Match Thread EVERTON V SOUTHAMPTON Match thread, Report and MotM Poll

[Stan Lee Park]

We did play to win. The team we put out should have been good enough to beat that Southampton side.

It's not arrogance to think that. And if our squad really are this bad then we're totally screwed.

So why take the risk? What's the point of entering this competition if we don't do everything we can to win it, rather than using it as a training session?

 

[BlueToff]

Our academy players get far more chances than at other clubs and we are too sentimental. Like a 3 year deal for Pennington. A start last night for Dowell. Persisting with Kenny rather than signing a new right back to challenge Kenny. Not signing any midfielder permanently when Davies really needs upgraded. Keeping Baines as first choice for two years too long etc.

I could go on, but we overrate our young players, stand by our experienced pros who are from the area, even to the point they look a shadow of what they once were, big the kids up beyond belief and then keep expecting them to magically get better even when it's clear they aren't cut out for this level.

What did Kenny do wrong last season to warrant signing a new right-back, mate? In some games he played very well and in others not so much. Like most young players. It's not sentimentality, right-back wasn't a pressing need.

I don't think the kids get bigged up beyond belief, or at least not more than they do at other clubs, Tim. Not really.

Look at the DCL and Davies threads for evidence of that, and then check what Liverpool fans say of TAA, Gomez etc. Sure, I think both of those players are ahead of Kenny and Holgate, but the Reds bang on about them like they're the second coming.

 

[BlueToff]

So why take the risk? What's the point of entering this competition if we don't do everything we can to win it, rather than using it as a training session?

It wasn't been used as a training session!

The team that went out may well have to start a league game this season. They should have had more than enough to beat a S'ton team that had themselves made seven changes.

 

[sageyefc]

He still won a penalty for us & closed down well & was always a threat with his pace & heading ability....

Tosun although I want to do well is so ineffective & just does not score enough goals for a striker, the goal he scored was absolutely on a plate for him with some great work by Walcott....

And yet his goals per minute ratio is much greater than bambi Lewins since he's been here

 

[Stan Lee Park]

Then there was absolutely no need to be calling for signings in the summer Tim, if you don't support rotation.

Bernard and Tosun both deserved to play on merit. Lookman deserved to play because, frankly, if we've kept him from a move with no intention of playing him, then we're idiots.

Stek, Schneiderlin, Dowell. I understand your frustration. I do think Gana was being protected and I understand that, but it would have been nice to see him play. Same with Gylfi.

Baines/Digne - nothing wrong with that on paper. Digne has been good but Baines needed to be kept sharp. He may not play again until Christmas, but if Digne gets an injury he'll be straight back in.

The issue isn't the rotation. The issue is every player on that pitch - new or not - did not do their jobs as well as they should have done. Teams rotate all the time and get wins. Why can't we?

Rotation is nonsense. It is the reason we are out of a competition we should be trying to win, rather than experimenting.

 

[Kaiser Soysauce]

Don’t care about this competition at all. Winning this cup would not provide me as a fan any satisfaction. It would be akin to winning a preseason competition; nice but ultimately irrelevant. We should be concentrating on competitions that are relevant, and prioritize them as such:
1. Premier League top 6 finish
2. FA cup
3. Europa/Champions League when applicable.

Finishing as high as possible in the premier league year in and year out must always come first; with everything else secondary.

Whaaaaaaat?! Winning this cup satisfies your point No. 3.

So, you're telling me getting this final and beating, say Arsenal, Chelsea, RS, Spurs, Citeh or Manure wouldn't give you ANY fan satisfaction?!

 

[Stan Lee Park]

It wasn't been used as a training session!

The team that went out may well have to start a league game this season. They should have had more than enough to beat a S'ton team that had themselves made seven changes.

It was a training session to see how some fringe players played together. It showed lack of ambition and we got what this awful approach deserved.

 

[Blue Roo]

I'm more concerned how Davies forgot to track, Keane, Zouma and Schneiderling didn't push and Kenny just let Redmond get down the wing, tbh

All this talk about playing the best side is rubbish.
We were going to score last night but its the same bloody thing in defence.
The reason we lost last night and keep dropping points in the league.

Once again the opposition got in behind the midfield defence. Once again the 9 or 10 receives a pass without any pressure and players forward of him. Davies, Schniederlin, Keane all caught out.

Davies as usual was clueless.
He had a decision to make, either - run the line that blocks the inside pass, getting to Kenny and Redmond as quick as possible, link with Kenny, end of story
OR track/stick to the inside man.

