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Farhad Moshiri

7+ Years On... Your Verdict On Farhad Moshiri

  • Pleased

    Votes: 111 7.9%

  • Disappointed

    Votes: 1,295 92.1%
  • Total voters
    1,406
Tree13 said:
Previous manager is given three years, runs squad into the ground by buying in dross, failing to replace players reaching the end of their careers and generally lowering the profile of the club.... New manager is judged a failure for not turning it all around in 15 games.

What kind of impatient, entitled fanbase behaves this way? I'll take your point re the league table being more concrete than Martinez-style happy-clappy PR-talk, but why are you judging Koeman after 15 games?

Koeman is still working with what is, bar FOUR players, the squad he inherited from Martinez. The four he signed are all upgrades in their respective positions. The manager is making progress and yes, I would love to see more progress too - but I'm not foolish and petulant enough to demand a new manager after FIFTEEN games just because we aren't fifth in a league that includes several of the planet's richest clubs.

Moshiri needs time. Koeman needs time. You were all happy to give Martinez two seasons (some people were happy giving him three!) but you expect the fallout of the Martinez era to be tidied away and cured completely in FIFTEEN games? I'll be polite and simply say you, and others like you, are being unrealistic.
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Not a fan of what he did to us overall but IMO Martinez made 3 excellent signings in Lukaku, Barry and Deulofeu (latter may not have fulfilled his potential but could have done) WAS looking at lowering the age profile of the club and brought through Stones, Ross, Galloway and Browning.

Agree with you about giving Koeman and Moshiri time though...
 
EFC78 said:
After previously not being too knee jerk about the summer transfer window, I now do feel that the evidence is there for all to see that we did not do what was necessary to ensure that we could realistically challenge for a top 6 finish which should have been achievable this season.

However, when you say get rid of the dead wood, what did you expect him to do? People on here seem to just focus on the starting 11, and forget that you actually need a squad over the course of the season. How could he have come in and in one transfer window, just get rid of a lot of our players and bring in enough suitable replacements?

That would have required us to spend way over £100m and the fact we came 11th would have meant the quality of players would barely have been better than what we've already got.

Assuming the dead wood are the older players, plus any that are unpopular on here, after already getting rid of Howard, Osman, Pienaar, Hibbert, we'd have got rid of over 10 players..

Barry
Jagielka
Baines
Gibson
Niasse
Kone
McGeady

That's 11, then people on here presumably wanted rid of..

McCarthy
Oviedo
Mirallas
Robles
Cleverley

So around 15/16 players. Who out of them did you want rid of and realistically how many did you think we could have replaced in one window and have improved the squad given we came 11th?
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Check our squad size for senior players over 21 compared to others in tgecleague mate, it is,massively bigger than both Chelsea and Liverpools one for example.

We overlook that fact and bemoan our squad but the problem is the quality not quantity of it, we need to bring in 5-6 quality additions and actually let about 10-12 go, even then we'd still actually have a squad on the large size.

For some reason we've ended up with a squad size big enough to compete in all 3 trophies and Europe, whilst after the first 11-14 (being generous) it's standard is championship level.

Look at how many players the rs shed the last few Windows, with the intention of getting rid of a bloated team of substandard squad players, we need to do similar.
 
EFC78 said:
After previously not being too knee jerk about the summer transfer window, I now do feel that the evidence is there for all to see that we did not do what was necessary to ensure that we could realistically challenge for a top 6 finish which should have been achievable this season.

However, when you say get rid of the dead wood, what did you expect him to do? People on here seem to just focus on the starting 11, and forget that you actually need a squad over the course of the season. How could he have come in and in one transfer window, just get rid of a lot of our players and bring in enough suitable replacements?

That would have required us to spend way over £100m and the fact we came 11th would have meant the quality of players would barely have been better than what we've already got.

Assuming the dead wood are the older players, plus any that are unpopular on here, after already getting rid of Howard, Osman, Pienaar, Hibbert, we'd have got rid of over 10 players..

Barry
Jagielka
Baines
Gibson
Niasse
Kone
McGeady

That's 11, then people on here presumably wanted rid of..

McCarthy
Oviedo
Mirallas
Robles
Cleverley

So around 15/16 players. Who out of them did you want rid of and realistically how many did you think we could have replaced in one window and have improved the squad given we came 11th?
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In answer to who we could lose instantly without even replacing and be no weaker

Gibson, niasse, Kone, cleverley, Oviedo, McCarthy and jagielka.

We have young lads who could do at least as well in the squad as those already.
 
Tree13 said:
The fact remains, we are doing better than we were this time last year.
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Tree13 said:
But sure, just look at the league table in complete isolation, see that we had three more points last year and conclude therefore that Martinez was better. Insightful stuff, pal.
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Don't think anyone is saying Martinez was better than Koeman, but when you state something as 'fact' to suit your argument when it is actually wrong, then people are going to pull you up on it.
 
bluestevon said:
Check our squad size for senior players over 21 compared to others in tgecleague mate, it is,massively bigger than both Chelsea and Liverpools one for example.

