Holgate Racially Abused By Firmino - The Guardian

[Yank]

RAWKS take on the matter

Quote from: surfer. [Poor language removed] you generator. on Today at 05:25:21 AM
He shoved Firmino into the crowd, if he got called a [Poor language removed] [Poor language removed] in return [Poor language removed] him.
He shoved a player into the crowd, what the hell. You don't need to see a guy land awkwardly as a result and snap his neck for you to start grasping the consequences of that action. Firmino's got off unhurt, still doesn't take away from the potential consequences of what Holgate did.
If Firmino did something unprovoked there's a discussion to be had but something's seriously off if you can assault a guy to provoke him, and then claim to be the injured party. If you start it, take whatever comes your way you [Poor language removed] coward.
Rabid animals, club needs to stop existing.


There's nothing bigger than your well being. A guy goes for that, unprovoked, anything goes. That's the big issue in a contact sport and you've got pages whining about the word response.
I have no take on what was said, haven't done repeated slo mo views but how exactly do you think a physical confrontation goes? A guy throws a punch at you and your brain stops and scans what response is ok and what is not honourable? Come on now.
You're going to go for the one that can cause most damage. Worst case, if Firmino called him a n****r he'll get fined, banned a few games but it's not something I'll hold against the player. Not when he was just assaulted.


They both look the same colour to me...
After watching the incident I doubt the referee wouldn’t have not heard it. Who knows... hope not though..


The ref was inches away when Holgate took offence at what Firmino said. Other players were very close also. Yet Holgate is the only one who reacts.
If Firmino had said anything bad he would have been dismissed there and then surely.
I think Holgate is a prick who should be retrospectively punished for deliberately pushing Firmino into the stand.
I think he probably misheard Firmino or is too thick to understand what was said to him.


As for the fact the initial incident could easily have lead to Firmino breaking his neck or leg or anything going over the hoardings like that, I think Holgate should get an extreme punishment.
I don't believe Firmino was using racial abuse, I think Holgate just played the race card to get away with the incident.


Oh I'm sure all the Everton players and staff will back Holgate. Disgrace of a club, and disgrace of a player. He could have broke the guys neck in what he did. And the Ref is a bottler not sending him off for it. In fact, If I was us as a club, my question is... What warrants dangerous play? Because that is a red card offence.


If it's a fake accusation for avoiding a sending off, Holgate should get a punishment equal to what Bobby or any other player could get for racism.


You can't just go around throwing the race card and accusations of racism unless you are absolutely sure that he said those words. Very strange that no one in the vicinity even flinched when he allegedly said n***ger. Deplorable to cry racism because foreign words sound racist, literally a week after a young black player discussed his brushes with racism. It belittles the topic when accusations can be thrown in circumstances like last night.



Agree with you 100 % , [Poor language removed] bags pulling stunts like this totally ruin it for the the actual genuine cases.



Yep, I think the ref may have done something had Holgate not complicated the situation. Which is why Holgate needs the book throwing at him.



If it is shown that Firmino did not use the N word as alleged then it is clear that the allegations Holgate made were made to avoid a red for violent conduct. He succeeded in not getting any card.

If I were the FA in such a situation Holgate should be banned for a very long time pay a lot in damages to Firmino for slander and Everton should apologise to Firmino.


This needs locking he never said anything racist and it's clear
Your all absolutely insane to be giving this the legs you're giving it

If Holgate has anything about him hell he'll come out today and say he got wrapped up in tje atmosphere and drop the allegations and make an undeserved apology to Firmino.

That guy needs to be banned from having an opinion, vote, or impact on anything that matters. Ever. I know I tried to play it cool, but that is just absolutely stupid what is being said their.

If a white or hispanic Everton player dropped the n bomb on someone, I'd be horrified. That guy is an embarrassment.

If Holgate was in the wrong, so many other ways to insult him, but two ways that will get people going are calling them son's of b's... because you're insulting their mother, so that's enough wrong right there for me. Call Holgate a bitch, not his mom, that's just not how you do it. Secondly, is racially insulting them. If Firmino did either of those two things he deserves the reaction. And again, if an Everton player behaved like that I wouldn't be defending him.

Amazing how tied up people get their identity with the sports team.

 

[ToffeeTim]

Have that lot ever accepted responsibility for anything they've done?

 

[Nymzee]

That guy needs to be banned from having an opinion, vote, or impact on anything that matters. Ever. I know I tried to play it cool, but that is just absolutely stupid what is being said their.

