Ademola Lookman

[Lelouch]

Lookman is an outstanding talent. It's just a shame all of his professional coaches so far haven't been able to see it when they see him train and play every day. More fool them for focusing on things like "looking" or "watching" a player and judging him on what he "does" with a "football".

I mean, not to talk down to some of you, but the subtleties of the game seem a little beyond your scope. I could explain to you all about Lookman's x-Internalised_Ideas, his Intentions He Changed His Mind About per minute, or his Dream Last Night of a Backheel, but it feels like I'd be talking to a load of neanderthals, imho.

Is this pasta

 

[Grinch]

A kid with all the talent and no heart. Little rat that!

 

[marnie]

Little Raheem wannabe.At least he'll get free school diners now.RAT.

 

[Groucho]

Waste of space

 

[Papa Shango]

If you care to elaborate, I'm interested, but I don't understand what you mean.

For stats to really work you need a somewhat stable environment. Like a flow of information. The very nature of football does not work for this as other than it being 11 vs 11 everything else changes on a game by game basis. Can you judge a winger on his key passes lets say if he plays for a crap team who never sees the ball? What if they never use said winger correctly or of he plays great passes all the time but his team mates are rubbish? None of this stuff is really taken into account.

Lets say the winger plays in Spain and Everton want him. It is nigh on impossible to gain anything from his statistics when if we sign him he will be playing with different team mates, against different teams, in a different climate. What if he has issues at home? What if he doesn't like a team mate?

There are far too many variables, not just in football to gain accurate usable information.

I would say the only thing stats may give you is a very slight insight on the right places to look. For example if you did want a winger with a good cross on him you could check stats to see how many assists he has as it would make more sense to look at someone who has the assists than someone who doesn't but to make a decision on those stats would be madness. The winger may have a Bas Dost type figure to aim at yet the team wanting to sign him could have a short player up front so the stats don't work.

I always imagine the OPTA creators to be laughing all the way to the bank as people look over stats like duels won and key passes which don't really mean anything.

 

[TheBigIguana]

For stats to really work you need a somewhat stable environment. Like a flow of information. The very nature of football does not work for this as other than it being 11 vs 11 everything else changes on a game by game basis. Can you judge a winger on his key passes lets say if he plays for a crap team who never sees the ball? What if they never use said winger correctly or of he plays great passes all the time but his team mates are rubbish? None of this stuff is really taken into account.

Lets say the winger plays in Spain and Everton want him. It is nigh on impossible to gain anything from his statistics when if we sign him he will be playing with different team mates, against different teams, in a different climate. What if he has issues at home? What if he doesn't like a team mate?

There are far too many variables, not just in football to gain accurate usable information.

I would say the only thing stats may give you is a very slight insight on the right places to look. For example if you did want a winger with a good cross on him you could check stats to see how many assists he has as it would make more sense to look at someone who has the assists than someone who doesn't but to make a decision on those stats would be madness. The winger may have a Bas Dost type figure to aim at yet the team wanting to sign him could have a short player up front so the stats don't work.

I always imagine the OPTA creators to be laughing all the way to the bank as people look over stats like duels won and key passes which don't really mean anything.

A stable environment like a game where the rules are exactly the same every time it is played? I'm kidding but only a little.

For real though all the things you bring up are pretty valid, although some of them have been accounted for more than I think you know. For example something like the amount the team has the ball is frequently included when showing how many tackles and interceptions defenders and defensive midfielders make.

The part about figuring out a crap team vs a good team is also a fair thing to worry about, but it is pretty easy to adjust for mentally. And the gap tends to not be as outrageous as you'd think. For example DCL and Richarlison are competitive with the RS players despite the RS being the clearly superior team. The only team in the PL that sets itself apart to the point of needing to be taken with a grain of salt in an attacking sense is City since Pep took over.

Some of the things aren't really the job of the stats to decode. They're supposed to be a snapshot of what a player does in games. An answer to why or why not isn't really what they are there for. If as you said a player is struggling to fit in, the stats will show him just struggling, and the job of the person looking at the stats is to try and figure out why and make decisions on it.

You say OPTA is laughing but the truth is the RS use data extensively and are running away with the league. Juve use it, City use it and I'm sure other successful sides do too. It isn't meant to make every decision, but it is a useful tool.

