Young EFC Players Out on Loan 2019-20

[LEONARD]

I was in Everton 2 today, they were doing brisk business.

 

[Eggs]

For me, the incoming loan player is a difficult position to be in. If you don't absolutely light the place up, fans wonder what the point is of them being there. If they sign the loan player from a team higher up the chain than themselves, the expectations are raised even further. From the players perspective, you are joining a team, often lower down from the team you are leaving, joining a established group and knowing you probably won't be there for long. From the teams perspective, they have signed him for 1 of 2 reasons. They are short of cash and quality, and need a cheap alternative to give them a lift. Or they need numbers to bulk out the squad. If the player is really good and they have no chance of keeping them, they have a decision to make whether to continue to develop a player for another team and potentially stunt the development of their own players.

The only benefits I see are to expose them to full open age football with crowds and see how they adapt in different systems and pressures. I actually think the performances are almost secondary. That said, the variety of experiences Dowell has had, and the positive impacts he has been able to make in different teams and formations, with different managers and styles, stand him in good stead and rather than being used as a negative against him, I feel it reflects well on his character.

...if I’m honest, I’m not the biggest fan. History at Everton suggests Academy players sent on loan have no significant future here (I‘ve said I can only think of Osman and Barkley who played over 50 games and both of those had bad injury at a significant stage of their development). Loans tend to be more of a shop window.

Dowell’s first proper experience of open-age football was in that first loan spell at Forest and he started really well. It’s really hard for a youngster to maintain a level of form throughout their loan spell. They are going into a ultra competitive competition where points are vital so the new manager will be strict on selection. The Manager is the judge on their worth.

Personally, I prefer the best youngsters to stay here and train with the first team.

 

[MercuryBlue88]

...yep, I liked Gibson lots coming through the ranks but the step up to PL is massive and Branthwaite is demonstrating he could do it. I suspect Branthwaite has leapfrogged Gibson in the pecking order.

Both are left sided, both are big lads. Gibson is a more solid build, he’s quite comfortable on the ball but I always think he’s a defender who likes to defend. Branthwaite on the other hand looks classy on the ball but I think he’ll need to learn the art of defending.

With Branthwaite making an impressive breakthrough, I have my doubts about Gibson at Everton.

Seem remember something similar with Ledson going on loan and Davies taking advantage of an injury crisis. Sometimes football is all about luck.

 

[Eggs]

Seem remember something similar with Ledson going on loan and Davies taking advantage of an injury crisis. Sometimes football is all about luck.

...it is, Matey, but its still very much down to a youngster taking the chance when it’s presented. Davies is a good example as is Holgate. Holgate looked on his way out, but failure to bring in Zouma on transfer deadline day meant he was needed as back-up to Mina/Keane. Luck played a part but he got an opportunity and grasped it.

 

[TheBigIguana]

...it is, Matey, but its still very much down to a youngster taking the chance when it’s presented. Davies is a good example as is Holgate. Holgate looked on his way out, but failure to bring in Zouma on transfer deadline day meant he was needed as back-up to Mina/Keane. Luck played a part but he got an opportunity and grasped it.

If you're using Holgate as an example then you have to acknowledge that he got something like 4 different chances to establish himself and it was only the fourth time that he really took it. Same with DCL and essentially same with Davies because if he ever does make it he will be on chance 5 or 6. We shouldn't expect or require a young player to step in and be great.

 

[blueloon]

Seem remember something similar with Ledson going on loan and Davies taking advantage of an injury crisis. Sometimes football is all about luck.

Indeed. I’ve been touting Gibson for a PL start at first left back for a couple of seasons and when an opportunity arose we picked Cuco Martina there and when the recent opportunity arose he was at Fleetwood. Luck eh.

 

[messymascot]

I think pre season should hopefully give Ancelloti a chance to look at Gibson and Branthwaite. We always moan that we need squad depth so perhaps ultimately we will be able to have both.

 

[Wilson]

Poor quality video of Dowell's goals. Third was great

Looks like he's filled out a bit since I've last seen a clip of him playing. He was never strong enough for the premier league IMO, but maybe now that has changed?

 

[Eggs]

Looks like he's filled out a bit since I've last seen a clip of him playing. He was never strong enough for the premier league IMO, but maybe now that has changed?

...we have to remember that before he went to Forest he’d only played age restricted football. He’d never played competitive, open-age football against men.

It’s not that he wasn’t ‘strong enough for PL’, he was transitioning from youth football and will now have toughened up playing the open-age game.

 

[Philw]

The only benefits I see are to expose them to full open age football with crowds and see how they adapt in different systems and pressures. I actually think the performances are almost secondary. That said, the variety of experiences Dowell has had, and the positive impacts he has been able to make in different teams and formations, with different managers and styles, stand him in good stead and rather than being used as a negative against him, I feel it reflects well on his character.

Whilst I wouldn't call them the only benefits, I definitely feel this is a big part of the loan experience that many fans seem to miss/ignore. It's not just about going somewhere and being the best player on the pitch every match (not that that hurts!), but about showing how you cope with everything the comes with being a part of 'real' football.

...if I’m honest, I’m not the biggest fan. History at Everton suggests Academy players sent on loan have no significant future here (I‘ve said I can only think of Osman and Barkley who played over 50 games and both of those had bad injury at a significant stage of their development). Loans tend to be more of a shop window.

Lots of academy players don't make it at all, and very very few go straight from u18s/23s to the first team. Look at how succesful we have been at times with players coming in from lower leagues - Jags, Baines(?), Stones, Holgate, DCL, Brainthwaite. If those players had been in (or stayed in!) our system they might never have got those opportunities to improve their games and impress if they didn't go on loan. The majority of players who get in to our first team will have proved themselves in open age football somewhere at a lower level than ours, not jumped straight from a youth team somewhere. If they are already part of the club the only way they can do that is on loan.

...it is, Matey, but its still very much down to a youngster taking the chance when it’s presented. Davies is a good example as is Holgate. Holgate looked on his way out, but failure to bring in Zouma on transfer deadline day meant he was needed as back-up to Mina/Keane. Luck played a part but he got an opportunity and grasped it.

 

[blueconverse]

Really hope we retain Dowell as a squad option if we can loan/sell some of the other dross.

 

[blueblue]

I would guess that Dowell, Kenny and Gibson will all be part of the squad for pre season and decisions will be made on their futures at that stage.

 

[Pabbers]

The 5 subs thing may have given some acad lads a last chance at the club.

 

[Eggs]

I would guess that Dowell, Kenny and Gibson will all be part of the squad for pre season and decisions will be made on their futures at that stage.

...not sure there’ll be much of a pre-season.

I expect the club will be looking to move Kenny and Dowell on permanent deals whilst giving Gibson a season long loan but with revised timescales, transfers might not happen until after the season starts.

 

[Toffe3m4n]

Dowell was randomly name-dropped in the presser yesterday. Ancelotti has been keeping tabs, reckons he's done well at Wigan.