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David Moyes - Taking a knife to a gunfight at West Ham, Part 2

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summerisle said:

American consortium to step up efforts to buy West Ham after first bid rejected | West Ham United | The Guardian

An American consortium, whose bid of £350m for West Ham was rejected last month, is expected to make another offer to the co-owners David Sullivan and David Gold
amp.theguardian.com amp.theguardian.com
Click to expand...

Not read the link but I think, because of the unbelievably good deal they got for being tenants in the taxpayers athletics bowl, one stipulation was if they sell within one year they paid a small percentage of an profit to LDC (or whatever they are called who run the stadium)
Two years evens less etc, then when (I think,) it gets to 5 years, they pay nothing back out of the 100's of millions earned so I think they will probably wait until then and walk away with 100's of millions in profit.

Before the move, West Ham supporters were told (suckered in,) that they will be buying better players just because of the move and the extra money coming in, better players who will quickly have them playing in Europe but all they have really got is a new badge (now with London on it to help people around the world know where they are from) been kicked out of the stadium they loved, from an area they loved and then had the displeasure of seeing Upton Park being blown up in a James Bond film.
They are now in area of generic empty high rises, with a station inside Westfields that doesn't want supporters in there, hardly any pubs anywhere near the stadium, a long stop and go 20+ minute walk back to the station after the game, walk to station after watching football in hell whole of a mecano stadium that has supporters miles from the pitch, a £240 million roof that doesn't cover all the seats, stands that are made of scaffold and (I think) in every season since the move, a relegation battle.
Most of th fans were totally sucked in with the owners lies but a lot more now realise that the West Ham they loved has now gone and that they were truly flicked up the Arsenal.
When I don't come across West Ham supporters I honestly feel sorry for them but when I do come across them that feeling very often disappears and I enjoy listening to their misery.
 
H.H. said:
Not read the link but I think, because of the unbelievably good deal they got for being tenants in the taxpayers athletics bowl, one stipulation was if they sell within one year they paid a small percentage of an profit to LDC (or whatever they are called who run the stadium)
Two years evens less etc, then when (I think,) it gets to 5 years, they pay nothing back out of the 100's of millions earned so I think they will probably wait until then and walk away with 100's of millions in profit.

Before the move, West Ham supporters were told (suckered in,) that they will be buying better players just because of the move and the extra money coming in, better players who will quickly have them playing in Europe but all they have really got is a new badge (now with London on it to help people around the world know where they are from) been kicked out of the stadium they loved, from an area they loved and then had the displeasure of seeing Upton Park being blown up in a James Bond film.
They are now in area of generic empty high rises, with a station inside Westfields that doesn't want supporters in there, hardly any pubs anywhere near the stadium, a long stop and go 20+ minute walk back to the station after the game, walk to station after watching football in hell whole of a mecano stadium that has supporters miles from the pitch, a £240 million roof that doesn't cover all the seats, stands that are made of scaffold and (I think) in every season since the move, a relegation battle.
Most of th fans were totally sucked in with the owners lies but a lot more now realise that the West Ham they loved has now gone and that they were truly flicked up the Arsenal.
When I don't come across West Ham supporters I honestly feel sorry for them but when I do come across them that feeling very often disappears and I enjoy listening to their misery.
Click to expand...

In all honesty it's probably not a very good time to be trying to sell your football club either. You will be attrcting sharks, make no mistake of it.

The ground is a massive problem. I think I saw somewhere that you could fit Upton Park inside the bit of the ground until the 10th row of seats or whatever. It's no advantage at all and does not feel like a "home ground" at all. I have no idea why they thought an athletics stadium would attract players. I can see why Spurs were essentially- We either build a football stadium or we are not interested- sort of position as it's a curse.

What it come down to is their owners are pretty clueless. By all accounts Brady thinks they will all get a statue of themselves outside the stadium. Jack Sullivan seems a massive massive idiot to me. Completely unprofessional and a show off. I think their property portfolio will be getting whacked, high street business massively down and they've got no movement anymore. They are completely out of their depth.

Their fans are angry, but it's very easy to understand whats happened. They've spent a fortune under Pellegrini, which they all cheered on, finished much lower than forecast and are now in a hole. They've made commitments on players like Haller/Anderson that they can't keep too, so they have to sell what and where they can. I know it sounds awful, but we had exactly the same. Ball, Jeffers, Mccann & Rooney all went within years of one another. It's horrible, but it's reflective of the mess they are in.

