Financial Fair Play investigation

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I don't believe for a second that we're not guilty of a rules breach. The only hope is that our excuses, however contrived, can be successfully argued within the rule structure. Behind the scenes I hope we're pleading for a reduced sentence.
 
gwladysnight said:
I think we almost certainly breached the £105m profitability and sustainability rules last time around. Rule E.15 would have kicked in and we would have agreed on a budget with the Premier League and been subject to player trading restrictions. There were plenty of reports about us having to sell Richi last summer.

My guess is that the latest accounts have shown we have not complied with the agreed budget and have been referred to an Independent commission.

We are now in unknown territory.
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But again, we didnt breach the 110m, otherwise we would have failed. The PL passed those accounts.

So again, and politely this is manifestly untrue.

There has also never been any mention of any rules kicking in, as we didnt breach the rules (or if we have, it directly contradicts what the PL have said). We voluntarily worked with the league.

I suspect if we have breached, a period of formal working alongside the league in terms of budgets may have to kick in.
 
Bkk Andy said:
I don't believe for a second that we're not guilty of a rules breach. The only hope is that our excuses, however contrived, can be successfully argued within the rule structure. Behind the scenes I hope we're pleading for a reduced sentence.
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Reduced sentence is probably the best case scenario because the books are almost certainly rotten. If the verdict ends up with them gone though it’s a victory no matter what
 
Neiler said:
These are the punishments Uefa dole out:

  • Vojvodina – fined €10,000 (December 21, 2012)
  • Arsenal Kyiv – fined €45,000 (December 21, 2012)
  • Osijek – fined €100,000 (December 21, 2012)
  • Dinamo București – fined €100,000 (December 21, 2012)
  • Rapid București – fined €100,000 (December 21, 2012). Missed deadline to pay outstanding payments and was handed a one-season ban from European competition (March 31, 2013).
  • Hajduk Split – fined €40,000 (December 21, 2012). Withheld prize money for not paying outstanding payments (September 20, 2013)
  • Malaga – fined €300,000 and handed a one-season ban from European competition (March 31, 2013)
  • Astra Ploiești – withheld prize money for not paying outstanding payments (September 20, 2013)
  • Metalurh Donetsk – withheld prize money for not paying outstanding payments (September 20, 2013). Handed a one-season ban from European competition and fined €80,000 (December 20, 2013).
  • Skonto – withheld prize money for not paying outstanding payments (September 20, 2013). Handed a one-season ban from European competition and fined €40,000 (December 20, 2013).
  • Trabzonspor – withheld prize money for not paying outstanding payments (September 20, 2013)
  • Zrinjski Mostar – withheld prize money for not paying outstanding payments (September 20, 2013)
  • Petrolul Ploiești – handed a one-season ban from European competition and fined €50,000 (December 20, 2013).
  • Pandurii Târgu Jiu – fined €40,000 (December 20, 2013)
  • Śląsk Wrocław – fined €20,000 (December 20, 2013)
  • Anzhi Makhachkala – fined €2 million, of which €1 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 21 players, and one-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Bursaspor – fined €200,000 fine, and one-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Galatasaray – fined €200,000, and one-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Levski Sofia – fined €200,000, and one-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Rubin Kazan – fined €6 million, of which €3 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 21 players, and transfer spending restrictions and two-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Trabzonspor – fined €200,000, and one-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Zenit Saint Petersburg – fined €12 million fine, of which €6 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 22 players, and transfer spending restrictions and two-year squad salary restrictions were imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Paris Saint-Germain – find €60 million, of which €40 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 21 players, and transfer spending restrictions and two-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Manchester City – fined €60 million, of which €40 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 21 players, and transfer spending restrictions and two-year squad salary restrictions imposed (May 16, 2014)
  • Astana – fined €2 million, of which €1.5 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 22 players, and transfer spending restrictions imposed. Required to break even by 2018 (May 20, 2016)
  • Dinamo Zagreb – fined €200,000. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 23 players, and required to break even by 2016 (May 20, 2016)
  • Fenerbahçe – fined €7.5 million, of which €5.5 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 22 players. Transfer spending restrictions imposed, required to reach a defined employee benefit expenses to revenue ratio, and required to break even by 2019 (May 20, 2016)
  • Trabzonspor – fined €2 million, of which €1 million was suspended. Squad for UEFA competitions reduced to 22 players. Transfer spending restrictions imposed, required to reach a defined employee benefit expenses to revenue ratio, and required to break even by 2018 (May 20, 2016)
  • AC Milan – banned from European competitions for a year (June 28, 2019)
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It's useful for context, and if legally challenged will no doubt be used as context. Of the 29 cases, zero have any points deductions. 1 has a year long ban. 19 under 1million fine. For some context.

