The Everton Board Thread (Inc. Bill Kenwright / Blue Union)

[magicjuan]

Morning Magic...you quite rightly say that the Jain deal was a massive deal about the regeneration, rebuilding of a whole area, and that the purchase of the club was 'a fragment of the value' You then go on to say that the club 'ballsed up'. Surely if the club were only a small fraction of the whole deal, its more likely that the rest of the deal simply didn't get off the ground, and therefore the purchase of the club(in your words 'a small fragment') no longer became a neccessity for Jain ? So how was it a 'balls up' by the club?

Afternoon Steve, hope you're well.

The original plans for regen of the area included EFC moving originally iirc, then when the idea of purchase and incorporation came up and the talks started the club became erratic and made demands for more influence on plans.
This wasto steel manufacturers, telecommunications companies etc and eventually obfuscated to the point they all fell off the proposal.

Sometime in the future I'll put up the list of companies involved, but a very large and well known bank were involved in both projects.

Just my opinion but I believe the idea was to connect onto the dock development hat was already way down the line in planning

 

[Moomin]

Were the banks not at the door every year and we couldn't get another loan? We certainly couldn't afford a world class set of facilities. The property you mentioned wouldn't of paid for it and the difference would of been taken out of the transfer budget..
Potentially could of seen us miss out on Howard or Lescott I believe (think it was that year).
If it was say JL that's 24mil + league position lost right there. We can buy it back for around 20mil at any time, but for now I dont see the problem.
Think we did the right thing on this one.

Sweet jesus, it cost about 8 million to build. Say we buy it back at 20 million in a few years time. We will have paid lets say 10 years lease of 1.5 million, so 35 million we have paid for a facility that cost circa 8 million.

By the way, we sold Bellefield for 9 million. The deal was done to get cash flow into the club and not for the long term benefit of the club.

 

[D410]

Afternoon Steve, hope you're well.

The original plans for regen of the area included EFC moving originally iirc, then when the idea of purchase and incorporation came up and the talks started the club became erratic and made demands for more influence on plans.
This wasto steel manufacturers, telecommunications companies etc and eventually obfuscated to the point they all fell off the proposal.

Sometime in the future I'll put up the list of companies involved, but a very large and well known bank were involved in both projects.

Just my opinion but I believe the idea was to connect onto the dock development hat was already way down the line in planning

Can you say whom was driving the erratic demands from within the club and why?

 

[magicjuan]

Can you say whom was driving the erratic demands from within the club and why?

Only from hearsay but wasn't a board member as such

 

[D410]

Only from hearsay but wasn't a board member as such

Odd that a non board member would have influence over club demands....Pip or Terry?

 

[Steve Wigan]

Afternoon Steve, hope you're well.

The original plans for regen of the area included EFC moving originally iirc, then when the idea of purchase and incorporation came up and the talks started the club became erratic and made demands for more influence on plans.
This wasto steel manufacturers, telecommunications companies etc and eventually obfuscated to the point they all fell off the proposal.

Sometime in the future I'll put up the list of companies involved, but a very large and well known bank were involved in both projects.

Just my opinion but I believe the idea was to connect onto the dock development hat was already way down the line in planning

Thanks for that Magic..always respect your view, written without abuse . I wonder if there were other(a multitude of other!) reasons why the plans were pulled, and you would think that if there was enough determination to make the major scheme happen, the big hitters would not be put off by the yelping of one of the small fry in the deal. We both know that some large developers are sitting on various plans, all over the UK, planning is the easy bit, its when the government bodies and financial people get involved plans seem to go on hold and eventually come to nothing. Jain are pretty massive are they not, in their base country, but wasn't this an early venture internationally for them. In the circumstances they would be very wary.

 

[magicjuan]

Thanks for that Magic..always respect your view, written without abuse . I wonder if there were other(a multitude of other!) reasons why the plans were pulled, and you would think that if there was enough determination to make the major scheme happen, the big hitters would not be put off by the yelping of one of the small fry in the deal. We both know that some large developers are sitting on various plans, all over the UK, planning is the easy bit, its when the government bodies and financial people get involved plans seem to go on hold and eventually come to nothing. Jain are pretty massive are they not, in their base country, but wasn't this an early venture internationally for them. In the circumstances they would be very wary.

It was, imho, further than just preliminary toe dipping, all those involved were/are big hitters, government ministers etc included from both sides.

Perhaps the scheme is being sat on, but something put them off, don't believe it to be funding or planning issues though, club yelped a fair bit from what I was told

 

[magicjuan]

Odd that a non board member would have influence over club demands....Pip or Terry?

