Everton Youth Teams Thread

[Raino85]

Yes he played some games, but didn't return for the crunch end of the season Under 18's league games.

I have given it a little more reflection so hopefully this will be a bit clearer than the last post. Under Martinez he has began to take increasing numbers of young players into the first team squad. He often talks about adding "4 to the first team squad".

This is quite different to Moyes, even Moyes when he would throw in young players. He would pick players ready for the first team, and the rest he would leave to the U21's/ academy. Martinez's approach is a shift from this and he wants the opportunity to develop some in the first team.

We have always had under 18's making up a proportion of the reserves. However again what we have seen over the last couple of seasons is not only are they playing at that level, but regularly training at that level too. (This has been accelerated by more players going out on loan).

The end result is kind of two fold. Firstly different teams/coaches kind of take responsibility for player development, and for the sake of this debate even though someone may play for a team he may not be considered part of their day to day squad.
(I think this is what Dennis Lawrence looks after).

Ledson isn't really considered an Under 18 players anymore, nor is he really even an under 21. He trains with the first team. Martinez is taking responsibility for that.

I don't think it's true that Ledson hasn't been better than the 5 mentioned, or more importantly that the 5 mentioned by Unsworth are ahead of him it's just that they are seen more as reserve players.

So with you saying all that then im presuming that one of the other "4" is Galloway which would make me think he has had a lot of training with the first team squad yet he ended up winning u21 player of the season.

Plus Ledson didn't even play ANY games for the u18s this year so when you say he played a few at the beginning that is wrong pal.

 

[Eggs]

Yes he played some games, but didn't return for the crunch end of the season Under 18's league games.

I have given it a little more reflection so hopefully this will be a bit clearer than the last post. Under Martinez he has began to take increasing numbers of young players into the first team squad. He often talks about adding "4 to the first team squad".

This is quite different to Moyes, even Moyes when he would throw in young players. He would pick players ready for the first team, and the rest he would leave to the U21's/ academy. Martinez's approach is a shift from this and he wants the opportunity to develop some in the first team.

We have always had under 18's making up a proportion of the reserves. However again what we have seen over the last couple of seasons is not only are they playing at that level, but regularly training at that level too. (This has been accelerated by more players going out on loan).

The end result is kind of two fold. Firstly different teams/coaches kind of take responsibility for player development, and for the sake of this debate even though someone may play for a team he may not be considered part of their day to day squad.
(I think this is what Dennis Lawrence looks after).

Ledson isn't really considered an Under 18 players anymore, nor is he really even an under 21. He trains with the first team. Martinez is taking responsibility for that.

I don't think it's true that Ledson hasn't been better than the 5 mentioned, or more importantly that the 5 mentioned by Unsworth are ahead of him it's just that they are seen more as reserve players.

...yep. Interesting that after the West Ham game when asked which player looked after him on the pitch Galloway actually said "I train with these guys so we know each other well".

 

[catcherintherye]

...yep. Interesting that after the West Ham game when asked which player looked after him on the pitch Galloway actually said "I train with these guys so we know each other well".

Yes absolutely. Martinez makes quite a big thing of the different "squads" and being able to train with the first team squad. Unsworth has also got quite a clear reserve team "squad" outlook. I think overall it is beneficial to what we have before, which was grab a teenager when they were 1) absolutely necessary or 2) A world class talent and stick them in the first team.

Or it could be that Unsowrth just doesn't rate Ledson. That can happen too, everyone has their opinion on a player. Given the unusual names for the under 18's too though, I think it's more to do with progression and where people train.

 

[catcherintherye]

So with you saying all that then im presuming that one of the other "4" is Galloway which would make me think he has had a lot of training with the first team squad yet he ended up winning u21 player of the season.

Plus Ledson didn't even play ANY games for the u18s this year so when you say he played a few at the beginning that is wrong pal.

What I'm saying is that Ledson may not have been considered a reserve team squad member.

Galloway has been training with the first team squad, but I think that's happened over the course of the season, as opposed to Ledson who started at the back end of last season. Unsworth has also been very close to Galloway.

I don't watch the under 18's every week so I could be wrong on all sorts of things. However Ledson played the Dallas cup (which was with last seasons under 18's) he also played in at least one round of the youth cup earlier in the season. You must watch them more than me though mate! Like you I don't know why they chose the players they did, only Unsworth and Sheedy know that. I am just giving you what my reasoning is for it.

 

[FTY]

Can the title of this thread please be changed

 

[boris]

Fergusan was something of a visionary for youth football. However we have certainly caught up, if not overtaken United in terms of our outlook now.

I like a lot of what United do.

We have better teams through most of the age groups and maybe even produce better individuals (we do try to play for results even at younger ages as do some other clubs) but there something about United I like, they are completely different to the other clubs.