If a white or hispanic Everton player dropped the n bomb on someone, I'd be horrified. That guy is an embarrassment.

If Holgate was in the wrong, so many other ways to insult him, but two ways that will get people going are calling them son's of b's... because you're insulting their mother, so that's enough wrong right there for me. Call Holgate a bitch, not his mom, that's just not how you do it. Secondly, is racially insulting them. If Firmino did either of those two things he deserves the reaction. And again, if an Everton player behaved like that I wouldn't be defending him.

Amazing how tied up people get their identity with the sports team.

People are often fans before being humans.

 

[goodisonopheliac]

Typical Liverpool. I bet they're all defending him.

(And if, say, Mirallas called Sturridge or Mane the n-word, I wouldn't defend him.)

 

[longers]

Save the outrage until it’s been investigated chaps

 

[Walken]

...and you know exactly what was said?

misread who you were targeting, so i deleted it

 

[bluestevon]

The timing of Holgate’s rage is key to this. At the time I thought it was in relation to what was probably the Portuguese equivalent of hijo de puta, he definitely says puta that much is clear, but watching it again that isn’t what sets Mason off. Really struggle to understand Hispanic folk being racist towards black people, Firmino is closer in skin tone to Holgate than he is to say, McCarthy, and he wouldn’t racially abuse him (assuming he did say something).

Down to how different ethnic groups are perceived in South American mate, although are friends on RAWK seemed to think it was a SA term of endearment when Suarez said it to Evra.

As i said before - Suarez insulted Evra, same Suarez whose grandfather i believe is distinctly a coloured guy.

 

[goodisonopheliac]

Why Mirallas ? Firmino is not white , and why couldn't it be Sturridge or Mane that call Mirallas a racial slur?

Just a random example. Robles, then? Sandro? Williams? The new boy?

 

[Yank]

By the way, the Firmino runs up on him... totally laughable. Doesn't he realize him an his spin brace buddy at PSG won't intimidate anyone physically no matter how many tattoos they get? Both great footballers, but just unintimidating completely.

 

[TheFinnFan]

This would explain why Holgate seemed to get quite upset and angry when Firmino said something to him after Mason sent him flying into the stands (well in lad).
It was a weird thing to see on TV. Holgate walked off not arsed, Firmino came back and said something to him, Holgate got angry, put his hands on the ref (surprised Madley didn't book him) and had to be taken back and calmed down. Perhaps Madley heard something which is why he didn't book Holgate, but then surely he would have booked/sent off Firmino if it was racial abuse?

-------------------

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/jan/06/roberto-firmino-liverpool-everton-mason-holgate

The Football Association is expected to launch an investigation into allegations by the Everton defender Mason Holgate that he was racially abused by Roberto Firmino during Liverpool’s FA Cup win at Anfield.

Holgate clashed with the Liverpool forward after pushing him over the advertising hoardings in the first half of the home side’s 2-1 victory. Firmino reacted furiously and ran towards the Everton defender, who erupted after something was said by the Brazil international. Holgate had to be restrained by several team-mates and appeared to complain to the referee, Robert Madley, that a racist term had been used. The match official reported the allegation to the fourth official, Jon Moss, and spoke to the 21-year-old again after the game.

Holgate’s allegation is expected to be included in Madley’s match report, which will be submitted to the FA, who will then determine whether further action is necessary.

A Liverpool spokesperson said: “The club and the player will fully co-operate with the relevant authorities to ensure the facts are established in a thorough manner if deemed necessary or requested. While that process is ongoing we will not be making any further comment.”

Firmino was not asked to give a statement after the match but the FA will act if prompted by the match report. Sam Allardyce refused to comment on the incident but Everton’s director of football, Steve Walsh, was involved in discussions with the club’s media department after the Cup tie.

“I’m telling you nothing until whatever systems are used to find out exactly what happened or didn’t happen,” the Everton manager said. “I am here to talk about football not controversial incidents, because football is my life and anything outside the game has to be dealt with by the authorities. Even if I had or I hadn’t [spoken to Holgate] I wouldn’t tell anyone in this press conference. That is for others to deal with. I have left that with the director of football and told him to sort that one out.”

Jürgen Klopp admitted: “I heard about something but I can’t say anything so far. The fourth official said something to me. I never heard the words so I thought they were going to investigate the Holgate foul. That’s how I understood it at first. Then after the game the fourth official informed me but it wasn’t that I really got what it was about.”

