Michael Bazel Betschart
Player Valuation: £750k
How About the total wages since 02/03?
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Exactly Michael. It's the wages more than the transfers you should be judging Moyes on.
Jags..class
Player Valuation: £70m
Spot on mate.
ijjysmith
Calm
While I understand that we rarely have any money to spend, part of my brain still judges Moyes on how the players we do have on the pitch, and how some of the performances wind me up.
Nothing to do with how much the players cost etc... More how sometimes it feels like the good players we have, don't perform against obviously weaker opposition. Now, that is down to the players and Moyes in my book.
Nothing to do with how much the players cost.
Nothing to do with how much the players cost etc... More how sometimes it feels like the good players we have, don't perform against obviously weaker opposition. Now, that is down to the players and Moyes in my book.
Nothing to do with how much the players cost.
Sylvain
Player Valuation: £1m
Yeah, but how many players were signed by Moyes on modest wages and then became top Premier League players under Moyes?
Cahill
Lesscott
Arteta
Jagielka
Baines
Pienaar and Fellaini have both had well deserved wage increases as well.
Michael Bazel Betschart
Player Valuation: £750k
It has nothing to do with Moyes, but that maybe explains why we can't do much transfer business.
But that's the point.
Transfers are inefficient, players can be got cheep or got way too expensive. But the wages are what a player is worth accoriding to the market, or he'll go and get more elsewhere. And the wages of a player coming up through the youth system, or nicked on a free will be as close to representing his market worth as those of a star 50 million striker.
See the way Arsenal spend a fortune scouting for young players and then paying them huge wages before selling them on. If you judge them purely on net transfer they're rich as hell, but most clubs spend much much more on wages then transfers.
If you want to judge a club's financial power and how good that team should be according to the market, look at their wage bill more than their net transfers.
And the thing is Moyes actually come out really well if you compare how high in the league we finish versus how much we pay our squad. We consistently get more from our players then we're paying them, relative to other PL teams. There's no need to harp on the misleading net spend, thing.
Partially agree.
When Seamus Coleman (£60k) is regarded as being more expensive then Michael Ballack (free but £10m signing on fee) then it is clearly insane.
But it is useful when comparing us to Stoke who have spent hugely on fees but whose wage bill is similar to ours. If Moyes is turning £6m signings into players worth £20m and Stoke are turning £6m players into players worth £3m then that can be seen through the net spend.
kenada_blue
Welcome to Barcelonaton FC
This.
And the players he has sold, with the expecting of Lescott and Rooney, have been fringe players or players not performing in an everton shirt.
If Moyes had Wigans Net Spend and wage structure would he be doing better than Martinez?
Just a point. Moyes has a big wage bill and has spent alot more money than the likes of Wigan having recieved massive transfer fees.
The reason I say this is because some fans use Martinez's low finishes with Wigan as a reason why he wouldnt be good enough for the job.
If we're going to give Moyes the benefit of the doubt with NET Spent surley we should give other managers credit who have spent considerably less than himself.
Just a point. Moyes has a big wage bill and has spent alot more money than the likes of Wigan having recieved massive transfer fees.
The reason I say this is because some fans use Martinez's low finishes with Wigan as a reason why he wouldnt be good enough for the job.
If we're going to give Moyes the benefit of the doubt with NET Spent surley we should give other managers credit who have spent considerably less than himself.
Let's not get this "we spend loads on wages" thing take off.
We spent £55m-60m on wages which is level with Stoke and Sunderland and £20m a year LESS than Villa, £35m less than Spurs and £60m less than 5 other clubs.
So there is far less of a gap between us and Wigan in our favour than between us and the clubs we are competing with.
Wigan spend roughly £40m on wages.
Yeah we're around 10th in terms of wages and finish around 7th.
Martinez is around 17th in terms of wages and finish around 17th. It's a much less impressive job.
And the variation in wages is much greater at the top.
Martinez is around 17th in terms of wages and finish around 17th. It's a much less impressive job.
And the variation in wages is much greater at the top.
Massive gap. Club stature being the main one.
Moyes can attract better players to Everton than Martinez can to Wigan, for one. Then there's also the fact that Everton probably have a much better scouting network than Wigan do.
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