Financial Fair Play investigation

[Damo_1878]

Indeed. Which clearly the PL did for the previous periods otherwise we would have been referred a long time ago. It’s a key point that no matter how stupid things looked last year, we were judged as compliant. No one can see how that’s possible, so clearly no one can say anything with certainty about this year either.

Would be pretty brave for them to change tack on what they deem acceptable adjustments, as we would/could have changed our operating model last year if we were already found guilty of a breach. They would have allowed us to dig a bigger hole by signing Maupay!

Only wrinkle on those is that if we stated last year we had effectively lost £xx million because we couldn’t sell Richy at the peak of his value, but then subsequently sold him for a very acceptable profit, it sort of scuppers our own calculations.

No one knows what the exact genuine allowable adjustments to go from accounting profit to P&S profit/loss, even ignoring the Covid stuff. As per yesterday, and the day before, only the final judgement will settle this.

Quite interesting that so many people seem to know exactly how we stand as they can exactly specify what we spent on WSL and youth teams etc over the last 4 years, but none of them got close with a forecast of the headline loss that would be published today. Funny that.

The Esk was out by £4 million

About the same we spend on Directors wages

 

[catcherintherye]

Indeed. Which clearly the PL did for the previous periods otherwise we would have been referred a long time ago. It’s a key point that no matter how stupid things looked last year, we were judged as compliant. No one can see how that’s possible, so clearly no one can say anything with certainty about this year either.

Would be pretty brave for them to change tack on what they deem acceptable adjustments, as we would/could have changed our operating model last year if we were already found guilty of a breach. They would have allowed us to dig a bigger hole by signing Maupay!

Only wrinkle on those is that if we stated last year we had effectively lost £xx million because we couldn’t sell Richy at the peak of his value, but then subsequently sold him for a very acceptable profit, it sort of scuppers our own calculations.

No one knows what the exact genuine allowable adjustments to go from accounting profit to P&S profit/loss, even ignoring the Covid stuff. As per yesterday, and the day before, only the final judgement will settle this.

Quite interesting that so many people seem to know exactly how we stand as they can exactly specify what we spent on WSL and youth teams etc over the last 4 years, but none of them got close with a forecast of the headline loss that would be published today. Funny that.

I agree with all of this.

Hes having a tantrum and behaving like a baby because someone is calmly, and politely pointing out his mistake.

 

[Brennan]

Why do you keep mentioning a crime?

I would say though it is highly unusual to state that one firm is your auditor and then get another firm to sign off on your accounts.

It isn’t really.

 

[The binman chronicles]

If the stadium costs are in there then it isn't too bad, if they are not then WTF we are in trouble.

 

[gwladysnight]

It isn’t really.

Of course, it is. The Guardian ran a piece stating that BDO were resigning as our auditors over concerns regarding Moshiri's ownership. Both the club and Moshiris made statements in October 2022 that BDO was still our auditors. That is almost half a year after the end of the 21/22 financial year.

For Crowe to sign off our 21/22 accounts after that statement is pretty remarkable.

 

[RomanReigns]

The lack of commercial progress is shocking

The board is so incompetent

 

[ToffeeTim]

We are far from the only club in this scenario, but our current profit and loss position seems to suggest we can only avoid an enormous and unsustainable loss, by making a big sale every season.

The figures on their own aren't that bad. Although I'm assuming the Richarlison sale is in there. Take that out and they are pretty woeful figures.

 

[Damo_1878]

The lack of commercial progress is shocking

The board is so incompetent

Hopefully a lot more people are now coming to that conclusion too

 

[ToffeeTim]

Of course, it is. The Guardian ran a piece stating that BDO were resigning as our auditors over concerns regarding Moshiri's ownership. Both the club and Moshiris made statements in October 2022 that BDO was still our auditors. That is almost half a year after the end of the 21/22 financial year.

For Crowe to sign off our 21/22 accounts after that statement is pretty remarkable.

Companies change their auditor all the time. Its not a big deal.

 

[gwladysnight]

We are far from the only club in this scenario, but our current profit and loss position seems to suggest we can only avoid an enormous and unsustainable loss, by making a big sale every season.

The figures on their own aren't that bad. Although I'm assuming the Richarlison sale is in there. Take that out and they are pretty woeful figures.

It's not just Richarlison. We also sold Digne and James. We made a £67m player trading profit yet still lost £45m. With Moshiri having to loan the Club another £70m after the last accounts.

 

[good times bad times]

Moshiri.

In law, Blue Heaven Holdings Limited in the Isle of Man is a 'legal person' that holds the shares

Farhad Moshiri is a 'natural person' that owns Blue Heaven Holdings Limited and/or through this owns Everton Football Club and/or group companies

Edit. This sort of arrangement is common for tax purposes

Natural persons pay 'capital gains taxes' whereas legal persons pay 'corporation taxes' etc

Stopped reading right there.

 

[catcherintherye]

Why do you keep mentioning a crime?

I would say though it is highly unusual to state that one firm is your auditor and then get another firm to sign off on your accounts.

Because the context of the discussion is around a charge that has been made. And has no relevance to that.

The circumstances may be unusual, but changing auditors is quite normal. Lots of businesses do it. The accounts were signed off by Accounting professionals.

 

[The binman chronicles]

The lack of commercial progress is shocking

The board is so incompetent

Generally you can only make real progress in this area when you are successful. Let's face it even if we had a competent board we are not going to pull in the kind of deals that would make it game changing. Perhaps we are leaving 5 or so million on the table and obviously everything helps but without USM we are still going to struggle.

We need to get a team on the pitch that the sponsors are going to want to put some money in to.

 

[gwladysnight]

Companies change their auditor all the time. Its not a big deal.

It isn't changing the auditors that is the problem. It is denying that BDO had resigned when they clearly had.

 

[catcherintherye]

It's not just Richarlison. We also sold Digne and James. We made a £67m player trading profit yet still lost £45m. With Moshiri having to loan the Club another £70m after the last accounts.

It's a mixture of board ineptitude, and football clubs in general being pretty awful businesses. I mean how many of them show anything resembling consistent profits?