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Everton, our summer transfers and short term cost control regulations

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Pure stupidity resigning Gibson if we need wages for new players + increased contracts.

Howard
Hibbert
Osman
Pienaar

+ If we can sell Niasse for the same or more than we paid upfront e.g £5mil then we also save his wages

Coleman + Cleverley as well could be moved on as well as others like McGeady, McAleny etc etc


No need to sell Stones whatsoever.
 
Pure stupidity resigning Gibson if we need wages for new players + increased contracts.

Howard
Hibbert
Osman
Pienaar

+ If we can sell Niasse for the same or more than we paid upfront e.g £5mil then we also save his wages

Coleman + Cleverley as well could be moved on as well as others like McGeady, McAleny etc etc


No need to sell Stones whatsoever.
Agree with all of that.
Still staggered by the Gibson fiasco.
 
I think we kept Gibson, for squad numbers, Pienaar, Hibbert and Osman going. What if we don't get all the players, we're after? Gibson is a decent midfielder as cover.

If we need we can always sell or loan a player of his ability.
 
Pure stupidity resigning Gibson if we need wages for new players + increased contracts.

Howard
Hibbert
Osman
Pienaar

+ If we can sell Niasse for the same or more than we paid upfront e.g £5mil then we also save his wages

Coleman + Cleverley as well could be moved on as well as others like McGeady, McAleny etc etc


No need to sell Stones whatsoever.

If we sold Naisse for 5m then we would reduce the amount of wages we could increase by a negative figure by around 150k per week zat due to player trading rules in FPP as we would have made a 8m ish loss on him

Gibson has been signed because he is a home grown player who is not on very much of a wage, and we are actually very short on the required number of home grown players in the squad already, especially so if we are going to lose more of them like cleverley and mccaleny etc

We don't have to sell stones you are correct but if we wish to be able to expand the club fast we actually do need to sell him

but by all means mate highlight exactly how you would do it in detail and i will show you how that works out financially for the club
 

If we sold Naisse for 5m then we would reduce the amount of wages we could increase by a negative figure by around 150k per week zat due to player trading rules in FPP as we would have made a 8m ish loss on him

Gibson has been signed because he is a home grown player who is not on very much of a wage, and we are actually very short on the required number of home grown players in the squad already, especially so if we are going to lose more of them like cleverley and mccaleny etc

We don't have to sell stones you are correct but if we wish to be able to expand the club fast we actually do need to sell him

but by all means mate highlight exactly how you would do it in detail and i will show you how that works out financially for the club


If we paid £13.5mil for Niasse but have this year paid /top pay £5mik then the remainder would be on next years accts to be paid right? As per these FFP rules anyway...so we save the wages if we sold at the same amount we paid for him this year.

So we sell stones =40mil less 25% to barnsley £30mil.

We sell Coleman + Mirallas for £30mil

As well as Cleverley and others....

Save much more on wages and make fees also.
 
Stones won't go for any less than £45 million and Barnsley only have a 15% sell on clause so your talking at minimum £37 million from his sale.

I would also argue that Cleverly if we wanted to sell him would fetch £8-12 million in the current crazy market.
 
If we paid £13.5mil for Niasse but have this year paid /top pay £5mik then the remainder would be on next years accts to be paid right? As per these FFP rules anyway...so we save the wages if we sold at the same amount we paid for him this year.

So we sell stones =40mil less 25% to barnsley £30mil.

We sell Coleman + Mirallas for £30mil

As well as Cleverley and others....

Save much more on wages and make fees also.

No mate for the purposes of the premiership rules on FPP salary increases, the transfer value of the player is tht toal fee paid (even if some of that fee is still outstanding), terms of the payment etc don't matter - just the final transfer value paid and sold for matters.

I'm not arguin that we can sell the likes of Cleverley etc to part reach that figure, and IMO we should sell them irregardless of Stones staying or going, but to reach the figure mooted - 40m or so increase trhough palyer trading - the only way is through a stones sale to meet that total, and by far the easiest and quickest way to do it as well, which means we can get on with our own business with less delays.

Throw on top of it all though mate, the player doesn't want to be here, he didn't last season and we kept him, he doesn't this season either and to block back to back moves would end up backfiring on us, theirs a line between being hard with players under contract and thats fine, after you pass a point though all it will do is make people wary of signing for you as they will see evidence you will not let them move on no matter what

Theirs a reason players like Suarez and Ronaldo got sold in the end, same deal with Stones
 
No mate for the purposes of the premiership rules on FPP salary increases, the transfer value of the player is tht toal fee paid (even if some of that fee is still outstanding), terms of the payment etc don't matter - just the final transfer value paid and sold for matters.