Finance related.......

 

[Steve Wigan]

Odd that a non board member would have influence over club demands....Pip or Terry?

Thats an assumption, or a question? Not sure. But as Magic says, it was hearsay and 'not a board member, AS SUCH' With as much credence as your suggestions, I think you could add Wyness to the 'suspects'if he was around at the time, and from memory, he was. Terry Leahys advice would be more of an administative nature and more personal to Bill, given his background as a CEO. Phil Green is an old pal of Bills, and allegedly invested in Bills theatrical ventures(theres a list somewhere), so any 'guidance' he gives Bill would probably be financially based. I've always been surprised that the 'anti Kenwright' brigade have never sought to investigate Phils reputed investment in Bill Kenwright Ltd shows, in case theres a connection to an indirect investment in Everton. Probably not, but its something I've wondered about. Not illegal, though, in any case.

 

[Steve Wigan]

Finance related.......

As you were writing this, I was writing my post above...

 

[Steve Wigan]

It was, imho, further than just preliminary toe dipping, all those involved were/are big hitters, government ministers etc included from both sides.

Perhaps the scheme is being sat on, but something put them off, don't believe it to be funding or planning issues though, club yelped a fair bit from what I was told

Ever had a sight of any of the plans/reports ?

 

[magicjuan]

Ever had a sight of any of the plans/reports ?

No, just involved parties, covered everything, gas, electricity, steel fabrication, roads, communications, finance, global players
Was told it was all around Walton/Everton down to docks

 

[paultheblue]

Is this true? Is there no business sense to a loan? None at all? You then make out we were only happy because those loans who may be going? How much would it have costed to bring those players in? £7-8m for Barry? £20m Lukaku? £15-20 Deulofeu? then wages, including the rest of the Barry wages that we re heavily subsidised? I dunno, I'm guessing. However, what did they actually cost us? Maybe £10m in total plus wages? Having these players in our team improved us during the season, we have performed better by having them and at £1.75m per place in the premier league, we'd only have to finish 5 places higher to make that money back, with that higher place we got Europe, which allows to earn even more. To me, it makes perfect business sense.

Loans are just a short term fix though mate,would we not be better to have a board/chairman who can plan further ahead than the end of next week.
Martinez done exceptionally well with the people he brought in last season and for that reason I very much doubt he will be able to emulate that again next year.We will never build a team capable of winning trophies by borrowing other peoples players we need the funding to bring in players that we can keep for at least 3 or 4 years.
There is no money to be made from the Europa Cup unless you actually get to the final and to be honest it has more negatives than positives that aside it is still good to be competing in europe as it raises our profile.

 

[Jacko93]

Loans are just a short term fix though mate,would we not be better to have a board/chairman who can plan further ahead than the end of next week.
Martinez done exceptionally well with the people he brought in last season and for that reason I very much doubt he will be able to emulate that again next year.We will never build a team capable of winning trophies by borrowing other peoples players we need the funding to bring in players that we can keep for at least 3 or 4 years.
There is no money to be made from the Europa Cup unless you actually get to the final and to be honest it has more negatives than positives that aside it is still good to be competing in europe as it raises our profile.

By raising our profile, it makes us worth more money. Worth more money to prosepctive buyers, worth more money to commercial partners, will probably be worth about £5kpw to a player in terms of negotiations. I think we need to see where we are this coming season in terms of playing staff before judging. I struggle to see whats bad about competing in Europe, without considering what wining it gets us this year. This could be the bigest pot of mioney eer for winning the Europa, as you get ECL qualification aswell.

The only difference between us and pretty much any other team in the Prem this year is that we loaned players who improved our first team. They will of also improved the players below them. that to me is the correct usage of the loan market, using players to step you up a level.

If you want to travel to london, you dont buy the train do you, you only buy a ticket to get to where you want to go, while somebody else owns the risk. You could buy an affordable car, but it wont get you there as quick and could break down on the M6.

 

[Steve Wigan]

No, just involved parties, covered everything, gas, electricity, steel fabrication, roads, communications, finance, global players
Was told it was all around Walton/Everton down to docks

Was it ever established that the Jain involved was the company that basically builds flats in Chennai, or was it a different Jain? There are quite often announcements about the regeneration of parts of Liverpool...currently theres talk of a rapid transit system 'joining Gp, Anfield and the Arena in a loop'...that seems to clash with the reports of a new location being discussed for EFC.