Bestway site first pics (or should I say pic haha!!)

[Bruce Wayne]

On a serious note though I don't really get this argument about being inside the city boundaries. The article on the TW site had the nerve to use Twickenham as an example of a great city stadia hosting huge rock concerts, as though that's anywhere near the centre of London. I went there once and it took me an hour to drive down Fulham road. Sod that for a game of soldiers.

I know people will argue that it's a different country etc. but I also fail to see many Americans in on the discussion of location. After all aren't nearly all new US stadia built out of town? Shopping centres are built out of town, precisely because it makes it easier to get to. I really don't buy this argument that because we're a few miles from our current location that every Tom, Dick and Harry will turn their nose up at us.

 

[gordonjblair]

Thing is.... put some proper architecture on the outside (maybe have that cacky tower replaced with something echoing the Lock up on the Crest), make sure there's some proper acoustics on the inside, stands towering over the pitch (pretty much a necessity given the footprint) and it could be a real home - IF they could prove the Business Case.

IF

that's a big if

 

[gordonjblair]

On a serious note though I don't really get this argument about being inside the city boundaries. The article on the TW site had the nerve to use Twickenham as an example of a great city stadia hosting huge rock concerts, as though that's anywhere near the centre of London. I went there once and it took me an hour to drive down Fulham road. Sod that for a game of soldiers.

I know people will argue that it's a different country etc. but I also fail to see many Americans in on the discussion of location. After all aren't nearly all new US stadia built out of town? Shopping centres are built out of town, precisely because it makes it easier to get to. I really don't buy this argument that because we're a few miles from our current location that every Tom, Dick and Harry will turn their nose up at us.

dont' disagree... we probably won't lose trade by being in Kirkby, but we would stand to gain a lot more by being in the City Centre. Not 'in the City', but the City Centre, a walk from Lime Street.

smell that corporate dollar

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I'm not sure. Do you have any evidence to back up city centre stadia revenue? There just seems a lot of evidence against it. I know most new US stadia are built out of town because they have car parks the size of Kirkby but that can't be the only reason. I expect even the new Arsenal stadium is further from the City of London than Kirkby is to Liverpool centre.

In the 'financial analysis' thread I had a look into the finances and particularly the revenue generation at Man Utd and the 'walk in business' is tiny. They make more money from Asia than they do from the UK. Their credit card has over 125,000 users. They no doubt make good money from their store and museum etc. but I'm not sure either of those gets much walk in business. The museum especially is more of a day trip kind of thing.

 

[gordonjblair]

but I think we're after different markets.. as a club, we haven't even made a dent in the Corporate hosting arena, a combined conference and hotel facility in a freshly redeveloped area on the doorstep of the City' Business Community has to have more potential than a Stadium overlooking the motorway on the outskirts of the City Region.

A hotel and leisure facility within walking distance of all the major city centre attractions, with views over the City (possibly the River, depending on architecture) and the ground itself, probably has more appeal than a really big Tesco and some shops.

Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with the Kirkby proposal... I just believe that a professional organisation would perform a proper rigourous option selection exercise under these circumstances, rather than pushing through with a back covering (perhaps, a little unfair - me, not the vote) referendum

 

[Bruce Wayne]

On the surface that would seem logical, although I have to say I don't know what motivates people to take corporate boxes, or indeed use the corporate facilities on non-match days. With the addition of these extra facilities being the prime reason for the move however you would hope the club have done some research into the market for them and how best to serve that market.

 

[gordonjblair]

On the surface that would seem logical, although I have to say I don't know what motivates people to take corporate boxes, or indeed use the corporate facilities on non-match days. With the addition of these extra facilities being the prime reason for the move however you would hope the club have done some research into the market for them and how best to serve that market.

you would hope...

I'd just like to see if there really is any substance behind this option, put up or shut up type of thing.... if it turns out to be baseless then they can ram it and we go to Kirkby happy... if, however, it could be a goer.... we get to choose, maybe even use the fact we have options to strengthen our negotiation position a little... stranger things have happened

 

[Rob]

The one thing that people are missing that strikes me about this loop thing... it has about 30 yards worth of grass and then surrounded by two main roads...

This causes so many problems straight away surely....

