bit of Guardian history: a funny thing happened in 2009, when Comment is Free was still truly free. Online-commenting on current affairs was only a few years old. It felt very exciting, like a genuine new Frontier. While there was a bit of Left-vs-Right going on, it was nowhere near as poisonous or harshly-polarising as it is nowadays.
Still, The Guardian thought of itself as a Left-leaning paper, and of its readers too. It decided to do a public poll where registered commenters could vote for who was their favourite commenter of the year. Back then we had a few decent candidates, but one particular stood out: his monikor was moveanymountain (affectionately MAM for short). His posts were from a conservative rightwing perspective: but his persistent hard logic often took articles (and other commenters) utterly apart. He was a right-leaning Davek.
To the Guardian's surprise, MAM won the Readers' Poll. The prize? He gets to write an article himself. His piece?
No. No. No.
This 'Guardian' as a left leaning paper is nonsense. Historically yes, but since the left only had marginal representation post Blair and Mandelson this era of wokeness by your own regard pervaded all commentary, as a business decision the paper followed suit. You speak as 'we'.
You are tub thumping. Ranting.
Just what was your epiphany?
I'm aware of most of that history too, but right now my point still stands: the folks who rail against "woke" are not thinking for themselves and are being fear-mongered by Christian right/far right into believing some of the most ridiculous stereotypes (e.g., all gay people are rainbow-wearing twerkers who wear scanty clothes; BLM is an arm of Antifa, kindergarten teachers are teaching white 6yr olds to hate their whiteness, etc. etc.).
Oh I get that. Truly I do. It's like a perpetual quid pro quo now, accusatory and derogatory phrases are thrown to get a response which is then used to 'justify' the original accusation.
All that 'seperates' left from right is the left generally speaking want to help those persecuted while the right are belligerent weirdos so frightened by difference that their very existence becomes threatened and they find a scapegoat(s) to blame. Which is nice.
Why are people so bothered? The answer almost always trails back to Abrahamic religion. Wether that's commandments or misinterpretation or actual verbatim hatred it can all be found in the Bible, Torah and Koran.
Oh I get that. Truly I do. It's like a perpetual quid pro quo now, accusatory and derogatory phrases are thrown to get a response which is then used to 'justify' the original accusation.
All that 'seperates' left from right is the left generally speaking want to help those persecuted while the right are belligerent weirdos so frightened by difference that their very existence becomes threatened and they find a scapegoat(s) to blame. Which is nice.
Why are people so bothered? The answer almost always trails back to Abrahamic religion. Wether that's commandments or misinterpretation or actual verbatim hatred it can all be found in the Bible, Torah and Koran.
bit of Guardian history: a funny thing happened in 2009, when Comment is Free was still truly free. Online-commenting on current affairs was only a few years old. It felt very exciting, like a genuine new Frontier. While there was a bit of Left-vs-Right going on, it was nowhere near as poisonous or harshly-polarising as it is nowadays.
Still, The Guardian thought of itself as a Left-leaning paper, and of its readers too. It decided to do a public poll where registered commenters could vote for who was their favourite commenter of the year. Back then we had a few decent candidates, but one particular stood out: his monikor was moveanymountain (affectionately MAM for short). His posts were from a conservative rightwing perspective: but his persistent hard logic often took articles (and other commenters) utterly apart. He was a right-leaning Davek.
To the Guardian's surprise, MAM won the Readers' Poll. The prize? He gets to write an article himself. His piece?
oh aye...i believe this pattern-recognition ability is located in the same area of the brain responsible for faith (belief systems). The same ability that also enables us to do cool stuff like understand mathematics and develop complex technology. Timothy Leary (infamous LSD-prophet) wrote about this in his final book Design For Dying.
Oddly, so did Ron Hubbard in Dianetics...the first half of which is genuinely interesting, thereafter it went full-on crazy so i switched off...but that first half making sense is how he snared a lot of scientology-believers.
haha not wrong there! himself
making an appearance in the later books
was cringe as fook.