I'm not arguin that we can sell the likes of Cleverley etc to part reach that figure, and IMO we should sell them irregardless of Stones staying or going, but to reach the figure mooted - 40m or so increase trhough palyer trading - the only way is through a stones sale to meet that total, and by far the easiest and quickest way to do it as well, which means we can get on with our own business with less delays.

Throw on top of it all though mate, the player doesn't want to be here, he didn't last season and we kept him, he doesn't this season either and to block back to back moves would end up backfiring on us, theirs a line between being hard with players under contract and thats fine, after you pass a point though all it will do is make people wary of signing for you as they will see evidence you will not let them move on no matter what

Theirs a reason players like Suarez and Ronaldo got sold in the end, same deal with Stones
Cleverly, Niasse, Kone, Mirallas, Lennon and McCarthy. At a stretch if needed Coleman. All should be moved on to create wage space under FFP before even contemplating the sale of Stones for that cause.
 
Cleverly, Niasse, Kone, Mirallas, McCarthy. At a stretch if needed Coleman. All should be moved on to create wage space under FFP before even contemplating the sale of Stones for that cause.

Niasse would damage us non FPP mate, best we can hope is to loan him off the wages for a bit

Mirallas is the only player we have who doesn't look terrible on the left, as such can't really let him go atm

the others i agree with - and they'd make up part of what we supposedly need to raise in player trading figures

But the numbers can only stretch so far before you end up with a still substantial shortfall no matter which way you try twist or turn, end of the day we can do a lot of dealing and we will end up with at best case doing half of the job Moshiri wants, not bridging the gap with spurs but just closing it to like 20-25m off them in wages still (asuming ofc they also don't decide to expand their own wages this season - which they may well do).

Would i rather keep hold of stones and build the team the way Moshiri wants, yup, but end of the day, the rules don't allow that, to get where we are aiming we will end up needing to sacrifice someone to speed up the process by 2-3 years, and the black and white choice seems to be stones or lukaku,
 

Would i rather keep hold of stones and build the team the way Moshiri wants, yup, but end of the day, the rules don't allow that, to get where we are aiming we will end up needing to sacrifice someone to speed up the process by 2-3 years, and the black and white choice seems to be stones or lukaku,
I'm asking you to "sacrifice" 6 average to good "run of the mill" replaceable footballers that would raise the same amount in total as the sale of one young gun/future champion of the game probably.

Why is my way not achieving the same outcome?
 
I'm asking you to "sacrifice" 6 average to good "run of the mill" replaceable footballers that would raise the same amount in total as the sale of one young gun/future champion of the game probably.

Why is my way not achieving the same outcome?

Because their is no certainty that we could if we chose shift all 6 players for fees we'd deem reasonable mate

Cleverley 'could' go for 8-10m, but equally he could generate very little interest, only a season ago he was afree agent and their honestly wans't a line at his door offering him silly contracts - say we do get 6m though
Mirallas - Only interest we had when he wanted out last summer was from West Ham for about 6-7m or so, think we have about 1m outstanding on him from player trading as well if the math is correct, say we get 8m for him gives us a FPP profit of 7m
Kone - likely no interest for any fee really, and has a outstanding 1-1.5m on player trading on him
Niasse - would need to sell him for 12m (no chance) anything less than that is then the difference is a negative to player trading figures)
McCarthy - his value is down to about 7m or so, anything over that would give us a profit on trading - so say we do sell him for what we paid then we'd make 8m on him for FPP purposes

that would leave us way way short and even selling coleman (who i wouldnt sell personally) wouldnt meet the shortfall on figures we want/need, and honestly colemans value atm would be pure guesswork as his stock has fallen massively the past two seasons - so guessing would say maybe 12-15m at tops

and all thos eplayers have to be replaced (especially coleman and mirallas)
 
Following earlier discussions about short term cost controls I've written a front page article:

https://www.grandoldteam.com/2016/0...ransfers-short-term-cost-control-regulations/

As is now commonly accepted Everton are for the first time in the Premier League era in a position to deal extensively in the transfer market and change their wage structure and previous limitations to attract higher quality talent.

However Everton being Everton, there’s almost inevitably a reason for things to be perhaps not quite as straightforward as they ought to be.

I’m going to try and achieve the impossible – make sense of the options open to Everton under the Short Term Cost Control (STCC) rules and keep it interesting.

In an attempt to stop salaries increasing in line with broadcasting revenues the Premier League introduced a limitation on salary increases 3 years ago. New regulations for the 3 years from 2016/17 fix salary increases to the greater of a fixed amount each year (£7 million a year from 2016/17 salary levels) or £7 million plus any increases in non broadcasting revenues.

Non broadcasting revenues include sponsorship, commercial and match day revenues plus critically profits generated from player sales.