 

[Dylan]

but I think we're after different markets.. as a club, we haven't even made a dent in the Corporate hosting arena, a combined conference and hotel facility in a freshly redeveloped area on the doorstep of the City' Business Community has to have more potential than a Stadium overlooking the motorway on the outskirts of the City Region.

A hotel and leisure facility within walking distance of all the major city centre attractions, with views over the City (possibly the River, depending on architecture) and the ground itself, probably has more appeal than a really big Tesco and some shops.

Don't get me wrong, I don't have a problem with the Kirkby proposal... I just believe that a professional organisation would perform a proper rigourous option selection exercise under these circumstances, rather than pushing through with a back covering (perhaps, a little unfair - me, not the vote) referendum

UNLESS.........we make Kirkby the commercial center of the region!!!!

 

[Dom1878]

Looks a nice little 30,000 stadium - Is it for the reserves?

Would be a good reserve stadium.

I ahte the people who are proposing this, even if we could fit the kirkby stadium into scotland road it would be [Poor language removed]!!!, no parking, the ques would go on to the road, etc....

KEIOC are selfish bastards, who cant see the bigger picture, everton are a club with no city, it doesnt matter if we go to kirkby or anywhere else, The team are the same, the fans are the same, if not better becasue we are branching out the everton empire, and with a new better stadium we will attract more fans!!!

Kirkby is the logical solution.

 

[Royal Blue Jersey]

I agree completely Dom. I've got reservations about Kirkby - who doesn't? - but the KEIOC [Poor language removed] has resorted to desperation. this is bulllshit and anyone can see it, it's a house built on stilts, these plans will never work.
I'm starting to think, even though it's a big fuckup by the board, there isn't any Plan B. We're just not rich enough to build our own - that's why we're getting Tesco to build one for us. It's either move now, or stay in Goodison forever...and we need to move on.

 

[McBain]

This thread needs a devils advocate, and here I am baby.

You guys are seriously on drugs.

Youve even jumped on a typo by some poor journo.

Heres a plan, without you beaut Hollywood graphics. Its an early basic 'proposal'. Sorry if the pictures arent up to your mspaint standards.

Dont you realise they can do amazing things architecturally nowadays?

The build airports in the middle of harbours nowadays. Have you seen what they are doing in Dubai? This is a very early 'proposal'. I worked on the Darling Harbour project in Sydney and they built three office towers and a beautiful garden, linking with the monorail and the pyrmont bridge over three or four existing roadways.

No grudges, or malice intended, but for crikeys out loud! Get a grip and pull your heads in. Got a better plan? Then go present it.

 

[Rob]

This thread needs a devils advocate, and here I am baby.

You guys are seriously on drugs.

Youve even jumped on a typo by some poor journo.

Heres a plan, without you beaut Hollywood graphics. Its an early basic 'proposal'. Sorry if the pictures arent up to your mspaint standards.

Dont you realise they can do amazing things architecturally nowadays?

The build airports in the middle of harbours nowadays. Have you seen what they are doing in Dubai? This is a very early 'proposal'. I worked on the Darling Harbour project in Sydney and they built three office towers and a beautiful garden, linking with the monorail and the pyrmont bridge over three or four existing roadways.

No grudges, or malice intended, but for crikeys out loud! Get a grip and pull your heads in. Got a better plan? Then go present it.

Alright then mcbain, try this one on for size -

"Who is paying for this stadium should it go ahead?"

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I'll throw in a few pennies from my royalties if you're nice

 

[gordonjblair]

I agree completely Dom. I've got reservations about Kirkby - who doesn't? - but the KEIOC [Poor language removed] has resorted to desperation. this is bulllshit and anyone can see it, it's a house built on stilts, these plans will never work.
I'm starting to think, even though it's a big fuckup by the board, there isn't any Plan B. We're just not rich enough to build our own - that's why we're getting Tesco to build one for us. It's either move now, or stay in Goodison forever...and we need to move on.

if you want to show the KEIOC brigade for what they are, what better way to do it than say, ok, we're listening, stand up on the stage and demonstrate exactly how this is going to work.b)

by ignoring them, nobody's getting the chance to properly debunk the myth.

As an aside, the geographical constraints really wouldn't be a problem, the site could be pretty easily bridged to provide the concourse they put in with their crayons ... what needs to be demonstrated by LCC and Bestway is an adequate funding proposal and mid/long term business case.

But if we don't ask, they'll always be able to whinge on about it, claiming that it would have worked