He's often struggled in the final furlong of his stories...but is one of the world's best at setting one up.
aye...i have regular conversations with muslim mates...sometimes they're really enthused when i express similar views, but then get rocked back when our views radically differ on another issue.
Belief Systems are fine, but in my view they shouldn't define one's opinions on things...only you the individual should define that.
I'm not religious...but there is something to this God-business...just not sure what exactly, and i'm content not knowing until after this life has passed (a lesson from psychonauting, that one).
Thanks Dixie...not long ago most debates were like this: open to possibilities. Only the last 10 years or so we've somehow regressed to this polarisation we have now.
Disappointing response, but the narrative runs very deep.
As for JP: he's genuinely helped a lot of lost anxious males. I'm glad i've not been lost or anxious, but i do understand that mindset...it leads to all kinds of self-destruction. JP has helped a bunch of such souls.
As open-minded and outspoken as you are, i expect even you put the brakes on regarding certain subjects. There's minefields out there x
Yes, well said oddlad.
This particular destruction of the individual is like a polar opposite to the type of ego-death psychonauts seek. The Far Left ideal of individual-death means a surrender to the collective, something which famously Orwell warned us about in 1984. And also highlighted the hypocrisy of such in Animal Farm, where the woke rules don't apply to everyone: the phrase it's ok when we do it! has replaced Four Legs good, Two Legs better!
In that respect nothing much has changed...these things come in cycles, only due to online-media we're hyper-aware of it.
But that is now a Far Left belief. That men identifying as women should be classed as women. It's established.
See the fuss around JK Rowling, nominally a 'liberal darling', but latterly a transphobe.
Agree with this bit.
You replied to my Covid post from a few days ago with this:
At the time i assumed you personally know of a handful of "deceased healthy sporty-types 20somethings" due to Covid. I think I realise now you was talking hypothetically...which is of course total nonsense, considering the statistical probabability of such a person dying of Covid is near to one-in-a-million.
Can you confirm what you meant, and if you agree it was nonsense?
dozens of innocent people died.
Yes. The minimum age for mainstream cheerleading performance is 18.
What about their dances is sexual to you?
No you don't. Or you didn't a few days ago.
Aside from the obvious: that such mass assaults hasn't happened in Western cities in living memory: here are your posts from a few days ago:
Mind's gone.
Well said again.
It shouldn't be, but it is becoming so. Support for Drag Queens in schools is gaining mainstream traction, as are adult-themed Pride events with Children in the audience.
This has only become a 'rightwing' talking point because the normal Left refuse to believe it's even happening.
But it is, already Dem political-candidates are publicly expressing support for such:
The youth have a lot to answer for...back when i was young we felt a little more responsible for our own words and actions. That seems lost now.
Now the collective is responsible for their words and actions.
That way lies totalitarianism.
Another interesting subject.
1) US Abortion Rights are on average more liberal than many places in Europe, including France and Germany. This will likely continue even after the recent Supreme Court Decision, which merely lets States decide.
2) current science tells us the heart starts beating at 6 weeks in the womb...the question if women really own their body and its contents at that point becomes a matter of debate...do they have the right to end the life within them? How sacred is that life inside the womb? The whole debate isn't as cast-iron as some make out on here.
Agreed.
The question is, who might you be referring to?
Best to stay vague, for it can be true of pretty much everyone on here.
Intent is the key to understanding all this...but no one seems to pay it heed anymore.
Almost agree. It was hijacked by the system to create division, but not as a detrimental term, more as a self-reverential one.
Who, or what, is the system?
Nah, Bizzaro/Damon had a different writing style.
There really is a massive problem of child/young-female sexual-slavery. Even in Berlin, many of the (legal) prostitutes are young women from remote Eastern parts in effective slavehood.
The Epstein-didn't-kill-himself conspiracy should at least open a few eyes that there is a real issue out there.
Quite what Qanon thinks it can do about it is another matter....
What is your opinion on the dozens of innocent people killed as a result of the BLM riots of 2020?
