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Financial Fair Play investigation

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sbbefc said:
I think it would be a little more complicated than that.

If we start on - 9 then psychologically it's an up hill battle from the off. Completely different prospect.

There might be fines and we'll be restricted in our spending.

Players won't want to sign for us.
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Not saying I want the deduction but something like that and the perceived injustice of it, under Dyche, would galvanise the squad more than we've ever seen. Really instill that 'us against them' mentality. I don't think it would be the death sentence some appear to believe.
 
hallamblue said:
Theoretically they weren't trying to destroy the Premier League. They wanted to stay in it and play in a new European Competition as well.
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You can perhaps see why as well when you look at the utter state of the champions league format from next (?) year onwards.
 
Walken said:
Fabio Patrici banned from footy, can other teams now claim Spurs had an unfair advantage and cost them money
euro qualification etc? You can extrapolate these sort of claims any which way you want, there is no way to accurately quantify damages.
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There's all sorts going on with alot of clubs, that might save us... Or they might feel like they need to make an example of one... Us lol
 
Walken said:
Fabio Patrici banned from footy, can other teams now claim Spurs had an unfair advantage and cost them money
euro qualification etc? You can extrapolate these sort of claims any which way you want, there is no way to accurately quantify damages.
Click to expand...
Definitely confirms the Dele transfer was hugely fraudulent and should be reversed ASAP for the good of European football.
 

davek said:
I think that's sound analysis tbh.

How do you help a club continue down the path of getting itself back into financial balance by handing them a mountain to climb in order to avoid the drop and financial ruin?

Points deductions of any magnitude doesn't make sense to me. Any reasonable body of people see that and avoid making matters worse. Their task is to bring a wise judgement at the end of the proceedings. There's not much wisdom in making matters worse.

I've said before that context is the key to our case: the commssion might be looking at the 2021/22 season's financial figures, but they wont do that in isolation; they cant help but know that Everton have been fully co-operating with the PL - to the extent that we've reduced our own chances for the past 2 years of surviving due to massively curtailing our spending. They can see the trajectory in terms of losses that will result in the club coming back into line next year.

No judgement can ignore all those mitigating factors. It'd be a barmy decision to allow no context and I refuse to believe they wont take that on board.

Anything like a points deduction is OTT; and if that points deduction places us in financial peril you have to say WTF was the point of the whole process of PL guidance for the last 2 seasons if a commission then decides to sink you?
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Put as you have here we have a good case to avoid a points deduction.

We firstly need to avoid the drop this season and hope we don't get docked points next. If they did decide to apply a deduction I don't think it would be a token 3 points which would be my worry.

My other concern is that a decision not to go down the deduction route would lead to a transfer ban or fine being unnecessarily punitive to compensate and appease those pushing against us. Both have obvious implications for a squad in desperate need of reinforcement.

We just don't know. There seems to be a general consensus that there will be a punishment of some sort though and it's hard to argue against that. They have the options and they can do serious, and potentially fatal damage.

I'd like to think this is where the best corporate and financial lawyers earn their corn and we will put up the most rigourous defence. We have the arguments. The club have said they will contest robustly.

We have to accept the possibility of a points deduction or other serious punishment however if we have the best possible advocates arguing our case before the commission, then there is also the possibility of avoiding any severe sanctions.
 
I would suggest a sensible punishment would be 3 years Of:

transfers in (including all possible add ins exc sell on %ages) < transfers out (excluding all possible add ins)

And:
Wages in < wages out.
 
davek said:
I think that's sound analysis tbh.

How do you help a club continue down the path of getting itself back into financial balance by handing them a mountain to climb in order to avoid the drop and financial ruin?

Points deductions of any magnitude doesn't make sense to me. Any reasonable body of people see that and avoid making matters worse. Their task is to bring a wise judgement at the end of the proceedings. There's not much wisdom in making matters worse.

I've said before that context is the key to our case: the commssion might be looking at the 2021/22 season's financial figures, but they wont do that in isolation; they cant help but know that Everton have been fully co-operating with the PL - to the extent that we've reduced our own chances for the past 2 years of surviving due to massively curtailing our spending. They can see the trajectory in terms of losses that will result in the club coming back into line next year.