We overlook that fact and bemoan our squad but the problem is the quality not quantity of it, we need to bring in 5-6 quality additions and actually let about 10-12 go, even then we'd still actually have a squad on the large size.

For some reason we've ended up with a squad size big enough to compete in all 3 trophies and Europe, whilst after the first 11-14 (being generous) it's standard is championship level.

Look at how many players the rs shed the last few Windows, with the intention of getting rid of a bloated team of substandard squad players, we need to do similar.
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Fair points there. I do agree with the general sentiment of what you're both saying, I just think it would have been difficult for him to achieve over that one transfer window.

There are no excuses in this window in terms of strengthening in 2 or 3 key positions. And in the summer, both Moshiri, Koeman and to a lesser extent Walsh, need to make things happen.

In my opinion we need to get rid of the following:

Instantly: McGeady, Gibson, Kone, Niasse
Phase out over the next season: Jagielka, Baines, Cleverley, Oviedo, Barry
By next summer: McCarthy, Besic (if still injury prone), Mirallas

With Barry's age and Bolasie's injury, I think McCarthy and Mirallas will be needed in the squad for the time being.

There are certain youngsters who should be given a chance by Koeman immediately and they are Davies and Holgate primarily and he should be looking at bringing back Browning and Galloway over the season.
 

orly said:
Again, I wasn't. I don't think anyone would suggest I gave Martinez any real time at all, I saw him as the complete antithesis of what Everton should be appointing, Bill going for the cheapo option.

You've created yourself a strawman here. You're essentially ranting a bit mentally at yourself, and changing the argument as you go along.
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Care to address the crux of the argument? It hasn't changed, there are no strawmen and no-one is ranting here other than the anti-Koeman brigade.

Koeman has had 15 games to turn around three seasons' worth of mismanagement: is it reasonable to expect him to have made huge strides in that timeframe?
 
Tree13 said:
Care to address the crux of the argument? It hasn't changed, there are no strawmen and no-one is ranting here other than the anti-Koeman brigade.

Koeman has had 15 games to turn around three seasons' worth of mismanagement: is it reasonable to expect him to have made huge strides in that timeframe?
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Yes, he was employed to do so and has shown nothing has progressed whatsoever, should I have expected more, you're damn right I should. I've seen managers sacked for much less. Sometimes it just isn't meant to be and I get that feeling with Koeman.
 
Blue Cheese said:
Yes, he was employed to do so and has shown nothing has progressed whatsoever, should I have expected more, you're damn right I should. I've seen managers sacked for much less. Sometimes it just isn't meant to be and I get that feeling with Koeman.
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Fair play to you sir for stating your opinion. I don't agree with you, because I think the four summer signings are progress and because the previous manager would refuse to even acknowledge that there are problems to be solved, but at least you are answering the points rather than attacking the poster.

Which managers have you seen sacked after 15 games for being 9th in the league, btw?
 

Typical Everton isn't it to be taken over by a billionaire after looking for a new owner for 15 years, only to see him continue our sell to buy policy and get a new 'superstar' manager in who somehow succeeds in performing worse than the fella the club just paid 10m to be sacked.

Looking at some of the money that'd been wasted since Moshiri came on board (guesses here, but likely quite accurate):

- 5m compensation to Southampton for Koeman
- 8m to pay off Martinez
- 28m on Bolasie
- Committment to 6m a year for 3 years to Koeman (18m)
- 13m on Niasse
= 70-odd million, yet we're worse than we were under Martinez with no Niasse or Bolasie :lol: Classic.
 
Tree13 said:
Fair play to you sir for stating your opinion. I don't agree with you, because I think the four summer signings are progress and because the previous manager would refuse to even acknowledge that there are problems to be solved, but at least you are answering the points rather than attacking the poster.

Which managers have you seen sacked after 15 games for being 9th in the league, btw?
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As recently as Di Matteo(ok in bottom 3) last year, How many games was Jose given at Chelsea on his title defence? Moyes at Man U. It does happen not frequently but if its not working it's not working.

I feel he's getting let off because we are in 9th.

I could stomach it more if I could relate to the manager but he's so distant.
 
Tree13 said:
Right, so the squad hasn't seen any improvements? Who are Stek, Williams, Gana and Bolasie then?
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The squad has seen improvements, Gana and Williams, Stek might be better than Howard, but nothing in it between him and Robles, Bolaise has done okay, still too inconsistent, we'll see now if he has been an improvement on what we already had now Del looks like he is going to get a run - out.

Just my opinion, but I reckon in you original post "we are doing better than we were this time last year" was pointing more to than just adding a few players to the squad.
 

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