Lions and donkeys: 10 big myths about World War One debunked

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What did the Black Hand Serbian nationalists want? Why did they assassinate FF in the first place?

What happened after WW1 and the map of Europe was re-drawn? Guess what? The break up of the Austro-Hungarian empire...and new country called...Serbia. They got what they wanted.

Lesson for future revolutionaries?
 
johnnydawg68 said:
What did the Black Hand Serbian nationalists want? Why did they assassinate FF in the first place?

What happened after WW1 and the map of Europe was re-drawn? Guess what? The break up of the Austro-Hungarian empire...and new country called...Serbia. They got what they wanted.

Lesson for future revolutionaries?
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What...

Serbia already existed. It spent most of the war under austrian occupation and lost loads of it's population.
 

johnnydawg68 said:
Not as an independent country they didn't.
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No they did, they won freedom from the ottomans in the first balkan war and then thrashed bulgaria in the second.

What the black hand wanted was to unite the slavic people in a single kingdom the way italy and germany had. And that did happen, they got bosnia and slovenia from austria after the war and joined up with montenegro to form yugoslavia.

But that was no different to the extra land given to france or italy and serbia paid a much hgiehr price for it.
 
Yep, I corrected myself. You're right about Serbia. I was thinking Yugoslavia, so the point remains, I just made it badly.
 
johnnydawg68 said:
Yep, I corrected myself. You're right about Serbia. I was thinking Yugoslavia, so the point remains, I just made it badly.
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Yeah, sorry didn't see the correction.

I'm far from convinced that the ultimate lesson learned of ww1 is violence is the answer like, given the cost. Especially since anyone europe inclined to think among those lines would have presumably been persuaded by the conquest of the rest of the world.

I suppose you could argue that it proved that terrorist movements could get great states moving to war as a response. But I'm not convinced that is a new lesson either. See the american revolution, for instance. The sons of liberty basically did the exact same thing as the black hand, centuries earlier.
 

Artetafan said:
Yeah, sorry didn't see the correction.

I'm far from convinced that the ultimate lesson learned of ww1 is violence is the answer like, given the cost. Especially since anyone europe inclined to think among those lines would have presumably been persuaded by the conquest of the rest of the world.

I suppose you could argue that it proved that terrorist movements could get great states moving to war as a response. But I'm not convinced that is a new lesson either. See the american revolution, for instance. The sons of liberty basically did the exact same thing as the black hand, centuries earlier.
Click to expand...

Good points. Maybe further examples that terrorist movements could point to would be a better way to phrase it. We know Bin Laden used violence as a tactic to provoke a response which he got, although it didn't quite work out for him the way he planned.
 
johnnydawg68 said:
What did the Black Hand Serbian nationalists want? Why did they assassinate FF in the first place?

What happened after WW1 and the map of Europe was re-drawn? Guess what? The break up of the Austro-Hungarian empire...and new country called...Serbia. They got what they wanted.

Lesson for future revolutionaries?
Click to expand...

it's a good job (for their cause) that they had Princip on board, have you heard about Cabrinovic's attempts ???

I know they were essentially amateurs but he was a fkn clown by all accounts,

threw a grenade/bomb which bounced off Ferdinad's car onto the next car and blowing that up DOH !

then he tried to off himself by munching a cyanide pill that was out of date which just made him throw up

then he tried to end it by jumping into a river but because of the dry season it was only four inches deep

then the crowd dragged him out and battered him senseless, what a clown !
 

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