It was a big mistake making out they'd be in the top 6 with a new athletics stadium, but a bigger mistake of their fans to believe it.
 
catcherintherye said:
In all honesty it's probably not a very good time to be trying to sell your football club either. You will be attrcting sharks, make no mistake of it.

The ground is a massive problem. I think I saw somewhere that you could fit Upton Park inside the bit of the ground until the 10th row of seats or whatever. It's no advantage at all and does not feel like a "home ground" at all. I have no idea why they thought an athletics stadium would attract players. I can see why Spurs were essentially- We either build a football stadium or we are not interested- sort of position as it's a curse.

What it come down to is their owners are pretty clueless. By all accounts Brady thinks they will all get a statue of themselves outside the stadium. Jack Sullivan seems a massive massive idiot to me. Completely unprofessional and a show off. I think their property portfolio will be getting whacked, high street business massively down and they've got no movement anymore. They are completely out of their depth.

Their fans are angry, but it's very easy to understand whats happened. They've spent a fortune under Pellegrini, which they all cheered on, finished much lower than forecast and are now in a hole. They've made commitments on players like Haller/Anderson that they can't keep too, so they have to sell what and where they can. I know it sounds awful, but we had exactly the same. Ball, Jeffers, Mccann & Rooney all went within years of one another. It's horrible, but it's reflective of the mess they are in.

It was a big mistake making out they'd be in the top 6 with a new athletics stadium, but a bigger mistake of their fans to believe it.
Click to expand...
The funny thing is that Moyes, for all his faults, is one of the few managers proven to be able to work under such conditions.

Unfortunately for him, the one thing he had going here was he worked well under a patient boss in Kenwright.

At West Ham it seems more treacherous, with the Dave’s more than willing to throw him under a bus after using him as a lightning rod for criticism. They won’t even let him make a summer signing, deposit his last two buys being very successful for them.

Also the fans seem to loath him for no other reason than he is football meme David Moyes, despite him saving their bacon on two occasions now.

He should probably walk, but then, he probably won’t as he likes being a manager.
 

JobForTheMoyes said:
The funny thing is that Moyes, for all his faults, is one of the few managers proven to be able to work under such conditions.

Unfortunately for him, the one thing he had going here was he worked well under a patient boss in Kenwright.

At West Ham it seems more treacherous, with the Dave’s more than willing to throw him under a bus after using him as a lightning rod for criticism. They won’t even let him make a summer signing, deposit his last two buys being very successful for them.

Also the fans seem to loath him for no other reason than he is football meme David Moyes, despite him saving their bacon on two occasions now.

He should probably walk, but then, he probably won’t as he likes being a manager.
Click to expand...

He's a very odd one Moyes, that he doesn't at least call it out a bit.

I mean whats the worst that can happen? They sack him and he's probably a hero to the West Ham fans. The media narrative will be that he has been harshly treated etc. He just doesn't play the game very well.
 
catcherintherye said:
He's a very odd one Moyes, that he doesn't at least call it out a bit.

I mean whats the worst that can happen? They sack him and he's probably a hero to the West Ham fans. The media narrative will be that he has been harshly treated etc. He just doesn't play the game very well.
Click to expand...
If he calls them out, he gets his payout. If he doesn't call them out, he gets his payout and the next troubled team isn't put off from hiring him as he doesn't call out the board or owners.

David Moyes maximises the return on his contract. It's what David Moyes does.
 
Yarrgh said:
If he calls them out, he gets his payout. If he doesn't call them out, he gets his payout and the next troubled team isn't put off from hiring him as he doesn't call out the board or owners.

David Moyes maximises the return on his contract. It's what David Moyes does.
Click to expand...
Winning! (In the Charlie Sheen sense, at least).

Funnily enough, I actually don’t think it’s about the payout. He is just desperate to be working.
 
Yarrgh said:
If he calls them out, he gets his payout. If he doesn't call them out, he gets his payout and the next troubled team isn't put off from hiring him as he doesn't call out the board or owners.

David Moyes maximises the return on his contract. It's what David Moyes does.
Click to expand...

They sort of are though, as they are going to finish 20th. I mean if you only ever want to manage basket cases and cop the flak for others mistakes, then it's good way to go. I'd say it was a bit naive from him.
 
catcherintherye said:
He's a very odd one Moyes, that he doesn't at least call it out a bit.

I mean whats the worst that can happen? They sack him and he's probably a hero to the West Ham fans. The media narrative will be that he has been harshly treated etc. He just doesn't play the game very well.
Click to expand...
Maybe he doesn’t want blackballed like Curbishley!
 

