It was 60 years ago today that.....

[Handball]

My other universally accepted theory is that you are really Oddball.

Hiding in plain sight. Love it.

What can I say.
Of all the witnesses in Dealey Plaza that day, they all said that 3 shots were fired. All of the acoustic evidence says there were 3 shots.
Nobody saw or says there was a shot from from a car following behind and the ballistic evidence shows that both shots that hit targets were from behind the parade in a straight line from the Book Depository.

 

[Handball]

The most depressing “alternative theory”, is that Oswald was just a bad shot.

Oswald’s wife consistently maintained that Connally was the true target, and there was something I read about an Oswald kill list found which had Connolly at the top, as well as Edwin Walker, who Oswald had attempted to assassinate 6 months prior.

One of the most consequential world events in modern history, caused as an accident by incompetence.

Oswald's wife and Brother were both certain of his guilt.
It was only years later when Marina was told that he 'might' have had links to the CIA and actually might have been framed that she changed her mind.

 

[Nightman]

What can I say.
Of all the witnesses in Dealey Plaza that day, they all said that 3 shots were fired. All of the acoustic evidence says there were 3 shots.
Nobody saw or says there was a shot from from a car following behind and the ballistic evidence shows that both shots that hit targets were from behind the parade in a straight line from the Book Depository.

Cheers for the info. All this talk makes me want to do a deep dive on it.

It's fascinating stuff.

 

[Handball]

Cheers for the info. All this talk makes me want to do a deep dive on it.

It's fascinating stuff.

Am I still Oddball or an 'oddball' or are we actually having a proper discussion about the issue?
I'll gab all day with you about it mate, I still have some real reservations about the whole thing, there are parts of it that give me cause for concern. But the theory of a gunshot coming from one of the Presidential parade cars from a CIA operative has been debunked.
I've read the Mortal Error book and there were things in it that rang true to me, BUT, eventually like most things surrounding the whole thing, it was both flawed and just didn't stand up to scrutiny.
Ultimately, had Oswald not been shot by Ruby and he'd stood trial, he would've been convicted on the evidence and all of the 'angles' and Machiavellian intrigue would be just anomalies in an open and shut case.

 

[Dixieslaces]

Been watching a some stuff recently, and I haven’t seen anything that makes me really lean towards a conspiracy. By which I mean, more than one shooter.

I used to be pretty convinced of a conspiracy here, but after learning a lot more about Oswald, and seeing forensic stuff, I’m probably a bit more Occam’s razor now.

What’s the single best piece of evidence in your eyes that points to a conspiracy? Not flaws in a commission (I’m sure there were), or other people who had a good motive (no doubt there were loads), but one genuine piece of evidence which points to a 2nd shooter?

So, it all starts around 1948, for me, with the "Box 13" Ballot stuffing to get LBJ into Senate and further down the line we get to Billy Sol Estes, Mac Wallace, start digging a bit here and look at his 5 year suspended sentence for murder, an unheard of occurence in Texas and Cofer who represented him and the the link to LBJ and Oil and Cotton.

Clint Peoples(investigator and his mysterious death) DH Byrd and the Suite 8F(group) and all in between.

Then look at Howard Pratt, Harold Eugene Orr and Henry Marshall and the startling similarities in their "deaths" and the links back to LBJ.

It may all seem tenuous, and this is deliberately so.

IMO, Oswald 100% was the fall guy for a complex Web of mis-direction and subterfuge.


7 Murders in all are inextricably linked to LBJ and Bobby Kennedy as AG was about to blow the lid on the whole complex issue, also look at why LBJ sister, Josefa was one of those on the list of 7.

What is also very interesting are the links with Sinatra and how he could have wound up dead by the Mob after he vouched for JFK to Giancana and Roselli because of hos relationship with Joe Kennedy, then got dumped on by the Kennedys and ended up playing gigs for the Mob for free whenever they chose?

And then look at what happened to Mac Wallace in 1971.

I now believe we may never uncover the whole truth, but there is no doubt in my mind through decades of trawling this subject that the one who benefitted the most out of it was LBJ. Try as he may to deflect, he left a trail and there were many who could have spoke out and even some who did that were "silenced"

I believe if JFK had done a second term, we would have been living in a very different world today.

It's only a conspiracy if there no facts to substantiate and there are so, so many facts that never get spoken about in this case.

To finish, I believe that either Wallace or a Mob linked hired gun, who's name escapes me were/are the other shooter/s.

 

[Dixieslaces]

They lost the brain somehow. Subsequent testing not possible.

This was later suggested to be in possession of the Kennedy family, then mysteriously disappeared. Some would say tastefully lost.

 

[Dixieslaces]

FBI fella in the car has said JFK got a bullet in the neck, (front) as well. No idea how credible that is mind.

This footage, may or may not display the possibility of the 2nd shooter?

 

[Dixieslaces]

Think the autopsy of an assassinated American president would probably count as out of the ordinary.

This is true


However protocols existed that weren't followed, statements altered, Dr encouraged to change opinions etc

 

[Runub]

I heard that he is still alive and lives in a bungalow with Elvis in Skegness

 

[Dixieslaces]

That's a theory from a book called 'Mortal Error' by Bonar Menninger and whilst it's a decent theory it's not only NOT universally accepted it doesn't fit with any objective evidence at all, either witness, ballistic or acoustic.
That theory was based on the Zapruder film being tampered with.

Yes. Time Magazine bought the footage but the chain of custody was never maintained amongst so many other critical items and there is much evidence to show it was tampered with.

