Confirmed Signing Allan

[Goat]

The way formations are written in numbers is failing to catch up with the game too. The best example is the RS who play a 4-3-3 when you right it out but in possession often end up in kind of a 2-1-4-1-2 because of how their fullbacks push on and Firmino drops off. Bayern are another one who push the fullbacks way up so saying they're playing 4-2-3-1 is kind of off. Then you've got City who will sometimes push the fullbacks on but also have them drop in as CMs or CBs. Just using the numbers misses a lot.

All that said our current formation with literally two guys trying to do all the central midfield stuff is not something many successful teams are doing. Even Atletico who are the most successful modern 4-4-2 side often play Koke as a "winger" but have him often coming into the center to help out when they're in possession. I think we will have to adjust in some way for it to work.

Given Carlos words today I can defo see him tweaking the 442 for next season.

 

[TheBigIguana]

Its not an argument mate just sharing alternate opinions on a forum. We sold Gueye for 27M who was 29 and our best midfielder, since then we have had no engine. We need a midfielder for the now, Carlo want's results now.. If Allan was 25/26 we would probably be priced out, I always look to Distin when we bought him and people thought we were wasting money on a 30 year old but what a player he was for us.

I think he's said a couple times he is here for a longer project. Regardless I don't think Allan is so good that we can't find someone close enough to his level now but who is younger and might exceed him in the coming years. I don't deny that he'd help us immediately but we are also a good deal away from where we need to be so I'm ok with a slower build up.

 

[Osamabindiesel]

He's not suppose to be a game changing player, he's suppose to be the engine in midfield? he's mobile and likes a tackle, looks to be a clever player which our squad is clearly lacking. We need bite in midfield, id hope that another midfielder would be brought in for creativity.

Age is not an issue when he is clearly an athlete.

Hugely disagree on that. That’s not to say he can’t adapt as he grows older or maintain a good bit of pace as he ages, but you have to prepare for the decline with a lot of older players. He better be damned good if we are bringing him in on the money Napoli want

 

[Brownie]

The way formations are written in numbers is failing to catch up with the game too. The best example is the RS who play a 4-3-3 when you right it out but in possession often end up in kind of a 2-1-4-1-2 because of how their fullbacks push on and Firmino drops off. Bayern are another one who push the fullbacks way up so saying they're playing 4-2-3-1 is kind of off. Then you've got City who will sometimes push the fullbacks on but also have them drop in as CMs or CBs. Just using the numbers misses a lot.

All that said our current formation with literally two guys trying to do all the central midfield stuff is not something many successful teams are doing. Even Atletico who are the most successful modern 4-4-2 side often play Koke as a "winger" but have him often coming into the center to help out when they're in possession. I think we will have to adjust in some way for it to work.

This isn't exactly new though is it? Writing out formations as a series of numbers has always been limited.

 

[ProZ]

I think he's said a couple times he is here for a longer project. Regardless I don't think Allan is so good that we can't find someone close enough to his level now but who is younger and might exceed him in the coming years. I don't deny that he'd help us immediately but we are also a good deal away from where we need to be so I'm ok with a slower build up.

A longer project yes, but it's always going to be a long project no matter how much we spend that doesn't mean he wants a bunch of 22 year olds, this day and age managers won't get years waiting for players to mature, they will be punted.

 

[ProZ]

Hugely disagree on that. That’s not to say he can’t adapt as he grows older or maintain a good bit of pace as he ages, but you have to prepare for the decline with a lot of older players. He better be damned good if we are bringing him in on the money Napoli want

He's twice as fast now as the donkeys we have in MF at the minute, so we could have him until hes 40 and he'd still come out on top

 

[Arteta10]

The way formations are written in numbers is failing to catch up with the game too. The best example is the RS who play a 4-3-3 when you right it out but in possession often end up in kind of a 2-1-4-1-2 because of how their fullbacks push on and Firmino drops off. Bayern are another one who push the fullbacks way up so saying they're playing 4-2-3-1 is kind of off. Then you've got City who will sometimes push the fullbacks on but also have them drop in as CMs or CBs. Just using the numbers misses a lot.

All that said our current formation with literally two guys trying to do all the central midfield stuff is not something many successful teams are doing. Even Atletico who are the most successful modern 4-4-2 side often play Koke as a "winger" but have him often coming into the center to help out when they're in possession. I think we will have to adjust in some way for it to work.

