know I have touched on recruitment and coaching before, and I think overall we do pretty well but we probably don't view the type of player we need well enough. There always seems to be a big focus on how many players are making a living from the game etc, which is obviously a great positive but adds very little value to the club as you get very little money for players going below the championship. I see sides in Europe who generally do well at selling players on seem to focus on the sorts of players the top teams are after- big, powerful and quick. I'm not sure if there's enough focus on that from an academy standpoint. A real desire to push those players who have the above unique combination if that makes sense?

…I’m sure working class areas have been hardest hit for the reasons you mention. Kids in those areas played street footy but you rarely see that these days.

Enjoying yourselves and honing your skills without realising. Kids now are selected for Academies at 8 and train a few times per week. I don’t think school football is as organised and meaningful as it was.

 

[blueloon]

…a little surprised, @blueloon & others will know more.

Highly thought of 18months ago when around the first team, I thought his star had fallen last season. He’s decent but he’s quite small. I just think if we’re bringing a new RB in & keeping Coleman then giving John 2 years doesn’t make a lot of sense.

Kyle John is decent enough at U23s and there’s been some good clips of him when training with the first team, agree with you though , if we’re looking to bring in a RB it’s hard to see John getting first team game time so I expect a loan next season is planned . The comparison I would make is that he’s not as good defensively as Kenny at the same age, but faster when attacking. And hard on his heels at RB is Matthew Mallon in the u18s and a year behind him the very promising Roman Quintyne.
Having said that about the youngsters coming behind him , John is only 20 . The likes of Pennington and Garbutt have tainted people’s views , we can’t hoof every youngster who hasn’t made the first team out the door at 20 , so while I’m not convinced he’s first team material I think two years taking him to 22 is not unreasonable.

 

[catcherintherye]

…I’m sure working class areas have been hardest hit for the reasons you mention. Kids in those areas played street footy but you rarely see that these days.

Enjoying yourselves and honing your skills without realising. Kids now are selected for Academies at 8 and train a few times per week. I don’t think school football is as organised and meaningful as it was.

Yes and yes really.

The sort of spaces where kids would play has become increasingly sanitised too. A mixture of ASBO's and the like being dolled out for kids playing football allied to areas insisting no football allowed, greater car usage and the selling off of brownfield green sites have his areas very hard.

School fields have also been sold off, and as a former teacher the schools that working class kids tend to go to are disproportionately affected by the cuts so will sell off more facilities. They will also be in special measures more, so it means less time to play sport (as they are forced to catch up more) and teachers who may have volunteered to take sports to take sports teams are now more likely to have to be funnelled towards academic initiatives.

Whereas football in more middle class areas may have actually grown over recent years and their availability to teams may have also. It costs more and more to run a local football club, which are mostly self funded so you get more of them in more suburban areas.

I can't help but think this has impacted placed like Liverpool/Manchester more.

I remember when I was a kid, the local team a year above me in our town were really good (best in the county) and one year the county got to the national semi finals. The 3 other teams left were London Boys, Manchester Boys and Liverpool boys alongside my county. My dad said basically every year it was Liverpool, Manchester, London and 1 other so it was a great achievement to get to the semi finals. I do wonder if that has changed a bit now.

 

[Eggs]

Yes and yes really.

The sort of spaces where kids would play has become increasingly sanitised too. A mixture of ASBO's and the like being dolled out for kids playing football allied to areas insisting no football allowed, greater car usage and the selling off of brownfield green sites have his areas very hard.

School fields have also been sold off, and as a former teacher the schools that working class kids tend to go to are disproportionately affected by the cuts so will sell off more facilities. They will also be in special measures more, so it means less time to play sport (as they are forced to catch up more) and teachers who may have volunteered to take sports to take sports teams are now more likely to have to be funnelled towards academic initiatives.

Whereas football in more middle class areas may have actually grown over recent years and their availability to teams may have also. It costs more and more to run a local football club, which are mostly self funded so you get more of them in more suburban areas.

I can't help but think this has impacted placed like Liverpool/Manchester more.

I remember when I was a kid, the local team a year above me in our town were really good (best in the county) and one year the county got to the national semi finals. The 3 other teams left were London Boys, Manchester Boys and Liverpool boys alongside my county. My dad said basically every year it was Liverpool, Manchester, London and 1 other so it was a great achievement to get to the semi finals. I do wonder if that has changed a bit now.

…London Boys tended to be a representative team not involved in the National trophy. They did play annually against Liverpool Boys at Goodison or Anfield (I played against Ray Wilkins and a few other future professionals at Anfield), but I’m not aware that fixture is played any more.

 

[riddick]

Whatever happened with Smalls? Isn't he out of contract now?

 

[Raino85]

I do wonder if areas like Liverpool have also been hit a bit more than others as well, which were once absolute football hotbeds have been hit more by the decline than other areas? You still get a lot of players, but maybe not as much to the same degree as younger people gravitate towards their computers.

I say this having looked at Scotland the other night and thought of the outstanding footballers they brought through over the years. Over quite a close period of time you have Law, Gray, Dalglish, Mccoist, Sharp etc. Seems to be a lot less of it in Glasgow as well and you wonder if the next generation of football players are not as disproportionately skewed towards working class areas (which is a real shame). The game has undoubtedly became more commodifed and gentrified over the last 3 years and that might be one consequence.

I know I have touched on recruitment and coaching before, and I think overall we do pretty well but we probably don't view the type of player we need well enough. There always seems to be a big focus on how many players are making a living from the game etc, which is obviously a great positive but adds very little value to the club as you get very little money for players going below the championship. I see sides in Europe who generally do well at selling players on seem to focus on the sorts of players the top teams are after- big, powerful and quick. I'm not sure if there's enough focus on that from an academy standpoint. A real desire to push those players who have the above unique combination if that makes sense?

I would agree with that to a certain degree with certain city's, particularly Liverpool & Glasgow, but I wouldn't say working class kids are missing out.

You just have to look at the amount of kids coming through from south London right now, there is an absolute glut of them! There are also a lot of working class kids from Yorkshire currently in the England side! There are also alot of talented kids coming through from Manchester right now, with Foden being the spearhead of that!

Is it a citys attitude? culture? Liverpool is a bubble, and compared to others very closed to the outside world, and sometimes that can be stifling, its not cool to be ambitious in Liverpool, its not cool to be ambitious in Glasgow! I've also gone down the 'make up' and ethnicity of the majority of people from round here in this post before so wont go deep into it again