"The fans wanted him sacked"

[mrb85]

No arguments that this season has been poor. And I agree, 'long term success' is up for discussion, and failure to provide something like it probably means a new manager. I just meant that one good season, one bad season isn't itself enough to deliver a authoritative verdict. Ok, if the club were to be relegated that would be a whole new ball game - but that's not what you were talking about in your post...you said survival + failure to win EL = sacking.

As for what counts as success at Everton, that's a funny one. Which other clubs have a huge chunk of fans who feasted on some golden years, and enjoyed the highest standards, and another chunk of fans who've never seen silverware. I mean, what expectations do West Ham fans, or Aston Villa fans have? What defines 'acceptable from the manager' for them? I've no idea, but something tells me there'll be differences from us.

Last thing I'd say is that good managers learn. I think Moyes was a better manager by the time he left than in his early years (despite some having him down as a one trick pony/hoofball merchant circa 2006). I'd like to think Martinez (very similar age to Moyes when he arrived) will do the same. Learn. Be a bit less nice, a bit more savvy about how to get results. Whether he does or not is up for judgment too, but it's hard to form a judgment unless there's enough data in...

Are you suggesting WHU have had a golden era some time?

 

[MassBlue]

Ha, not really, though they did win the FA Cup in '75 and '80. And their wage bill is increasingly comparable to ours. I just meant expectations of clubs like us, who aren't going to win the league but would expect to comfortably placed within. Maybe Villa is a better example. What's reasonable for a club like that? And in what ways are Everton different? (I don't know the answer, it's a legitimate question)

 

[Dymak]

Ha, not really, though they did win the FA Cup in '75 and '80. And their wage bill is increasingly comparable to ours. I just meant expectations of clubs like us, who aren't going to win the league but would expect to comfortably placed within. Maybe Villa is a better example. What's reasonable for a club like that? And in what ways are Everton different? (I don't know the answer, it's a legitimate question)

I got lynched for stating Everton were very similar to Newcatle and Villa back in the summer.

 

[MassBlue]

I got lynched for stating Everton were very similar to Newcatle and Villa back in the summer.

Haha. How the mighty have fallen (ie, us). I remember Graeme Sharp being interviewed in about 1990/91, towards the end of his Everton days, and he made a point about saying how Everton fans were especially hard to play in front of. Expectations, I suppose.

 

[wbn61]

Kendal I don't like as a person.

 

[Kieno]

Moyes said he couldn't take that team any higher. Clarity indeed.

Where did Moyes say that? And even if he did, what's it got to do with the price of chips?

 

[evertony]

Are you sure? Lukaku and McCarthy? Over £40m worth of players in just them 2 alone. Then there was Barry. When did Moyes ever get the chance to improve the squad this much in one go during his tenure?

Did we give Fellaini away for nothing? And Victor, and Jelavic? The sums are easy....£27.5M + £6M + £7.5M = £41M....I don't think Roberto had any more than Moyes had in fairness.

 

[Saint Domingo]

Did we give Fellaini away for nothing? And Victor, and Jelavic? The sums are easy....£27.5M + £6M + £7.5M = £41M....I don't think Roberto had any more than Moyes had in fairness.

Difference is Martinez got that money, all of it. Moyes often sold players and saw none of it or a minor percentage back. Arteta money disappeared. One window we sold Yakubu, Pienaar and Saha and brought in Stracq on loan with Drenthe on loan. Moyes had to manage on a negative net spend. Its disgraceful circumstances for both managers but at least Martinez got given the capital he raised. I can't remember Moyes seeing that much of the Rooney money either and he got les form the Lescott deal to use for funds as well. Similarly with the Rodwell deal, 12 mill rising to 15 and we brought Mirallas in for 6.

 

[Goat]

Did we give Fellaini away for nothing? And Victor, and Jelavic? The sums are easy....£27.5M + £6M + £7.5M = £41M....I don't think Roberto had any more than Moyes had in fairness.

Mate Moyes spent around 14m NET in his 11 years, Martinez has spent not far off 20m NET in 2 years.

 

[evertony]

Mate Moyes spent around 14m NET in his 11 years, Martinez has spent not far off 20m NET in 2 years.

And the incomings from Sky etc are significantly higher. It's all relative.....both have managed on meagre budgets.

 

[Goat]

And the incomings from Sky etc are significantly higher. It's all relative.....both have managed on meagre budgets.

We have spent 4m net in the last 5 seasons.

£4m.

LOL

Somebody somewhere is getting a proper wedge.

 

[roydo]

And the incomings from Sky etc are significantly higher. It's all relative.....both have managed on meagre budgets.

Didnt Moyes prove that by spending about half a billion English pounds in a month at United?

 

[evertony]

We have spent 4m net in the last 5 seasons.

£4m.

LOL

Somebody somewhere is getting a proper wedge.

Agents, players......and Brendan Galloway