Madley didnt book Holgate...wonder why is that?

 

[ToffeeTim]

There's also one of a red openly racially abusing Holgate directly. Mersey police are investigating. But it's not deserving of a link so I'm not going to.

Cretins.

 

[goodisonopheliac]

Isn't Suarez mixed-race too? Didn't stop him being a nasty little toerag.

Also, I don't think Firmino getting shoved into the stands is going to cause GBH, what the hell. I mean, he's not exactly a big guy. Maybe if he was the size of Neil Ruddock.

 

[Chimpy Glassman]

Get the t-shirts out redmen. Where's Dalglish when you need him?

 

[Blue 1]

RAWKS take on the matter

Quote from: surfer. [Poor language removed] you generator. on Today at 05:25:21 AM
He shoved Firmino into the crowd, if he got called a [Poor language removed] [Poor language removed] in return [Poor language removed] him.
He shoved a player into the crowd, what the hell. You don't need to see a guy land awkwardly as a result and snap his neck for you to start grasping the consequences of that action. Firmino's got off unhurt, still doesn't take away from the potential consequences of what Holgate did.
If Firmino did something unprovoked there's a discussion to be had but something's seriously off if you can assault a guy to provoke him, and then claim to be the injured party. If you start it, take whatever comes your way you [Poor language removed] coward.
Rabid animals, club needs to stop existing.


There's nothing bigger than your well being. A guy goes for that, unprovoked, anything goes. That's the big issue in a contact sport and you've got pages whining about the word response.
I have no take on what was said, haven't done repeated slo mo views but how exactly do you think a physical confrontation goes? A guy throws a punch at you and your brain stops and scans what response is ok and what is not honourable? Come on now.
You're going to go for the one that can cause most damage. Worst case, if Firmino called him a n****r he'll get fined, banned a few games but it's not something I'll hold against the player. Not when he was just assaulted.


They both look the same colour to me...
After watching the incident I doubt the referee wouldn’t have not heard it. Who knows... hope not though..


The ref was inches away when Holgate took offence at what Firmino said. Other players were very close also. Yet Holgate is the only one who reacts.
If Firmino had said anything bad he would have been dismissed there and then surely.
I think Holgate is a prick who should be retrospectively punished for deliberately pushing Firmino into the stand.
I think he probably misheard Firmino or is too thick to understand what was said to him.


As for the fact the initial incident could easily have lead to Firmino breaking his neck or leg or anything going over the hoardings like that, I think Holgate should get an extreme punishment.
I don't believe Firmino was using racial abuse, I think Holgate just played the race card to get away with the incident.


Oh I'm sure all the Everton players and staff will back Holgate. Disgrace of a club, and disgrace of a player. He could have broke the guys neck in what he did. And the Ref is a bottler not sending him off for it. In fact, If I was us as a club, my question is... What warrants dangerous play? Because that is a red card offence.


If it's a fake accusation for avoiding a sending off, Holgate should get a punishment equal to what Bobby or any other player could get for racism.


You can't just go around throwing the race card and accusations of racism unless you are absolutely sure that he said those words. Very strange that no one in the vicinity even flinched when he allegedly said n***ger. Deplorable to cry racism because foreign words sound racist, literally a week after a young black player discussed his brushes with racism. It belittles the topic when accusations can be thrown in circumstances like last night.



Agree with you 100 % , [Poor language removed] bags pulling stunts like this totally ruin it for the the actual genuine cases.



Yep, I think the ref may have done something had Holgate not complicated the situation. Which is why Holgate needs the book throwing at him.



If it is shown that Firmino did not use the N word as alleged then it is clear that the allegations Holgate made were made to avoid a red for violent conduct. He succeeded in not getting any card.

If I were the FA in such a situation Holgate should be banned for a very long time pay a lot in damages to Firmino for slander and Everton should apologise to Firmino.


This needs locking he never said anything racist and it's clear
Your all absolutely insane to be giving this the legs you're giving it

If Holgate has anything about him hell he'll come out today and say he got wrapped up in tje atmosphere and drop the allegations and make an undeserved apology to Firmino.

SOMEBODY COULD'VE BEEN KILLED!!!!

 

[Chimpy Glassman]

Typical Liverpool. I bet they're all defending him.

(And if, say, Mirallas called Sturridge or Mane the n-word, I wouldn't defend him.)

That's because they're a cult, pal.