2015 post UK election discussion

[Clint Planet]

This thread is the fastest way to sniff out whoppers and lose friends.

That Donald Twain is a bit of a bell, isn't he?

 

[peteblue]

no, so they have more opportunities and less risk. It's called equality

But risk, as any risk practitioner will tell you consists of both negative and positive risk, or as some call it risk and opportunity.......but there's a five day study on it's own.......

 

[peteblue]

That Donald Twain is a bit of a bell, isn't he?

Got him marked mate.......

 

[Tubey]

Does anyone reckon that there is a case for the people from the north just feeling sorry for ourselves, and always feeling hard done by?

So, that's a no then. The cuts have hit the north disproportionately, with hardly any private investment replacing it.

The north is hard done by, it's economically proven.

 

[The Esk]

There's risk and then there's RISK though. In my mind, at least. The risk of not being able to provide for my own child is one I'm simply not prepared to take - it's just not comparable to the risk of buying an expensive car (for instance) and hoping you can keep up with the finance payments, because in that scenario the car doesn't suffer if it all goes wrong.

Can you see that someone who thinks like I do (as best as I can explain it) would resent paying extra in taxes to cover those who have taken the risk you describe, only for that risk to go wrong? I would view it as a kick in the teeth, punishment for my own prudence. For anyone that thinks along these lines, the contrary is not something we would EVER vote for.

I understand your thinking even if I don't necessarily agree with it.

The point about taking risks is the probability of success or failure. I'm not talking about being reckless, and I'm not asking tax payers to underwrite those risks.

I think you're confusing your own micro-situation with the macro. The point is, if you have ability and opportunity (which I'm guessing you have) - that combined with incentive (kid on way or present) will generate more income for most than ability, opportunity and incentive (kid on the way in x years)

 

[daylightrobber]

But the reason why they're unaffordable would be because the area is improving not deteriorating. I can't afford to live in my parents area either.

So, the long term impact this has on the country's finances is significant. If there are people who would otherwise live in the same community as their parents but are forced out for one reason or another, the likelihood is that they will not be there to care for their parents in their old age. The tax payer will inevitably pick up the tab.

There are plenty of other reasons why keeping a broad range of demographics in local communities is essential. By not doing so, there will inevitably be issues with employment, provision of facilities for all, including schools and adequate retail. There will also be knock ons to health provision whilst often seeing increased need (especially in the mental sector). Its complicated alright. Like I've stated previously, when the youth are priced out, there is literally no one there to provide for the elderly.

 

[marty mcfly]

This thread is the fastest way to sniff out whoppers and lose friends.

Only a whopper would judge anyone on political views. It leads to political discrimination and an us verses them zero sum game dynamic to be played out. Look at American politics and how they're conducted to see the danger.

 

[LouReedwalkonthewildside]

So, that's a no then. The cuts have hit the north disproportionately, with hardly any private investment replacing it.

The north is hard done by, it's economically proven.

The sad thing for me being an Huyton lad, I now live in the South East.

 

[Clint Planet]

Clint, I know you and I disagree about almost everything. That's just the way things seem to be, and I can deal with that. But do you honestly think that you persuade anyone to give more credence to your way of thinking when you don't even explain it? Pointing at someone and calling them a bigot doesn't counter their point in any way - it make sit clear that you disagree, but it stops there.

I see you're suddenly responding to my posts about other people. And yet when I addressed you......

Hombre, the man just said single-parent families were a threat to society. I'll leave it at that..

 

[Donald Twain]

Only a whopper would judge anyone on political views. It leads to political discrimination and an us verses them zero sum game dynamic to be played out. Look at American politics and how they're conducted to see the danger.

Whopper!

 

[The Esk]

Hard to argue against anything Blair has said in his Observer article tomorrow. Echoes much of what I said earlier in the thread.

Christ I am getting worried, find myself agreeing far too much with Blair of late.

With Blair everyone is a winner....

 

[Donald Twain]

That Donald Twain is a bit of a bell, isn't he?

Cheers for the black arts.

 

[The Esk]

Hard to argue against anything Blair has said in his Observer article tomorrow. Echoes much of what I said earlier in the thread.

Christ I am getting worried, find myself agreeing far too much with Blair of late.

“The Labour party has to be for ambition as well as compassion and care. Hard-working families don’t just want us celebrating their hard work; they want to know that by hard work and effort they can rise up, achieve. They want to be better off and they need to know we don’t just tolerate that, we support it.”

Similar to what I tried to say but more eloquent

 

[Tubey]

The sad thing for me being an Huyton lad, I now live in the South East.

You should be able to see the difference like night and day then.

Since the industrial collapse, the north has had little to no private investment, and has killed great swathes of the country that has never recovered. Manufacturing is dead, and the financial service industry that dominates the south hasn't moved up north at all, so we see no benefit.

It's the core reason the "Big Society" idiocy was exactly that - idiocy. The Tory philosophy that cutting the size of the state will mean more space for private enterprise for flourish simply doesn't work in the north of England, and is the core reason for the North/South Divide. They've had 30+ years to get this into their thick skulls and it still hasn't sunk in - so they cut government services even more from the north in the hope that something will click.

It should be like a see-saw - if private enterprise and wealth creation is occurring in an area, cut the size of the state there. If it isn't, increase it. The exact opposite happens under the Tories.

This map says it all.

And people wonder why large sections of this government hate the Tories - protect the wealthy at every turn, screw the poor.

 

[Clint Planet]

It's called equality

****ALARM BELLS GO OFF****

Seriously, it's incredible how much some people object to the idea of people being treated the same. Not everyone given the same amount of money. Just being given, as far as is possible, a fair crack of the whip.

Is it really too much to ask? If it is, how poor we are as a nation. Poorer than we think.