 

[Rita_Poon]

I heard that he is still alive and lives in a bungalow with Elvis in Skegness

There's a pun in here along the lines of 'suspicious minds' or mind at least...

 

[Dixieslaces]

There's a pun in here along the lines of 'suspicious minds' or mind at least...

My 2 favourite subjects in one thread on GOT who'd have thunk it! Lol

 

[Dixieslaces]

For good reads, Mark Lanes book and updated version Rush to Judgement, The Men on the 6th Floor Mark Collom and Glen Sample and The Man Who Killed Kennedy by Roger Stone, from my biased perspective are good reads.

I think I'm on about my 80th book and it is a fascinating deep dive.

 

[Handball]

So, it all starts around 1948, for me, with the "Box 13" Ballot stuffing to get LBJ into Senate and further down the line we get to Billy Sol Estes, Mac Wallace, start digging a bit here and look at his 5 year suspended sentence for murder, an unheard of occurence in Texas and Cofer who represented him and the the link to LBJ and Oil and Cotton.

Clint Peoples(investigator and his mysterious death) DH Byrd and the Suite 8F(group) and all in between.

Then look at Howard Pratt, Harold Eugene Orr and Henry Marshall and the startling similarities in their "deaths" and the links back to LBJ.

It may all seem tenuous, and this is deliberately so.

IMO, Oswald 100% was the fall guy for a complex Web of mis-direction and subterfuge.


7 Murders in all are inextricably linked to LBJ and Bobby Kennedy as AG was about to blow the lid on the whole complex issue, also look at why LBJ sister, Josefa was one of those on the list of 7.

What is also very interesting are the links with Sinatra and how he could have wound up dead by the Mob after he vouched for JFK to Giancana and Roselli because of hos relationship with Joe Kennedy, then got dumped on by the Kennedys and ended up playing gigs for the Mob for free whenever they chose?

And then look at what happened to Mac Wallace in 1971.

I now believe we may never uncover the whole truth, but there is no doubt in my mind through decades of trawling this subject that the one who benefitted the most out of it was LBJ. Try as he may to deflect, he left a trail and there were many who could have spoke out and even some who did that were "silenced"

I believe if JFK had done a second term, we would have been living in a very different world today.

It's only a conspiracy if there no facts to substantiate and there are so, so many facts that never get spoken about in this case.

To finish, I believe that either Wallace or a Mob linked hired gun, who's name escapes me were/are the other shooter/s.

That's a fantastic reply mate and that's also why I still have reservations about the whole thing.
There are still elements of it that don't make sense or don't 'fit'.
BUT, IF we accept that Oswald was the shooter, which you probably don't, there's a whole load of 'chance' that puts him on the parade route.
And IF he's the shooter, why would a whole load of vested interests who wanted Kennedy dead put their faith in a no mark like Oswald with a vintage gun?
All objective evidence says that only 3 shots were fired.
All the witnesses say that they came from either behind or 'maybe' from the side on the Grassy Knoll.
Nobody says that shots came from 2 places.
Every single piece of forensic evidence says that the shots came from behind. There are no brain fragments or ballistics that show that anything came from the front.
If you look at the Zapruder film closely, Kennedy goes forward on impact from the headshot first and then backwards as the bullet goes through and then 'back and to the left'. The impact spray is all forwards.

 

[Amw79]

So, it all starts around 1948, for me, with the "Box 13" Ballot stuffing to get LBJ into Senate and further down the line we get to Billy Sol Estes, Mac Wallace, start digging a bit here and look at his 5 year suspended sentence for murder, an unheard of occurence in Texas and Cofer who represented him and the the link to LBJ and Oil and Cotton.

Clint Peoples(investigator and his mysterious death) DH Byrd and the Suite 8F(group) and all in between.

Then look at Howard Pratt, Harold Eugene Orr and Henry Marshall and the startling similarities in their "deaths" and the links back to LBJ.

It may all seem tenuous, and this is deliberately so.

IMO, Oswald 100% was the fall guy for a complex Web of mis-direction and subterfuge.


7 Murders in all are inextricably linked to LBJ and Bobby Kennedy as AG was about to blow the lid on the whole complex issue, also look at why LBJ sister, Josefa was one of those on the list of 7.

What is also very interesting are the links with Sinatra and how he could have wound up dead by the Mob after he vouched for JFK to Giancana and Roselli because of hos relationship with Joe Kennedy, then got dumped on by the Kennedys and ended up playing gigs for the Mob for free whenever they chose?

And then look at what happened to Mac Wallace in 1971.

I now believe we may never uncover the whole truth, but there is no doubt in my mind through decades of trawling this subject that the one who benefitted the most out of it was LBJ. Try as he may to deflect, he left a trail and there were many who could have spoke out and even some who did that were "silenced"

I believe if JFK had done a second term, we would have been living in a very different world today.

It's only a conspiracy if there no facts to substantiate and there are so, so many facts that never get spoken about in this case.

To finish, I believe that either Wallace or a Mob linked hired gun, who's name escapes me were/are the other shooter/s.

Appreciate the response DL, but honestly this is the type of stuff that I don’t find convincing. When asking for the single piece of evidence that you find most compelling, you’ve started with a narrative 15 years before the event, and mentioning other things nearly 10 years afterwards, and honestly, after decades studying it, I’d be wanting something more concrete. It could well all be true, but to me sounds like a story woven around a theory, rather than facts leading to a conclusion.

Some good recommendations though, so thanks for that, appreciate it.