That wokeism is damaging has become common knowledge and accepted doctrine, even amongst liberal organisations, icons & news agencies. GOT-folk are behind the times, man.
Tons more from the likes of 'progressive' sites such as New York Times and Washington Post (behind paywalls) about how wokeism has become a profound problem.
It's not 2017 anymore. Many in the mainstream have now accepted that Woke is poison.
Not anymore it isn't.
The conclusion isn't the interesting thing, the thing that folk wanna talk about is the despite bit.
The vaccine is doing something to men's sperm counts. It's also playing havoc with women's periods, see here and here.
Ergo, the vaccine is affecting the reproductive functions in some way we don't yet fully understand.
Cause for concern when the risk/benefit-ratio of taking the jab appears to present more weight on the risk side.
At least let's hope we can debate these things more openly, especially as the Autumn may bring the next push for jabs.
You seem to be missing the 'Temporarily' part and it was among Sperm Donors. Other studies have shown no increase/decrease post vaccine. It's also worth noting that just focusing on sperm is an imperfect predictor of fertility potential.
And I'm not sure how you reach the conclusion that the risk outweighs the benefit, especially considering the conclusion that the study draws - that their study supports vaccination.
"May temporarily reduce sperm concentration and motilty" is an acceptable side effect of a drug/vaccination.
Plenty of things have a similar impact: using a hot tub, tight underwear, drinking alcohol, some vitamins, using your laptop on your knee. Don't do any of those while you're at it.
oh aye...i believe this pattern-recognition ability is located in the same area of the brain responsible for faith (belief systems). The same ability that also enables us to do cool stuff like understand mathematics and develop complex technology. Timothy Leary (infamous LSD-prophet) wrote about this in his final book Design For Dying.
Oddly, so did Ron Hubbard in Dianetics...the first half of which is genuinely interesting, thereafter it went full-on crazy so i switched off...but that first half making sense is how he snared a lot of scientology-believers.
haha not wrong there! himself
making an appearance in the later books
was cringe as fook.
He's often struggled in the final furlong of his stories...but is one of the world's best at setting one up.
aye...i have regular conversations with muslim mates...sometimes they're really enthused when i express similar views, but then get rocked back when our views radically differ on another issue.
Belief Systems are fine, but in my view they shouldn't define one's opinions on things...only you the individual should define that.
I'm not religious...but there is something to this God-business...just not sure what exactly, and i'm content not knowing until after this life has passed (a lesson from psychonauting, that one).
Thanks Dixie...not long ago most debates were like this: open to possibilities. Only the last 10 years or so we've somehow regressed to this polarisation we have now.
Disappointing response, but the narrative runs very deep.
As for JP: he's genuinely helped a lot of lost anxious males. I'm glad i've not been lost or anxious, but i do understand that mindset...it leads to all kinds of self-destruction. JP has helped a bunch of such souls.
As open-minded and outspoken as you are, i expect even you put the brakes on regarding certain subjects. There's minefields out there x
Yes, well said oddlad.
This particular destruction of the individual is like a polar opposite to the type of ego-death psychonauts seek. The Far Left ideal of individual-death means a surrender to the collective, something which famously Orwell warned us about in 1984. And also highlighted the hypocrisy of such in Animal Farm, where the woke rules don't apply to everyone: the phrase it's ok when we do it! has replaced Four Legs good, Two Legs better!
In that respect nothing much has changed...these things come in cycles, only due to online-media we're hyper-aware of it.
But that is now a Far Left belief. That men identifying as women should be classed as women. It's established.
See the fuss around JK Rowling, nominally a 'liberal darling', but latterly a transphobe.
Agree with this bit.
You replied to my Covid post from a few days ago with this:
At the time i assumed you personally know of a handful of "deceased healthy sporty-types 20somethings" due to Covid. I think I realise now you was talking hypothetically...which is of course total nonsense, considering the statistical probabability of such a person dying of Covid is near to one-in-a-million.
Can you confirm what you meant, and if you agree it was nonsense?
dozens of innocent people died.
