The Friedkin Group - Dan & Ryan Friedkin

[pfim]

But in this example that you give, the two creditors seek to obtain the assets that the loans were secured on, they don’t try and obtain the money from wherever the debtor has spent their money. Say the debtor spent the money on a holiday, the creditor doesn’t get to ask Jet2 Holidays for their money back.

I appreciate that 777 didn’t spend the money on a holiday with Jet 2 Holidays, but they have used their money to provide an UNSECURED loan to Everton. Said loan to Everton has no security from Everton, and no security to either of 777’s creditors. Everton have never been used as an asset to secure any loan involving 777.

My conclusion is that it’s a bit of a reach for either creditor, whether it be A-Cap or Leadenhall to claim they have a right to the money loaned to Everton, when the security for their loans to 777 were other assets, and not Everton Football Club.

Separately, and I know you haven’t made this claim, I don’t for one minute think Everton could possibly be liable when it comes to proceeds of crime or whatever. That’s like saying I would be liable if I took a loan from HSBC, and HSBC were later found to be involved in criminal activities. The FBI would not be looking at me in such circumstances!

Again, I'm no lawyer, but that chart that Goat posted earlier actually gives some information.

There is some security (unitranche) to the prior 777 debt, it's junior to RMF but it does state it has collateral (likely insufficient) behind it. It also states that at the beginning of June, ACap foreclosed (for lack of a better term) on the 777 assets, which includes the debt to Everton. Typically in the loan documents it will state something to the effect of "777 Partners and/or its Successors" to cover this scenario.

As for that last part, I don't think Everton could be criminally liable. But if the funds were paid to what turns out the wrong company, the money will still be owed and already paid by Everton to the wrong party. Undoing that would create a bigger mess.

 

[MikeH72]

For a supposed journalist, he never seems to have heard / known anything.

It's always "not that I've heard", in response to anything.

There may be a message to him in how highly he ranks in that...

At this point it’s a wonder why he doesn’t just say “listen lads I know as much as you all so stop asking me”.

 

[Goat]

At this point it’s a wonder why he doesn’t just say “listen lads I know as much as you all so stop asking me”.

Any news on Lindstrom Mike??

 

[MikeH72]

Any news on Lindstrom Mike??

Not that I’m aware of. Cheers Al.

 

[windymiller]

Kieran Maguire

He claimed: ‘They [The Friedkin Group] formally withdrew from the process on Friday. Now, I’ve got to be honest, this story had been leaked on Tuesday/Wednesday to certain parties but not the football club itself.

‘This is how bad things were, that some people were aware that the deal had collapsed, but Everton hadn’t realised that themselves.

‘I think that’s indicative of just how bad things were between Farhad Moshiri and Friedkin Group.’

If that's true you have to wonder what Moshiri's game is here. I'm starting to coma around to the theory that Moshiri is begging Peter to pay Paul and has no intention of actually selling the club.

 

[pfim]

If that's true you have to wonder what Moshiri's game is here. I'm starting to coma around to the theory that Moshiri is begging Peter to pay Paul and has no intention of actually selling the club.

I read that and thought Moshiri isn't speaking to the leadership team at the club about the sale. Which isn't completely out of the ordinary, but not good practice.

 

[BullensRoad]

For a supposed journalist, he never seems to have heard / known anything.

It's always "not that I've heard", in response to anything.

There may be a message to him in how highly he ranks in that...

I’ve said this a few times. He usually just repeats what’s been said on SSN, and yes he’s quite clever with his wording; “I believe” or “it looks like” and of course “not what I’ve heard”.

He hasn’t been ITK at the club for about 20 years yet he likes the attention. Also deleted his twitter when he’s in a strop and been wrong, saying he’s had enough, to return in a matter of days.

 

[davek]

For a supposed journalist, he never seems to have heard / known anything.

It's always "not that I've heard", in response to anything.

There may be a message to him in how highly he ranks in that...

He's a clown who deserves nothing but scorn.

If you read his follow up comments to the Malone tweet he underlines what a chancer he is: a series of 'no idea' to follow questions for him. 'No idea'...'I suppose they know they have to have loads of moeny'...'I'm sure they're aware of the debt situation and A-Cap'.

The feller's twitter account should be censored on here.

 

[jamieni]

If that's true you have to wonder what Moshiri's game is here. I'm starting to coma around to the theory that Moshiri is begging Peter to pay Paul and has no intention of actually selling the club.

It’s certainly crossed my mind but what on earth is the end game for him? It’s not likely we’re going to see USM welcomed back with open arms soon. Just seems v odd.

 

[mikel_88]

Again, I'm no lawyer, but that chart that Goat posted earlier actually gives some information.

There is some security (unitranche) to the prior 777 debt, it's junior to RMF but it does state it has collateral (likely insufficient) behind it. It also states that at the beginning of June, ACap foreclosed (for lack of a better term) on the 777 assets, which includes the debt to Everton. Typically in the loan documents it will state something to the effect of "777 Partners and/or its Successors" to cover this scenario.

