What the hell is going on over there???

[Gazdalf]

I have similar feelings to Dylan in this matter but will choose not to get involved at all. Reading through this thread there are once again the normal people commenting on things in a so called passionate manner who have never had their lives DIRECTLY affected by terrorism. Some people should stop writing in this thread as they are just being opinionated and not necessarily with an educated tongue. I guess some people just like having their voices heard (once again) and don't truly have a clue what they are talking about. They have been educated by media and not by the heartbreak of being an actual victim. Once these things actually happen to you(God forbid) it will change your attitude, whether it be for the better or for the worse.

I am just saying think before you speak, as this type of mis-understanding is how wars have started in the past.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

First off, was that question directed at you Rob? Nope, didn't think so. As for what you said, damn right I get aggressive when people start criticizing my country for no other reason than to do it.

I am glad people like you, Rob, aren't in power, otherwise the countries of the world would have given into every little demand issued to them by all manner of terrorists.

I don't know if you have noticed, but the world is a nasty place, and if we let people like Osama bin-Laden and Saddam Hussein run around doing whatever the hell they want, then that would be bad.

*Edit* Just wanted to add, this is purely politics I am talking about, I have no ther problems with anybody on the board except for in this area. Passion, we are all victims of it, and we are all adults, and I don't want to fall out over this, so I am going to try to not get involved in this type of stuff in the future*

I was referring to the government and the fact that they knew about a threat but were too arrogant to think that it could possibly happen. Or perhaps they wanted it to happen so that they could retaliate and finish off daddy's work.

Sorry if that offends America, but it is aimed solely at the clowns in charge and it just happened to be in NY. I have nothing against the people of America, but you have to understand whatever happens over there affects us back here.

I also need to add that I thought you just moved out there Dylan, I had no idea that you were actually an American, so how could I have directed it at you.

But also you talk about Bin Laden and that we can't have him running around, well if its so damn important and you have the supposed best intelligence agency, why the hell haven't you caught him yet? Do you think that it may that they don't want to catch him and that his families links to the Bush family are preventing this?

Maybe I am being cynical, I just think its a little crazy that this man has not been caught yet nearly 6 years after he was targeted.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

I have similar feelings to Dylan in this matter but will choose not to get involved at all. Reading through this thread there are once again the normal people commenting on things in a so called passionate manner who have never had their lives DIRECTLY affected by terrorism. Some people should stop writing in this thread as they are just being opinionated and not necessarily with an educated tongue. I guess some people just like having their voices heard (once again) and don't truly have a clue what they are talking about. They have been educated by media and not by the heartbreak of being an actual victim. Once these things actually happen to you(God forbid) it will change your attitude, whether it be for the better or for the worse.

I am just saying think before you speak, as this type of mis-understanding is how wars have started in the past.

If your going to target me, just say so. I haven't gotten personal but seems other have.

What the hell do you know about it? You don't know my life, and you don't know who I have met. I have met some pretty unfortunate people who have had their lives ripped apart by terrorism both directly and indirectly. I have listened to stories from people who lived in the Kurdish area of Iraq. I read the Times newspaper not The Star, so I feel I have an educated tongue to speak with.

 

[atrottel]

Reading through this thread there are once again the normal people commenting on things in a so called passionate manner who have never had their lives DIRECTLY affected by terrorism.

Well, it would be interesting to see how this argument would affect discussions in the transfer threads - lots of people commenting about EFC and DM who have never been near a business or hired an employee in their lives.

Or the stadium debate? Are all those who are not architects or builders to be disqualified from commenting?

Tragic though it may well be to be "DIRECTLY affected" by terrorism, those who have been are probably even less likely to have a balanced view of the issues involved.

 

[Gazdalf]

If your going to target me, just say so. I haven't gotten personal but seems other have.

What the hell do you know about it? You don't know my life, and you don't know who I have met. I have met some pretty unfortunate people who have had their lives ripped apart by terrorism both directly and indirectly. I have listened to stories from people who lived in the Kurdish area of Iraq. I read the Times newspaper not The Star, so I feel I have an educated tongue to speak with.

I have not targeted anyone?

NO. So back off.

What do I know about it?

More than you think.

Do I know you?

NO. never claimed to.

The times is still the media, what is your point? it is still liable to censorship (as all news coming out of the area is, rightly or wrongly)

So no need to be getting all defensive and climbing on a high horse that you once accused suits of being on.

 

[Gazdalf]

Well, it would be interesting to see how this argument would affect discussions in the transfer threads - lots of people commenting about EFC and DM who have never been near a business or hired an employee in their lives.