This isn't exactly new though is it? Writing out formations as a series of numbers has always been limited.

The best way to see the true formation of the team is to look at the 'average positions map' that they sometimes show.

In the modern game 9 times out of 10 the fullbacks in an attacking side will be much higher up the pitch than a typical formation line up would indicate

 

[TheBigIguana]

This isn't exactly new though is it? Writing out formations as a series of numbers has always been limited.

No it isn't but it has gotten more limited I think. In the 80s when teams were playing 4-4-2 they were actually more often than not playing 4-4-2 in general play. Occasionally maybe a striker dropped off or something but it was reasonably close. Fullbacks weren't playing as essentially wide midfielders like today which for me is the biggest problem.

I feel like we're kind of in that no man's land with the numbers like they were long ago when teams stopped playing 2-3-5 but everyone still listed the team as a 2-3-5.

 

[tommytowne]

I think he's said a couple times he is here for a longer project. Regardless I don't think Allan is so good that we can't find someone close enough to his level now but who is younger and might exceed him in the coming years. I don't deny that he'd help us immediately but we are also a good deal away from where we need to be so I'm ok with a slower build up.

I'm hanging on his utterances that this job is a project for him and that he's not scuttling off anytime soon. I'm playing devils advocate here when I say that he's played the less able lads to show Brands and Co that they're cack and need moving out ASAP.
I'm banking on him being here after being promised he's gonna get the keys to BMD to display his team that he has studiously built in the interim.

I really should knock off the dark rum and coke this early in the day.

 

[TheBigIguana]

The best way to see the true formation of the team is to look at the 'average positions map' that they sometimes show.

In the modern game 9 times out of 10 the fullbacks in an attacking side will be much higher up the pitch than a typical formation line up would indicate

I agree with this but if it is not always met with the most kindness from the traditionalists.

 

[Osamabindiesel]

He's twice as fast now as the donkeys we have in MF at the minute, so we could have him until hes 40 and he'd still come out on top

That’s not really an endorsement as our midfielders are tortoises. He needs to back up the price for his age or he isn’t worth it

 

[Nymzee]

I would but we won't.

 

[ProZ]

That’s not really an endorsement as our midfielders are tortoises. He needs to back up the price for his age or he isn’t worth it

To be fair would I prefer not to have sold Gueye at 29yo for 27M? the answer is yes, the energy he brought to our team was unbelievable, right now I just want players to carry us to the new stadium, if Carlo thinks they are good enough then Im in, we can't afford or attract Pogba or prime worldies.

 

[Stephenlloyd]

I think he's said a couple times he is here for a longer project. Regardless I don't think Allan is so good that we can't find someone close enough to his level now but who is younger and might exceed him in the coming years. I don't deny that he'd help us immediately but we are also a good deal away from where we need to be so I'm ok with a slower build up.

He maybe here for a long project, but he will also want to make signings that improve us straight away.

The problem we have, is we can’t attract world class players unless, they are right at the end of their careers or even past their best. We can’t get the best players who are 23 to 26. So we have gambled on 2nd rate players in the age bracket that have failed elsewhere.

Digne has worked out, Mina & Gomes and iwobi have failed so far. Or we gamble on youngsters. Richarlison has been a success and Kean a failure so far.

And if we keep buying young players, it will be a never ending project, with probably Richarlison and Digne going next summer, holgate the following summer, if he keeps improving.

So a mixture of young players and one or two around the Allan age is what’s needed imo.

 

[jazzy]

The way formations are written in numbers is failing to catch up with the game too. The best example is the RS who play a 4-3-3 when you right it out but in possession often end up in kind of a 2-1-4-1-2 because of how their fullbacks push on and Firmino drops off. Bayern are another one who push the fullbacks way up so saying they're playing 4-2-3-1 is kind of off. Then you've got City who will sometimes push the fullbacks on but also have them drop in as CMs or CBs. Just using the numbers misses a lot.

All that said our current formation with literally two guys trying to do all the central midfield stuff is not something many successful teams are doing. Even Atletico who are the most successful modern 4-4-2 side often play Koke as a "winger" but have him often coming into the center to help out when they're in possession. I think we will have to adjust in some way for it to work.

This is a good analysis. I don't think CA plays a traditional 4-4-2 with 2 wingers.
At least one of the wingers is encouraged to come inside to help the central 2.