Because Davies is in front Ings he really shouldn't be tracking, he has to leave Ings for someone else, in this case Schneiderlin.

The best option was to link with Kenny, but there has to be serious doubts over whether Davies has the ability to do this. I just don't think he gets it.
He left it far too late to anticipate and make that simple decision. Maybe its a pace thing, he can see it but can't react quick enough, so he's caught in two minds, achieves very little. It takes a player with lot of nouse to overcome a lack of pace. And running all over the place is not the answer.

Because of his anticipation, lack of speed, in the end he had no option but to track Ings. But once again he gets caught in no mans land.

The only out Redmond had, if Davies had anticipated, was to try and beat Kenny before he got their.
Which is what Kenny wants him to do ie make the first move
Kenny has to keep back tracking, bc if he goes for the tackle, Redmond will beat him or get a pen/free kick.
Once Davies links in, the odds swing massively back in their favour, with Redmond is forced to make a move.
Once again Kenny was exposed and again the goal was scored.

Whole games plans are designed around certain players getting into 1v1s
Redmond is the best Saints player by a country mile. Its up to Silva to make sure he doesn't get in that position often, and if so to have it sorted.
Instead we end up with more farce.

With good defence comes confidence. If we'd had it we probably would off beaten them off the park...regardless of whether it was Lookman or Sig, Tosun or Walcott.

 

[Gaffa]

Here's a scenario

Lets say we had drawn Liverpool last night at home. Every single one of us would have called for the same team as Saturday. What would the manager have done? He would have picked his strongest team and probably changed the GK
So whats the difference just because it was Southampton. We are either in it to win it or we aren't

 

[ToffeeTim]

What did Kenny do wrong last season to warrant signing a new right-back, mate? In some games he played very well and in others not so much. Like most young players. It's not sentimentality, right-back wasn't a pressing need.

I don't think the kids get bigged up beyond belief, or at least not more than they do at other clubs, Tim. Not really.

Look at the DCL and Davies threads for evidence of that, and then check what Liverpool fans say of TAA, Gomez etc. Sure, I think both of those players are ahead of Kenny and Holgate, but the Reds bang on about them like they're the second coming.

I just think JJK makes too many big defensive errors. I dunno if it's ability or concentration that lead to this, but it's a huge issue.

The Arnold v Kenny situation is a point in case. Arnold pushed on to become a very good player whether we like it or not. Kenny is older and not kicked on at all. Is it coaching? Is it mentality? Is it ability? I dunno. Combination of them all I suspect. But something isn't right at the club generally.

 

[BlueToff]

Rotation is nonsense. It is the reason we are out of a competition we should be trying to win, rather than experimenting.

No it's not the reason.

The reason we're out is because the two first-team regulars who came on missed their pens.

On the bare face of it, that is the reason.

 

[BigBlueConk]

Every year seems to be work in progress mate. When do we become a good team again

Sadly the Koeman legacy pushed us backwards and that needs to be recovered before we can speculate about about our ability to attain regular top 6 finishes. The quality of football will improve with better players, beyond that winning trophies still has to be a dream at the moment.

 

[adi dassler]

He didn't 'change everything'.

The system was the same as we've played. Players should have enough quality to slot in and out. That's what we're trying to build.

The worrying thing is none of them proved they were up to it.

He took out our best player. A player who has missed most of the season through suspension. He also took out the player we have who creates most chances and replaced him with an unproven youngster who was playing in the championship last season. And to top it all he 'rests' a goalkeeper who has just got his first clean sheet of the season to replace him with a 36 year old no hoper of a goalie.

That's treating the competition (one of only two we can actually win) with disdain in my opinion. Change it round and 'slot players in and out' of the league game at the weekend if we really must, but not a cup competition when we haven't won anything for 24 YEARS!!!

 

[Toast]

Here's a scenario

Lets say we had drawn Liverpool last night at home. Every single one of us would have called for the same team as Saturday. What would the manager have done? He would have picked his strongest team and probably changed the GK
So whats the difference just because it was Southampton. We are either in it to win it or we aren't

Liverpools 6th choice striker who's out on loan scored against us again last night mate.
I dread to think what would happen if we were to play them soon.

 

[Alanbileysfeathercut]

Another let down
Just not good enough
The shock of winning anything of note would probably kill most of us.
Lots of bed wetters on here but can you blame them?
Can understand the fume