Or the stadium debate? Are all those who are not architects or builders to be disqualified from commenting?

Tragic though it may well be to be "DIRECTLY affected" by terrorism, those who have been are probably even less likely to have a balanced view of the issues involved.

Understood mate. We all have our views. Apparently the way we express them can upset people. I guess that is the difference between views and opinions.

 

[Gazdalf]

And another thing that confused me ghost was, I actually agreed with some of your earlier points in this thread. What made you think I was targeting anyone in particular and why did you get so defensive??

 

[Rob]

Dylan - me? criticizing the U.S. for no reason than to do it? nah.

If saddam was so bad, why did we deal with him for years, if saddam was so bad why did we give him chemical weapons, arms and money.

seems to me there is a terrible evil leader of a country out there, one that openly admits to killing innocent people and sending the decent men and women of his own country to die in some desert for no other reason than money and dirty politics.

You need to wake up to the fact that America can and should be criticised because what it does around the world is horrific and what they do to their people back home is no less than brain washing.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

And another thing that confused me ghost was, I actually agreed with some of your earlier points in this thread. What made you think I was targeting anyone in particular and why did you get so defensive??

Sorry, wrong end of the stick. No hard feelings?

 

[GhostOfDixie]

Dylan - me? criticizing the U.S. for no reason than to do it? nah.

If saddam was so bad, why did we deal with him for years, if saddam was so bad why did we give him chemical weapons, arms and money.

seems to me there is a terrible evil leader of a country out there, one that openly admits to killing innocent people and sending the decent men and women of his own country to die in some desert for no other reason than money and dirty politics.

You need to wake up to the fact that America can and should be criticised because what it does around the world is horrific and what they do to their people back home is no less than brain washing.

Very good point. America has become the monster it once tried to tame.

 

[gordonjblair]

One thing that did stand out in this thread is the statement from an otherwise intelligent , but maybe slightly volatile (yep, although it could apply to many, this time it's you Ghost ) member of the Forum, that they were about to start looking for BNP literature.

I know (or at least hope) that it was not a totally serious statement, but this is where terrorism is at it's most effective. The aim of terrorism or propaganda to to exert force on a government through its people. What these extremists really want is a Muslim State within a State, isolating the mainstream Muslim population from the rest of society to stop it becoming westernised and bring it back under religious control. The easiest way to bring this closer is to polarise the country; by tarring all Muslims with the same brush, this polarisation and isolation can be achieved (sadly, the Media, knowing that sensationalism will always sell papers, are complicit with this). The only groups that will profit from this kind of polarisation are the extremist. BNP, the various hard-line Muslim organisations, all stand to gain, while the vast majority are left pissed off and living in a rather unpleasant climate.

It's vitally important that we retain a sense of perspective in these cases and treat them for what they are, criminal acts carried out by small groups of activitists.

Or maybe I got the wrong end of the stick, and al Quaeda have opened up a chippy near you and are [Poor language removed] at deliveries. Oh, and ignorance of our geography and culture is not the sole preserve of immigrants, just spend a soul destroying 5 minutes watching Big Brother to see just how ignorant Brits can be, at least there's the prospect of immigrants being tested on their ability to integrate.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

Fair points.

My clamour for BNP material was symbolic. I would never support a party that is using quite good views to harbour racist opinions.

Am I happy that this country is a haven for immigrants from eastern Europe? No!

Am I happy that we have this extreme muslim cell within our shores? No!

Am I happy that as a nation we seem to feel sorry for johnny foreigner and forget about our own citizens? No!

So what do I do? What can I do? Absolutely [Poor language removed] all, because as soon as I or anyone start complaining about the foreign invasion we become labelled as racist.

Tell me why it is good for our economy when people live here, earn money of our state and then send it back to their own country rather than spending it on our own goods?

Remember though that they may be small groups, but they have huge sympathy from other muslims. Also the Nazi party started in the backroom of a Munich shop, so while there are thousands of Muslims out there waiting to be recruited for mindless violence I will always be wary, and also because we just don't know who they are until they blow themselves up.

 

[chicoazul]

I like reading heated threads.

Ghost, Suits has just PM'd and said your mar is so fat her shadow weighs five stone.

Go, get him.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

Well I've just become really busy with client work, so I just don't have the time or the energy to get embroiled in some serious time wasting. Otherwise I would.

 

[chicoazul]

Damn it.

I will find something that makes you bite, just give me time....