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Ronald Koeman discussion

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Only caught the last 20 mins last night... probably for the best! Sandro and vlasic looked lively but by that point the damage was done and Atalanta were strolling.

Not sure what to think. We have a squad of good players and a good manager, yet there seems to be a disconnect somewhere. I'm sure it'll all come out in the wash at some point, but unless he sorts it out sharpish he isn't going to last the season.

Cmon Ronald
 
Would be fascinating to know the dynamic between Koeman and Walsh at this point.

We are not quite sure of the specifics of Walshs role I think, but his job is independent of Koeman and you would think the board would sound him out as to his take on results, performances, and morale. You would also assume his input, positive or negative, is critical as far as shaping the views of Kenwright and Moshiri.

Its also relevant that SW was appointed after RK and not before. If it was the other way around as would have been desirable then Walsh would be more bound by loyalty but if performances and results continue to spiral then SW is probably the key man with influence. Otherwise his role is meaningless.

Just speculating of course but in my own profession I have seen plenty of people hung out to dry very quickly solely for others to scapegoat and disassociate themselves from poor performance.

Just as an observer as well as a fan, it makes for very interesting times though I'd much rather the lads would get it together and soon.
 
Lanolin said:
Oh give it a rest you sanctimonious bore.

'Some pain sometimes'? I've had a season ticket for over 20 years, in which time we've won no trophies, about 3 derbies and once at old Trafford and arsenal. Don't patronise me.
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Pack it in with the insults lad, no need.

Edit: There is nothing wrong with a bit of passion of course, I also understand that as a season ticket holder of over 20 years you are probably far more passionate about this than I am, but at the end of the day I am not going to start spitting my dummy out with the manager this early in the season, especially as he improved us in his first season and got us back into europe at the first time of asking.

I appreciate there are massive concerns about how the team are performing and the emphasis this season was to try and bridge the gap on the teams above us, which at this moment in time looks unlikely, but is till possible over the course of a full season.
 
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Moomin said:
When you all ran around saying Martinez is a clown and Koeman is the new saviour. I pointed out you would all turn on him

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Thing is, I don't care who the manager is. performances like we have witnessed deserve all the flack he gets. He should be on borrowed time now and in my mind deservedly so. Never seen such passionless, spiritless rubbish.
 
Koeman seems to be in a rut. He just keeps switching between three and five the back, and rotating the players that are allowed to be dropped.

It's bizarre how many managers fall into the trap of shoehorning players into unnatural positions. As Peganta, who cost all of £900k and managed five goals last season, showed last night, it's better to have a stopgap who knows what they're doing than to simply have no recognised striker.

It made sense in the Moyes era, when every penny had to count; but it shouldn't be an issue to pay out for someone to bridge a gap anymore - not when the TV revenue is so exorbitantly high. This is why I thought that at the very worst there'd be a late move for someone cheap and underwhelming, like Ulloa.
 

Paul w said:
He has got 3/4 more games for me to sort this shambles out,that last night paired with the spurs game is totally unacceptable,and the blame lands at the managers feet, he persists in playing and making jagielka captain when it is clear to most he is finished which doesn't say at lot for Williams, everyone could pick out players from last night and say how crap they were,as a unit were are so narrow it's embarrassing and when we lose the ball we are wide open,that is koemans method which needs to be addressed now.
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Jags made a lot of last ditch tackles last night to be fair to him but he isn't the player he was, but we knew that already. All the players have to shoulder their share of the blame but you can't sack all the players unfortunately.
 
Pick a back 4 and stick to it for a month, sod the rotation lark as it clearly isn't working. Need a few wins and quickly to gain confidence, not going to happen on Sunday so after that.
 
ijjysmith said:
You know he won't though yeah?

Need to look at it another way too though.

If we sacked a manager after what, 6 or 7 games this season, after a decent season last time, what message does that send to any prospective new managers?

'Oh i'm not going there, first sign of things not going great they'll get rid of me'.

It's very very easy to say get rid of the manager. But sometimes the problems are deeper and more wide spread.
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I agree with that mate but if our manager cannot see we are awful playing with this narrow formation then other problems within don't matter.
 
CerberusFX said:
Jags made a lot of last ditch tackles last night to be fair to him but he isn't the player he was, but we knew that already. All the players have to shoulder their share of the blame but you can't sack all the players unfortunately.
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Too be honest mate I don't want to see him making a lot of last ditch tackles because if he is there is something else wrong.Jags is a poor player and a crap Captain.
 
BlueToff said:
There's caveats mate, clearly, and I'm not saying Koeman is to blame for the players themselves.

But... His stubbornness, much like it did with Martinez, is threatening to get the better of him.

Hopefully, he switches things up quickly, or it will turn sour as good as a manager I think he is.
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Koeman got credit last year when we were winning. He'll take the criticism now when we're losing.

I don't like his recruitment this summer one bit. But this is his side now so he will be judged. The run of 4 home games has to be wins.
 

That is what it comes down to really isn't it?

How many abominable performances on the bounce, or in quick succession are the hierarchy and the fanbase willing to tolerate in the hope of an improvement?

Most folk will forgive an exceptional awful performance, particularly if they see the outlines of a plan trying to take shape.

I don't think I will ever accept an attitude of defeat and godawful attitude and effort from the players though. 3 games running, admittedly two against much superior opposition, we looked like a pub team. Unacceptable.

We will likely be soundly beaten on Sunday so I'm trying to look past that even now which as a fan I should not but what suggests we will get it together against Burnley if this attitude is rampant? They are a decent side with an excellent manager. Lose or draw and what then?

How would our peer clubs react to this?
 
Paul w said:
Too be honest mate I don't want to see him making a lot of last ditch tackles because if he is there is something else wrong.Jags is a poor player and a crap Captain.
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The something else wrong would be the 2DMs not offering any protection. I'm not saying Jags should be in then side btw.
 
Gwladysstreetlad said:
I know it's the done thing on here to mock and dismisses Moyes as grabage but it's worth noting that both the fools who followed him here have done considerably worse then he did with a far larger budget.
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Aye, we seen what a Moyes team could do when we added Lukaku, not advocating Moyes coming back mind but he built a good squad, he just left it in an ageing state.
 

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