No judgement can ignore all those mitigating factors. It'd be a barmy decision to allow no context and I refuse to believe they wont take that on board.

Anything like a points deduction is OTT; and if that points deduction places us in financial peril you have to say WTF was the point of the whole process of PL guidance for the last 2 seasons if a commission then decides to sink you?
Click to expand...
Agree with all this. The rules are literally about sustainability so a punishment such as a massive fine or a points deduction that’s tantamount to relegation, that would *itself* turn a struggling but sustainable one into potentially an unsustainable one would surely be heavy handed and contradictory.

Seems to me that the really suitable punishment where a club has self inflicted financial trouble is formal transfer and spending restrictions. The rules are surely meant to prevent financial problems not make them far worse.
 

brieverton said:
Put as you have here we have a good case to avoid a points deduction.

We firstly need to avoid the drop this season and hope we don't get docked points next. If they did decide to apply a deduction I don't think it would be a token 3 points which would be my worry.

My other concern is that a decision not to go down the deduction route would lead to a transfer ban or fine being unnecessarily punitive to compensate and appease those pushing against us. Both have obvious implications for a squad in desperate need of reinforcement.

We just don't know. There seems to be a general consensus that there will be a punishment of some sort though and it's hard to argue against that. They have the options and they can do serious, and potentially fatal damage.

I'd like to think this is where the best corporate and financial lawyers earn their corn and we will put up the most rigourous defence. We have the arguments. The club have said they will contest robustly.

We have to accept the possibility of a points deduction or other serious punishment however if we have the best possible advocates arguing our case before the commission, then there is also the possibility of avoiding any severe sanctions.
Click to expand...
I'd take a window transfer ban, possibly two right now.

We can survive that with Dyche. If he can save us from over half a season gone and with all the off the pitch chaos hanging over the club he can certainly get us to safety again over 38 games with hopefully a new start at boardroom level and even ownership level.

We should in all fairness be getting a cash penalty...and that shouldn't be outrageous either given that the club have been working closely with the PL since even before all this kicked off last summer.
 
Tony’s Carp said:
Agree with all this. The rules are literally about sustainability so a punishment such as a massive fine or a points deduction that’s tantamount to relegation, that would *itself* turn a struggling but sustainable one into potentially an unsustainable one would surely be heavy handed and contradictory.

Seems to me that the really suitable punishment where a club has self inflicted financial trouble is formal transfer and spending restrictions. The rules are surely meant to prevent financial problems not make them far worse.
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Can I ask then, what is your take on the Football League and their deductions plus Business Plans for breaches?

Business Plans I guess can restore to a position of financial sanity but...

On the fine front they wanted to impose a £50m one on QPR in 2014 following promotion as get they tried to write off losses through a debt waiver. That was under their old fining system..

Their embargoes also seem to have no upper time limit, just until compliant again or until dispute settled. Think Blackburn or Nottingham Forest had restrictions- not ban but restrictions- for 18 months, ie what they could do and what they couldn't do.

Everton had they run up major losses in the Championship rather than the Premier League, then I expect would have been in serious bother.
 
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davek said:
I'd take a window transfer ban, possibly two right now.

We can survive that with Dyche. If he can save us from over half a season gone and with all the off the pitch chaos hanging over the club he can certainly get us to safety again over 38 games with hopefully a new start at boardroom level and even ownership level.

We should in all fairness be getting a cash penalty...and that shouldn't be outrageous either given that the club have been working closely with the PL since even before all this kicked off last summer.
Click to expand...
A transfer ban wouldnt do us as much harm as points deducted, even now we would be close to safe if Sean had the game Frank blew, even if it was 9 points, a full season of Dyche would see us 9 points better off anyway
 
davek said:
I'd take a window transfer ban, possibly two right now.

We can survive that with Dyche. If he can save us from over half a season gone and with all the off the pitch chaos hanging over the club he can certainly get us to safety again over 38 games with hopefully a new start at boardroom level and even ownership level.

We should in all fairness be getting a cash penalty...and that shouldn't be outrageous either given that the club have been working closely with the PL since even before all this kicked off last summer.
Click to expand...

That would be as good as relegating us. Squad is honking; would be a year older, some, I'd imagine, will be sold/released. And everyone else will have strengthened. We are treading water above the relegation zone as is.
 

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