For a first offence, I'd anticipate the more lenient end on the fines.
 

Neiler said:
But City have a sovereign wealth fund to throw at this to defend at set precedent. They’ve already done it to Uefa.
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In a strange way though, they set the precedent. It will not take a huge lawyer to say, 1 breach, in Covid related seasons, is a lot less minor than 100 breaches over 10 years.

It may be the PL may be benchmarking too. If we accept say a suspended sentence (and agree to get accounts in order within set time frame) it gives an anchor for the PL to work off with City.
 
catcherintherye said:
In a strange way though, they set the precedent. It will not take a huge lawyer to say, 1 breach, in Covid related seasons, is a lot less minor than 100 breaches over 10 years.

It may be the PL may be benchmarking too. If we accept say a suspended sentence (and agree to get accounts in order within set time frame) it gives an anchor for the PL to work off with City.
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I think they’ll have one eye on Newcastle too.

They won’t want to be upsetting the cartel of English football. I think we’ll be in a position where we get a suspended points deduction, probably a fine and a 6-12 month transfer embargo.

City have committed an offence, as have we, so it’ll be interesting to see exactly how the PL handle this, as I’m sure we’ll just be the testing of the waters the PL need to really target City, and send a message to others, to know their place.
 
Villa_Fan said:
The entire point of P&S and why the use of the word 'sustainability' is to ensure that the football club is sustainable. If a club needs the owner to underwrite losses then the club is not sustainable. That is why P&S is all about Profit and Loss.
This is to stop owners committing to expenditure the club can't afford and then doing a runner and leaving the club in the crapper
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But I'm not being horrible mate, how is STCC helping that process?

Chelsea have just been allowed to spend 650m quid in a year, with no breaches in the rules. That's substantially more than their turnover.

And what these rules did, was force Everton to sell players like Richarlison for under their value, as it weakened our bargaining position. How does the help the club become profitable? I would argue it achieves the opposite, of making clubs lose more money, if they achieve less money for key players.

I'm very open to how this process actually improves profitability, and open to persuasion, but I cant see it.
 
davek said:
Local BBC news programme gave 8 seconds over to this.

I think that about sums it up.

6 month commission
conclusion - heavy fine

Let's move on.
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The other point in this, is that next years accounts show a profit, and back within the rules.

If the club are smart, they release those accounts publicly next autumn. Our board are thick and they wont, but they should.

The context of sentencing, if a club is back into profitability, and within the rules will seem very odd if its anything more than a warning for a first offence.

I do get the conspiratorial stuff over this, but honestly the PL could have buried us earlier if they wanted to. We have basically navigated the worst years.

One final thought, is that the club and the PL were working closely on this. I wonder if the PL would want the details of those discussions being made public for the government and everyone else to see?
 

MikeH72 said:
Don’t let the rest of them off the hook by placing it all on Kenwright. Everyone involved including Moshiri need to be chased out of the city for this.
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Absolutely yes, but Kenwight more than anyone is responsible for this show, no pun intended. The man has been out of his depth ever since he took over our club and has only ever been soley concerned with his own self-preservation, to the clubs detriment. Moshiri was the fool with money that Kenwright had waited for.

As an analogy, Moshiri bought the house and paid Kenwright for the privilege of doing so, and then allowed Kenwright to carry on living there with everything paid for, as well as giving him a generous pocket money allowance.

In my opinion, Moshiri's only mistake was allowing Kenwright to have influence over the running of the club after 2016.
 
Bkk Andy said:
I don't believe for a second that we're not guilty of a rules breach. The only hope is that our excuses, however contrived, can be successfully argued within the rule structure. Behind the scenes I hope we're pleading for a reduced sentence.
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Same
Makes you wonder how stupid those running the club are
The wages must be doing all the damage because smaller clubs than Everton spent a lot of money last two seasons, more than us
 

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