Yes. The minimum age for mainstream cheerleading performance is 18.
What about their dances is sexual to you?
No you don't. Or you didn't a few days ago.
Aside from the obvious: that such mass assaults hasn't happened in Western cities in living memory: here are your posts from a few days ago:
Mind's gone.
Well said again.
It shouldn't be, but it is becoming so. Support for Drag Queens in schools is gaining mainstream traction, as are adult-themed Pride events with Children in the audience.
This has only become a 'rightwing' talking point because the normal Left refuse to believe it's even happening.
But it is, already Dem political-candidates are publicly expressing support for such:
The youth have a lot to answer for...back when i was young we felt a little more responsible for our own words and actions. That seems lost now.
Now the collective is responsible for their words and actions.
That way lies totalitarianism.
Another interesting subject.
1) US Abortion Rights are on average more liberal than many places in Europe, including France and Germany. This will likely continue even after the recent Supreme Court Decision, which merely lets States decide.
2) current science tells us the heart starts beating at 6 weeks in the womb...the question if women really own their body and its contents at that point becomes a matter of debate...do they have the right to end the life within them? How sacred is that life inside the womb? The whole debate isn't as cast-iron as some make out on here.
Agreed.
The question is, who might you be referring to?
Best to stay vague, for it can be true of pretty much everyone on here.
Intent is the key to understanding all this...but no one seems to pay it heed anymore.
Almost agree. It was hijacked by the system to create division, but not as a detrimental term, more as a self-reverential one.
Who, or what, is the system?
Nah, Bizzaro/Damon had a different writing style.
There really is a massive problem of child/young-female sexual-slavery. Even in Berlin, many of the (legal) prostitutes are young women from remote Eastern parts in effective slavehood.
The Epstein-didn't-kill-himself conspiracy should at least open a few eyes that there is a real issue out there.
Quite what Qanon thinks it can do about it is another matter....
What is your opinion on the dozens of innocent people killed as a result of the BLM riots of 2020?
Just on my points on this. I accepted that there were rapes. What I rejected was the racialised context that was provided, particularly to try and justify the behaviour of some Liverpool fans.
In the article you sent, if you scroll down, you see a feminist/womens organisations explicitly rejected the idea that this was down to ethnic minorities. They know a lot more than men about the harms of sexual violence, so I am going to take their word about what the causes were.
And yes, mass rapes happen in cities every day. That is what womens experiences show us. They also happen at most big events. Oktoberfest was one specific example. You have groups of men in a space, and they rape women. That's the reality. I'm sure you wont like that, as many people dont like it, but I cant really sugarcoat the truth. You just have to find a way to handle it.
In the same post you then start saying that essentially women shouldn't have control over their bodies as it's more complex (via abortion). Its not. It's very simple, either you believe women have human right, and bodily autonomy or you dont.
It seems obvious which you think. But either way, you cant hand ring about the horrors of rape, say the exact opposite thing the victims of rape and those who support them say, not support their right to bodily autonomy and expect not to be called a complete hypocrite.
oh aye...i believe this pattern-recognition ability is located in the same area of the brain responsible for faith (belief systems). The same ability that also enables us to do cool stuff like understand mathematics and develop complex technology. Timothy Leary (infamous LSD-prophet) wrote about this in his final book Design For Dying.
Oddly, so did Ron Hubbard in Dianetics...the first half of which is genuinely interesting, thereafter it went full-on crazy so i switched off...but that first half making sense is how he snared a lot of scientology-believers.
haha not wrong there! himself
making an appearance in the later books
was cringe as fook.
He's often struggled in the final furlong of his stories...but is one of the world's best at setting one up.
aye...i have regular conversations with muslim mates...sometimes they're really enthused when i express similar views, but then get rocked back when our views radically differ on another issue.
Belief Systems are fine, but in my view they shouldn't define one's opinions on things...only you the individual should define that.
I'm not religious...but there is something to this God-business...just not sure what exactly, and i'm content not knowing until after this life has passed (a lesson from psychonauting, that one).