Lastly, I do enjoy that you started this by telling me I shouldn't assume people on here don't like stats and then proceeded to explain how you don't think they hold water at all! lol

 

[KaiserEFC]

It disgusts me that someone with his attitude can become a multi-millionaire. Set for life just from the signing on fees he gets from being moved on for being a massive belter.

 

[longers]

The level of unnecessary hate this lad gets is bizarre. People talk as if he's the new Balotelli or something despite him being miles off... he hasn't had a single controversial incident in his carrier and yet people talk as if he's the textbook example of everything that is wrong with footballers.

Football fans are weird as **** sometimes

 

[Yarrgh]

I don't rate Bernard because he is an attacker who doesn't shoot and who plays a lot of passes from more dangerous areas to less dangerous areas. I also think the build up stuff that people praise him for a lot is overblown, he is fine at it, but not good enough to make up for what he doesn't do in the attacking third.

I also will freely admit that him playing 2000 minutes last year while Lookman played 500 pissed me off and if he starts every game on the left down the stretch here instead of letting Iwobi and/or Gordon try to develop it'll piss me off again.

I was gonna give you a chance. Lookman yes but Bernard no? Boo!

 

[TheBigIguana]

I was gonna give you a chance. Lookman yes but Bernard no? Boo!

I've tried to explain it, I know a lot don't agree, but it is just how I view players. My opinion is Lookman is the best winger we've had here since Mirallas in 2013 or 2014 and the only thing that prevented him from making that abundantly clear was playing time.

Now did he maybe do things that justify him not playing? I never saw them on the pitch, but maybe he really was awful in training. And if that is true than that is fine, but I don't give Marco Silva, Ronald Koeman or Sam Allardyce the benefit of the doubt.

Anyway hope you'll give me another chance!

 

[Goat]

I've tried to explain it, I know a lot don't agree, but it is just how I view players. My opinion is Lookman is the best winger we've had here since Mirallas in 2013 or 2014 and the only thing that prevented him from making that abundantly clear was playing time.

Now did he maybe do things that justify him not playing? I never saw them on the pitch, but maybe he really was awful in training. And if that is true than that is fine, but I don't give Marco Silva, Ronald Koeman or Sam Allardyce the benefit of the doubt.

Anyway hope you'll give me another chance!

Geri was better.

So is Bernie.

And Walcott.

And Iwobi.

Hell even McGeady.

You don't help yourself sometimes yano.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Geri was better.

So is Bernie.

And Walcott.

And Iwobi.

Hell even McGeady.

You don't help yourself sometimes yano.

Forgot Geri lol that's true.

Walcott absolutely not. I like Walcott and think people are harsh on him, but he really is pretty average when he is at his best even.

Iwobi is tbd.

McGeady made me laugh so thanks for that.

 

[sdk]

I recently watched Everton's four goal smashing of City from several years back and was surprised to recall that Lookman scored the fourth. It'd totally slipped my mind even though at the time I hoped it was a good augury. Alas.

Aside: It was tough seeing Deulofeu leave. Whenever he picked up the ball I'd lean forward in anticipation. I hope he comes back from his injury with extra superpowers.

 

[BigBlueConk]

I recently watched Everton's four goal smashing of City from several years back and was surprised to recall that Lookman scored the fourth. It'd totally slipped my mind even though at the time I hoped it was a good augury. Alas.

Aside: It was tough seeing Deulofeu leave. Whenever he picked up the ball I'd lean forward in anticipation. I hope he comes back from his injury with extra superpowers.

That was the best game Lookman and Tom played for us!
Had us waiting for more.....still waiting!

 

[Lanolin]

The level of unnecessary hate this lad gets is bizarre. People talk as if he's the new Balotelli or something despite him being miles off... he hasn't had a single controversial incident in his carrier and yet people talk as if he's the textbook example of everything that is wrong with footballers.

Football fans are weird as **** sometimes

I’m not sure what controversial incidents have got to do with anything? The suggestion is that lookman doesn’t have a very good attitude and that he made a big fuss about wanting to go to Leipzig because only they could see his true worth... only to get even less games there than here.

I have no idea what he’s like as a person but it’s pretty obvious why people call him out I think.