The Everton Board Thread (Inc. Bill Kenwright / Blue Union)

[quasi modo]

looks like a slice of that money is getting spend already on giving players new contracts jags and co

Some of the money being splashed out on contracts is ridiculous, need to start cutting back, especially with the likes of Heitinga on £65k, no doubt Neville on the same, its a lot of money on average players.

 

[Allezfan]

Yeah all the players will just use the new tv money to get a raise or they'll leave to one of the other 19 clubs suddenly getting an extra 25 million.

 

[D410]

You're wrong there.

The new TV deal changes things a lot in terms of how the business will look. It's going to add circa £25M to the bottom line of the business overnight. So the current cash losses will be turn into a sensible profit, (providing the cost base remains unaltered) which in terms of the business value could have a huge effect. As all of a sudden the club could be producing £15M EBITDA & at that, the current reported asking price (£150M) would look half sensible.

Unfortunately next summers TV money - half of it covers the loan we took this summer, and the other half merely prevents us getting another loan next summer (in theory)

 

[edge]

Yeah all the players will just use the new tv money to get a raise or they'll leave to one of the other 19 clubs suddenly getting an extra 25 million.

its getting out of control, some of the wages for average players is obscene , but if we dont pay it someone else will. dont know were it will all end but it cant be good for the clubs/fans in the long run

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Unfortunately next summers TV money - half of it covers the loan we took this summer, and the other half merely prevents us getting another loan next summer (in theory)

The new TV money is incremental income & therefore nothing to do with the yearly renewable loan that they've taken for the last few years. All they've been doing is bringing forward the guaranteed income, there's no reason why that should change, unless they decide that this is the year that they clear that ongoing liability.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Yeah all the players will just use the new tv money to get a raise or they'll leave to one of the other 19 clubs suddenly getting an extra 25 million.

There'll be an element of that I'm sure, but the PL have been having some sensible discussions of late around bringing in their own version of FFP, as they know that left unchecked, over time, the sole beneficiaries of the increase could be the players & their agents.However, I think there'll be a stronger stance taken by the majority this time around, irrepsective of a contractual agreement.

 

[Dell Boy]

its getting out of control, some of the wages for average players is obscene , but if we dont pay it someone else will. dont know were it will all end but it cant be good for the clubs/fans in the long run

We have to follow the lesson set in the US with salary caps. The irony that the biggest baddest capitalist country has led the way in salary caps is ironic but entirely necessary here. It'd need to be done on a UEFA-wide basis so its anyone's guess whether that would ever be possible.

 

[edge]

We have to follow the lesson set in the US with salary caps. The irony that the biggest baddest capitalist country has led the way in salary caps is ironic but entirely necessary here. It'd need to be done on a UEFA-wide basis so its anyone's guess whether that would ever be possible.

maybe the fa could say that some of it has to be set against club dept say 50% or something as it stands it just going out the game to players and agents, looks like the yanks have the right idea

 

[davek]

There'll be an element of that I'm sure, but the PL have been having some sensible discussions of late around bringing in their own version of FFP, as they know that left unchecked, over time, the sole beneficiaries of the increase could be the players & their agents.However, I think there'll be a stronger stance taken by the majority this time around, irrepsective of a contractual agreement.

They wont keep their discipline to unite on that.

The tv money increases will go where it's always gone = to players and agents.

The important thing to note on tv cash in relation to this thread is it's the only way our owners have known to get money into the club - putting their hands out.

 

[D410]

The new TV money is incremental income & therefore nothing to do with the yearly renewable loan that they've taken for the last few years. All they've been doing is bringing forward the guaranteed income, there's no reason why that should change, unless they decide that this is the year that they clear that ongoing liability.

The loans and Mortgages go back more than a few years !

Anyway, the simple point is that the TV money will be allocated to existing "open" loans and mortages taken out in addition to new contracts for the manager existing players. Given the clubs current credit rating which is not going to change to much over the coming months thus will see us knocking on the door of Vibrac and it,s wonderful interest rates.

At any rate, if the manager and key players depart in the summer then we will be flush with an uncertain future but then their is always the parachute payments.

 

[toffeejack]

its getting out of control, some of the wages for average players is obscene , but if we dont pay it someone else will. dont know were it will all end but it cant be good for the clubs/fans in the long run

i'd happily let someone else pay neville and heitinga's wages

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

The loans and Mortgages go back more than a few years !

Anyway, the simple point is that the TV money will be allocated to existing "open" loans and mortages taken out in addition to new contracts for the manager existing players. Given the clubs current credit rating which is not going to change to much over the coming months thus will see us knocking on the door of Vibrac and it,s wonderful interest rates.

At any rate, if the manager and key players depart in the summer then we will be flush with an uncertain future but then their is always the parachute payments.

The yearly renewable loan that you're refering to goes back about 4 years.

However, you're skipping past the salient point - £25M of fresh, new, currently unaccounted for cash, will be landing in the clubs coffers this summer.

If they continued to run the club exactly as it is today, then the club would make a healthy annual profit in the years to come, or have surplus cash to invest in either infrastructure or team building. That's a simple fact.

The view that every club will simply roll over & allow all of this fresh cash to wash out of their hands & into the pockets of already vastly overpaid players is too simplistic imo.

 

[D410]

The yearly renewable loan that you're refering to goes back about 4 years.

However, you're skipping past the salient point - £25M of fresh, new, currently unaccounted for cash, will be landing in the clubs coffers this summer.

If they continued to run the club exactly as it is today, then the club would make a healthy annual profit in the years to come, or have surplus cash to invest in either infrastructure or team building. That's a simple fact.

The view that every club will simply roll over & allow all of this fresh cash to wash out of their hands & into the pockets of already vastly overpaid players is too simplistic imo.

Can you go further (details, who and how much and when) on that one because I have a copy of all the "open loans and Mortgages" which go back further than 4 years !

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Can you go further (details, who and how much and when) on that one because I have a copy of all the "open loans and Mortgages" which go back further than 4 years !

No ****, but the main annually repayable one that you're referring to, that is currently with Vibrac, dates back about 4 years.

Nice avoidance of my actual point btw.

 

[Dell Boy]

I'm conscious that statistics can be made to look a certain way but whilst having my lunch I googled a few facts about the club and its debts, turnovers etc. I haven't got time to do a thorough analysis or check the sources but what I was trying to do was establish whether our present debt (as a percentage of turnover) is bigger now than when Kenwright took over. Ideally I'd have found the original accounts but I'm lazy and instead used these two pages. I'm not trying to play any games so happy to be corrected etc:

http://www.toffeeweb.com/club/business/finances_99.asp
http://www.toffeeweb.com/season/12-13/news/23366.html

From that the club was clearly in a desparate position off the pitch as well as on it when Kenwright took over.

Turnover was £22.6m and debt was either £15m or £18m depending which figure you choose. As a percentage of turnover that is 80% or 66%. The page from the year before Kenwright does not explicitly identify net debt but it does talk about an overdraft figure of that much. Whether there were other debts I can only guess at without digging deeper.

The latest accounts just released have turnover at £80.5m and net debt of £46m. This time, as a percentage of turnover, it is 57%. With turnover set to increase significantly next year thanks to the new Sky deal that to me at least says the club today is in a healthier position debt wise than it was when Kenwright took over. If true that contradicts a lot of the statements on this thread that Kenwright has just loaded the club with more and more record debts.