Back to Everton

Now returning to Everton, I’m going to make some assumptions about our transfer activity and the increases in current contracts offered to key players. I stress we’re not looking at the amount we will spend in the transfer market, that’s a separate discussion and from noises from the club is not a limiting factor – nor likely to be a regulatory issue given the underlying profitability of the club moving forward,and the ability to fund in the future .

I’m going to assume we add 5 players to our squad over the summer with an average wage bill of £120,000 per week per player. That adds £31 million a year to our wage bill.

I’m also going to assume that we offer new contracts to several of our most valued players, particularly Lukaku, Barkley and we’ll include Stones as well. From figures suggested in the press, these players are likely to receive increases of perhaps £70,000 a week, thereby increasing the wage bill by £200,000 a week or £10 million a year. We also have the increase in manager wages to factor in (£3 million increase on Martinez’s costs)

We’re losing players like Osman, Pienaar and Hibbert plus a high earner in Howard, but in a squad game they need replacing so I’m assuming a zero effect on salary levels.Equally the sale of fringe players like Kone and Niasse will likely have limited impact on total salary levels either because of replacements or other smaller increases in squad contracts.

So far a total increase in salaries of £44 million.

Possible solutions

How do we fund that given the £7 million cap on salaries?

Sponsorship revenues: Potentially could increase this year with an unwinding of current arrangements with Chang but given that there’s a year left on the current deal, and our profile should be considerably higher in 12 months time, I’m taking the view there’ll be little change until season 2017/18.

Similarly commercial revenues due to the nature of the outsourced contracts are likely to remain flat at least for the next season.

Match day revenues will probably show a small increase as I’m assuming we’ll play to near capacity crowds under Koeman but that has to be tempered with the reduction in season ticket prices plus the increase in season ticket sales, all of which reduce the yield per seat.

That leaves one final source of “income” for the purposes of meeting the short term cost control rules – player trading profits.

I’m not going to get into full “football manager 2016” mode but to create income of £35-40 million there’s only a limited number of options in the current squad, particularly as we appear to have ruled out Lukaku leaving and if we were to dispose of Niasse there’s the potential for a significant trading loss. On Niasse perhaps a year long loan elsewhere is the most sensible option, reducing the wage bill and not crystalising the inevitable trading loss when he is eventually sold. The most likely option is the sale of Stones which would create sufficient profit to meet the required increase under the STCC rules (as well as reducing salary costs).

Selling Stones reduces the increase in salary costs to approximately £38 million rather than the £44 million quoted earlier

Thus in this most exciting of summers ahead of us we have to do one of the following:

  • An enormous increase in sponsorship and commercial sometime in financial year 2016/17 – unlikely in my opinion.
  • A significant sale, likely to be John Stones, to create a trading profit to meet the STCC requirements.
It’s interesting that if we go down the route of selling Stones (which seems our only viable option), just as in chess a player sacrifice can lead to winning the game.

His sale permits the overhaul and upgrading of our entire squad,and the ability to pay competitive salaries – not because we can’t afford it but because regulatory considerations – a worthwhile sacrifice in my book.

The scale of change within the club is just becoming evident, exciting times ahead…..
@kithnou
it's a trade off, sell now and bring in quality while paying big wages or be limited by the wage cap restriction.
It's not an ideal situation but there unfortunately has to be compromise somewhere.
Lose Stones, but recruit sagely and we will be better off hopefully.
 
@kithnou
it's a trade off, sell now and bring in quality while paying big wages or be limited by the wage cap restriction.
It's not an ideal situation but there unfortunately has to be compromise somewhere.
Lose Stones, but recruit sagely and we will be better off hopefully.
Understand all that mate. Every player we have been linked with, admittedly the papers may know little, are not worthy of the sums quoted to sacrificing one of the potentially best young players in the game.

If we are going to lose Stones, I would expect a top superstar James-style signing.
 
Understand all that mate. Every player we have been linked with, admittedly the papers may know little, are not worthy of the sums quoted to sacrificing one of the potentially best young players in the game.

If we are going to lose Stones, I would expect a top superstar James-style signing.
The issue as I see it is that we have several massive holes in the team.
In order to recruit players of quality when we have finished 11th in consecutive seasons, we need to pay big wages.
A sale is on the horizon, marquee player or not I imagine.
 

The issue as I see it is that we have several massive holes in the team.
In order to recruit players of quality when we have finished 11th in consecutive seasons, we need to pay big wages.
A sale is on the horizon, marquee player or not I imagine.
The irony is mate, that in a season or two when the Koeman rebuild has taken place, the majority of those I mentioned to be sold before Stones, will probably have gone anyways.
 
The irony is mate, that in a season or two when the Koeman rebuild has taken place, the majority of those I mentioned to be sold before Stones, will probably have gone anyways.
I don't doubt it mate, just unfortunately with wages we are in a position where we have to sell quality to get more quality.
 
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