Thanks Dixie...not long ago most debates were like this: open to possibilities. Only the last 10 years or so we've somehow regressed to this polarisation we have now.
Disappointing response, but the narrative runs very deep.
As for JP: he's genuinely helped a lot of lost anxious males. I'm glad i've not been lost or anxious, but i do understand that mindset...it leads to all kinds of self-destruction. JP has helped a bunch of such souls.
As open-minded and outspoken as you are, i expect even you put the brakes on regarding certain subjects. There's minefields out there x
Yes, well said oddlad.
This particular destruction of the individual is like a polar opposite to the type of ego-death psychonauts seek. The Far Left ideal of individual-death means a surrender to the collective, something which famously Orwell warned us about in 1984. And also highlighted the hypocrisy of such in Animal Farm, where the woke rules don't apply to everyone: the phrase it's ok when we do it! has replaced Four Legs good, Two Legs better!
In that respect nothing much has changed...these things come in cycles, only due to online-media we're hyper-aware of it.
But that is now a Far Left belief. That men identifying as women should be classed as women. It's established.
See the fuss around JK Rowling, nominally a 'liberal darling', but latterly a transphobe.
Agree with this bit.
You replied to my Covid post from a few days ago with this:
At the time i assumed you personally know of a handful of "deceased healthy sporty-types 20somethings" due to Covid. I think I realise now you was talking hypothetically...which is of course total nonsense, considering the statistical probabability of such a person dying of Covid is near to one-in-a-million.
Can you confirm what you meant, and if you agree it was nonsense?
dozens of innocent people died.
Yes. The minimum age for mainstream cheerleading performance is 18.
What about their dances is sexual to you?
No you don't. Or you didn't a few days ago.
Aside from the obvious: that such mass assaults hasn't happened in Western cities in living memory: here are your posts from a few days ago:
Mind's gone.
Well said again.
It shouldn't be, but it is becoming so. Support for Drag Queens in schools is gaining mainstream traction, as are adult-themed Pride events with Children in the audience.
This has only become a 'rightwing' talking point because the normal Left refuse to believe it's even happening.
But it is, already Dem political-candidates are publicly expressing support for such:
The youth have a lot to answer for...back when i was young we felt a little more responsible for our own words and actions. That seems lost now.
Now the collective is responsible for their words and actions.
That way lies totalitarianism.
Another interesting subject.
1) US Abortion Rights are on average more liberal than many places in Europe, including France and Germany. This will likely continue even after the recent Supreme Court Decision, which merely lets States decide.
2) current science tells us the heart starts beating at 6 weeks in the womb...the question if women really own their body and its contents at that point becomes a matter of debate...do they have the right to end the life within them? How sacred is that life inside the womb? The whole debate isn't as cast-iron as some make out on here.
Agreed.
The question is, who might you be referring to?
Best to stay vague, for it can be true of pretty much everyone on here.
Intent is the key to understanding all this...but no one seems to pay it heed anymore.
Almost agree. It was hijacked by the system to create division, but not as a detrimental term, more as a self-reverential one.
Who, or what, is the system?
Nah, Bizzaro/Damon had a different writing style.
There really is a massive problem of child/young-female sexual-slavery. Even in Berlin, many of the (legal) prostitutes are young women from remote Eastern parts in effective slavehood.
The Epstein-didn't-kill-himself conspiracy should at least open a few eyes that there is a real issue out there.
Quite what Qanon thinks it can do about it is another matter....
What is your opinion on the dozens of innocent people killed as a result of the BLM riots of 2020?
Nothing in my educational training would prepare me for the massively challenging intellectual puzzle laid out in the form of a lesser known Simpson's character. A true ace-in-the-hole/gotchya post. [Doffs cap}
thanks for not referring to me and my post directly and way-to-go Bud on the evasive way you evaded the question. anyway, how can you claim Apu is a lesser known simpsons character? why would you say such a thing when he has been at the centre of many episodes unless of course you wanted to use it as filler for your otherwise empty/nothing post.