H.H. said:
Not read the link but I think, because of the unbelievably good deal they got for being tenants in the taxpayers athletics bowl, one stipulation was if they sell within one year they paid a small percentage of an profit to LDC (or whatever they are called who run the stadium)
Two years evens less etc, then when (I think,) it gets to 5 years, they pay nothing back out of the 100's of millions earned so I think they will probably wait until then and walk away with 100's of millions in profit.

Before the move, West Ham supporters were told (suckered in,) that they will be buying better players just because of the move and the extra money coming in, better players who will quickly have them playing in Europe but all they have really got is a new badge (now with London on it to help people around the world know where they are from) been kicked out of the stadium they loved, from an area they loved and then had the displeasure of seeing Upton Park being blown up in a James Bond film.
They are now in area of generic empty high rises, with a station inside Westfields that doesn't want supporters in there, hardly any pubs anywhere near the stadium, a long stop and go 20+ minute walk back to the station after the game, walk to station after watching football in hell whole of a mecano stadium that has supporters miles from the pitch, a £240 million roof that doesn't cover all the seats, stands that are made of scaffold and (I think) in every season since the move, a relegation battle.
Most of th fans were totally sucked in with the owners lies but a lot more now realise that the West Ham they loved has now gone and that they were truly flicked up the Arsenal.
When I don't come across West Ham supporters I honestly feel sorry for them but when I do come across them that feeling very often disappears and I enjoy listening to their misery.
Click to expand...
Really good post this.

Also makes me shudder thinking of what could have happened to us with regard to the Kirkby move.
 
Putting aside anybody's personal feelings about West Ham fans, you have to feel for them massively. The loss of identity and home under the current ownership, and the lack of overarching vision in transfer strategy and team building, are just abysmal to watch. It is said that Sullivan has an agent buddy (Salthouse) that essentially dictates transfer strategy (when they actually have money to spend). And IIRC Karren Brady declared West Ham a club "without culture" before the move to the London Stadium.

I agree that Moyes is in a losing situation (although he doesn't always help himself playing guys like Fornals out of position). There was genuine excitement about the team before they sold Diangana, due to how they performed after the restart. The board just bottles everything they do, and it's never their fault. Really seem like vile people (maybe with the exception of Gold - at least he has funny tweets).
 
Doyarlison said:
Putting aside anybody's personal feelings about West Ham fans, you have to feel for them massively. The loss of identity and home under the current ownership, and the lack of overarching vision in transfer strategy and team building, are just abysmal to watch. It is said that Sullivan has an agent buddy (Salthouse) that essentially dictates transfer strategy (when they actually have money to spend). And IIRC Karren Brady declared West Ham a club "without culture" before the move to the London Stadium.

I agree that Moyes is in a losing situation (although he doesn't always help himself playing guys like Fornals out of position). There was genuine excitement about the team before they sold Diangana, due to how they performed after the restart. The board just bottles everything they do, and it's never their fault. Really seem like vile people (maybe with the exception of Gold - at least he has funny tweets).
Click to expand...
Thing is their left back is absolutely useless, so he has to play Fornals out on the left to act as a sort of auxiliary left back. The fact they sold a natural left winger, who seemed to have a fair amount of promise, is bizarre. Especially when it was to a relegation rival.

Tell ya what though, the much-hyped Pellegrini was really a pile of s****. The amount he spent on garbage players is astonishing.
 
Doyarlison said:
Putting aside anybody's personal feelings about West Ham fans, you have to feel for them massively. The loss of identity and home under the current ownership, and the lack of overarching vision in transfer strategy and team building, are just abysmal to watch. It is said that Sullivan has an agent buddy (Salthouse) that essentially dictates transfer strategy (when they actually have money to spend). And IIRC Karren Brady declared West Ham a club "without culture" before the move to the London Stadium.

I agree that Moyes is in a losing situation (although he doesn't always help himself playing guys like Fornals out of position). There was genuine excitement about the team before they sold Diangana, due to how they performed after the restart. The board just bottles everything they do, and it's never their fault. Really seem like vile people (maybe with the exception of Gold - at least he has funny tweets).
Click to expand...

Always felt Gold is the less detestable of the group, just comes across as a daft old man who's in way over his head. Kenwright without the PR savviness.

Sullivan and Brady are the really horrible ones. Pair of Tory wetwipes who think they're way cleverer than what they are. Brady used her position to create a TV career and Sullivan treats the whole thing like a lego set. Proper a-holes.
 

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