It's a extremely relaxed environment, the kids play completely pressure free. They do not care for results, they embrace mistakes and want the kids to show they learn from them instead of telling them what to do and then telling them off when they get it wrong. They don't build teams, they build individuals and take great pride in the success they have had and the fact that every United squad for 80+ years has contained a Utd academy player on the bench or in the first 11.

It's a bit old fashioned there compared to City, Everton and Liverpool but I like it.

Liverpool by the way are shockingly bad in many ways, far too many ways to mention here (not the coaches I should mention more the club and attitude of those involved).

 

[catcherintherye]

I like a lot of what United do.

We have better teams through most of the age groups and maybe even produce better individuals (we do try to play for results even at younger ages as do some other clubs) but there something about United I like, they are completely different to the other clubs.

It's a extremely relaxed environment, the kids play completely pressure free. They do not care for results, they embrace mistakes and want the kids to show they learn from them instead of telling them what to do and then telling them off when they get it wrong. They don't build teams, they build individuals and take great pride in the success they have had and the fact that every United squad for 80+ years has contained a Utd academy player on the bench or in the first 11.

It's a bit old fashioned there compared to City, Everton and Liverpool but I like it.

Liverpool by the way are shockingly bad in many ways, far too many ways to mention here (not the coaches I should mention more the club and attitude of those involved).

They are quitter old fashioned, I am not so sure on results though, certainly at under 21's they take it very seriously.

We have the best in the North West and in all honesty one of the best in the country. Some of the coaches we've had passing through our academy are top class.

And yes Liverpool's academy is mediocre compared to ours. They are light years behind, irrespective of what they try to say about their academy "bursting to the seams with talent". Buying in expensive recruits gives them a gloss of mediocrity behind the dross they have.
Unlike Everton, they are completely win obsessed and don't teach players to play as part of a team.

 

[LinekersLegs]

Can the title of this thread please be changed

Oh please yes, been playing havoc with my OCD all season lol

 

[blueloon]

The comparison with Man U is an interesting one. I read an article , maybe 6 months ago, that said Everton and Utd were joint top for developing players who went on to play 50 PL games , with 13 each. Then there was another last year that had Everton as top based on players developed who played 5 or more first team games. We had 20 plus from memory.
Back to the "quirk of youth team" mentioned. One aspect is at some ages the School year of 1st September is used. It also throws up anomalies at the " scholar" level e.g. Ledson has been a year ahead of Dowell but they are only a matter of months apart age wise, so Dowell has only been a Scholar this year with the subsequent rapid development it sometimes brings.

 

[boris]

The comparison with Man U is an interesting one. I read an article , maybe 6 months ago, that said Everton and Utd were joint top for developing players who went on to play 50 PL games , with 13 each. Then there was another last year that had Everton as top based on players developed who played 5 or more first team games. We had 20 plus from memory.
Back to the "quirk of youth team" mentioned. One aspect is at some ages the School year of 1st September is used. It also throws up anomalies at the " scholar" level e.g. Ledson has been a year ahead of Dowell but they are only a matter of months apart age wise, so Dowell has only been a Scholar this year with the subsequent rapid development it sometimes brings.

This is all supposed to be changing soon , maybe as soon as this year, so its they year you are born not school year any more to bring it inline with the rest of the world.

There's only our country who work like this even Scotland don't.

 

[BoysInBlue]

Pretty sure Man Utd fans look at our Academy and admire it too.

Our Academy is great at bringing players through and into the professional game. Obviously not all of them wind up playing in our first team, but still - we have a hell of a track record.

 

[blueblue]

Galloway got in the team because of the injury to Baines and for the manager it was a straight choice between two youngsters and certainly the game would have meant the world to Galloway but maybe a little less so for Garbutt. It gives Galloway the incentive to kick on and I think most of us accept Garbutt is leaving anyway.

If a central midfielder was injured then maybe Ledson may have been considered.

A lot of football is luck. You do the best you can and then hope you are the right man in the right place at the right time.

 

[mightymoyes]

Galloway got in the team because of the injury to Baines and for the manager it was a straight choice between two youngsters and certainly the game would have meant the world to Galloway but maybe a little less so for Garbutt. It gives Galloway the incentive to kick on and I think most of us accept Garbutt is leaving anyway.

If a central midfielder was injured then maybe Ledson may have been considered.

A lot of football is luck. You do the best you can and then hope you are the right man in the right place at the right time.

only cos hibbert was injured

 

[LinekersLegs]

 

[blueloon]

It did strike me that Galloway's award must come with a bit of trepidation when he looks at some of the previous winners, Anichebe, Duffy, Forshaw.....