As for that last part, I don't think Everton could be criminally liable. But if the funds were paid to what turns out the wrong company, the money will still be owed and already paid by Everton to the wrong party. Undoing that would create a bigger mess.

does the pl have any blame aswell to approve the loans 777 made to us: also i dont think this malone takeover will have anything to it can see it being another behind the scenes keeping quiet

 

[kenada_blue]

Kieran Maguire

He claimed: ‘They [The Friedkin Group] formally withdrew from the process on Friday. Now, I’ve got to be honest, this story had been leaked on Tuesday/Wednesday to certain parties but not the football club itself.

‘This is how bad things were, that some people were aware that the deal had collapsed, but Everton hadn’t realised that themselves.

‘I think that’s indicative of just how bad things were between Farhad Moshiri and Friedkin Group.’

Remember when Lampard got sacked and they didn't announce it until the afternoon...even though his team had already said he'd be fired in the morning?

Or when Dyche turned up to finch farm and spent the entire day there with everyone reporting he got the job ...but it wasn't announced until the next day (I think).

It's called rudderless

 

[pfim]

It’s certainly crossed my mind but what on earth is the end game for him? It’s not likely we’re going to see USM welcomed back with open arms soon. Just seems v odd.

The end game for him is to make the most money out of the deal (I know that seems obvious).

MSP: Minority stake until the stadium is complete and hopefully the value of the club appreciates to the point that he can take more money out
777: Sold to completely unworthy, in every sense, buyers because they differentiated themselves by paying him more than anyone else would (which ironically is a red flag)
Friedken: Perhaps you can say the 777 debt killed the deal, but he was still getting a payout and could have done more to close the deal.

In each instance, he buys himself more time by having the prospective buyers loan the club money. With Friedken, he bought another 12 months.

 

[pfim]

does the pl have any blame aswell to approve the loans 777 made to us: also i dont think this malone takeover will have anything to it can see it being another behind the scenes keeping quiet

I don't think the PL approves loans. There is the leverage test, but depending on what you treat as debt and what you think the value of the club is, I don't think we were out of compliance with.

It's tough to gauge how serious groups like Malone or Vici are because you don't know who is behind the money. Which as we've learned is very important.

 

[Dymak]

Again, I'm no lawyer, but that chart that Goat posted earlier actually gives some information.

There is some security (unitranche) to the prior 777 debt, it's junior to RMF but it does state it has collateral (likely insufficient) behind it. It also states that at the beginning of June, ACap foreclosed (for lack of a better term) on the 777 assets, which includes the debt to Everton. Typically in the loan documents it will state something to the effect of "777 Partners and/or its Successors" to cover this scenario.

As for that last part, I don't think Everton could be criminally liable. But if the funds were paid to what turns out the wrong company, the money will still be owed and already paid by Everton to the wrong party. Undoing that would create a bigger mess.

In which case, if there is any security on 777’s loan to Everton, it is very weak security that puts them right at the back of the queue for any money owed. And nobody is able to say what the security is, unlike RMF who have actual real life security in both the TV money and Goodison Park, or MSP, who had security on the new stadium.

TFG will know all this.

So whilst I can accept that there may be some security for Everton’s loan from 777, which means Everton have at least some obligation to pay it back, I don’t accept that the ongoing BS with 777 makes the sale of Everton unresolvable, or claims that Everton are somehow implicated in a criminal conspiracy.

It’s very simple. At worst, Everton will have to pay back all of the money loaned to them by 777. At best, they get to pay considerably less than what was borrowed.

If a prospective owner can’t deal with this reality, or the fact that it may take a long time for the situation to be resolved, then tough imo.

In all likelihood, I think Everton will end up paying LESS than what was borrowed. Quite how a prospective buyer can think that’s something to whinge about is kind of beyond me tbh.

 

[pfim]

In which case, if there is any security on 777’s loan to Everton, it is very weak security that puts them right at the back of the queue for any money owed. And nobody is able to say what the security is, unlike RMF who have actual real life security in both the TV money and Goodison Park, or MSP, who had security on the new stadium.

TFG will know all this.

So whilst I can accept that there may be some security for Everton’s loan from 777, which means Everton have at least some obligation to pay it back, I don’t accept that the ongoing BS with 777 makes the sale of Everton unresolvable, or claims that Everton are somehow implicated in a criminal conspiracy.

It’s very simple. At worst, Everton will have to pay back all of the money loaned to them by 777. At best, they get to pay considerably less than what was borrowed.

If a prospective owner can’t deal with this reality, or the fact that it may take a long time for the situation to be resolved, then tough imo.

In all likelihood, I think Everton will end up paying LESS than what was borrowed. Quite how a prospective buyer can think that’s something to whinge about is kind of beyond me tbh.

The security (per the chart) is the same as RMF, it's just junior to it.

The money is owed, I'm not sure why anyone would question that.

The matter is who it's owed to. If Friedken wanted to settle that debt now (I agree I doubt we will be paying the full amount back) who would he negotiate with?

Again, it's the uncertainty (risk) of the situation that would scare a buyer off.

If a prospective buyer wants to take that risk on and give Moshiri the payout he desires, then more power to them. We haven't seen evidence of that yet.