Guardian article from an Evertonian on Moyes & the derby

[dholliday]

Coleman is an anti-footballer now is he ?

Yes. The 4 players I named are anti-footballers. By that I mean they lack top-class ball control, movement and passing skills. Our other players who started the match (bar maybe the central defence) are able to offer that kind of top-class football...on their day, anyway.

That was how we buggered that match, we fielded too many anti-footballers. We really should maximum only ever field 1 of them. Coleman and Hibbert do offer us very useful strengths, but they shouldn't be playing at the same time. Straq and Anichebe I feel are a step backwards for us every time they play (even if Lurch is admired in some quarters).

 

[The Equaliser]

Yes. The 4 players I named are anti-footballers. By that I mean they lack top-class ball control, movement and passing skills. Our other players who started the match (bar maybe the central defence) are able to offer that kind of top-class football...on their day, anyway.

That was how we buggered that match, we fielded too many anti-footballers. We really should maximum only ever field 1 of them. Coleman and Hibbert do offer us very useful strengths, but they shouldn't be playing at the same time. Straq and Anichebe I feel are a step backwards for us every time they play (even if Lurch is admired in some quarters).

Thing is I agree with your general point in the post. I would definitely had Neville and Cahill on there instead of Hibbert and Anichebe especially in a derby. Coleman had a poor game no question, and maybe shouldn't have been included, but you could say that about many others. But I think labelling him 'an anti-footballer' is a tad harsh given what the lad has to offer when he's playing well.

 

[Neiler]

Is right Gaurdian- lets win the cup ffs.

 

[paulbefc]

I think alot confuse are fan base with what's on this forum. There's a hell of alot of other evertonians not on forums who whilst were disappointed with the derby are not about to ditch support of the manager because of a derby result and the possibilities of it not have worked by going out the cup too.

Some are making far too much out of this whole thing! I do hope these fans are behind the team fully on sat, even if we start bad or go behind!?!?

And NO...if we start bad it's not moyes fault and the team doesn't deserve getting support!

Rant over !!

Oh so true. The internet is an amazing thing.

 

[dholliday]

I think alot confuse are fan base with what's on this forum.

 

[Still]

Thing is I agree with your general point in the post. I would definitely had Neville and Cahill on there instead of Hibbert and Anichebe especially in a derby. Coleman had a poor game no question, and maybe shouldn't have been included, but you could say that about many others. But I think labelling him 'an anti-footballer' is a tad harsh given what the lad has to offer when he's playing well.

I agree with dholliday. Twice in quick succession on Tuesday we were in promising positions, only to witness Anichebe, Straq and Coleman showing a total lack of any kind of ability. Their control of the ball and movement was utterly hopeless; the three of them against four liverpool defenders - They literally didn't have a clue what to do! Again and again! Surely three professional attacking footballers should have some idea of how they are going to attack a defence?? Not that I'd trust their ability to do it anyway.

He's right, a team can probably carry one of those players, if you want him just to make a nuisance of himself. Realising I was watching three or four (possibly five) on Tuesday night really depressed me. Appreciating we had actual proper footballers on the bench made me depressed AND angry.

 

[The Equaliser]

I agree with dholliday. Twice in quick succession on Tuesday we were in promising positions, only to witness Anichebe, Straq and Coleman showing a total lack of any kind of ability. Their control of the ball and movement was utterly hopeless; the three of them against four liverpool defenders - They literally didn't have a clue what to do! Again and again! Surely three professional attacking footballers should have some idea of how they are going to attack a defence?? Not that I'd trust their ability to do it anyway.

He's right, a team can probably carry one of those players, if you want him just to make a nuisance of himself. Realising I was watching three or four (possibly five) on Tuesday night really depressed me. Appreciating we had actual proper footballers on the bench made me depressed AND angry.

Fellaini, Rodwell & others were just as guilty of making the wrong decisions. They must be anti-footballers as well.

 

[padefc]

I think alot confuse are fan base with what's on this forum. There's a hell of alot of other evertonians not on forums who whilst were disappointed with the derby are not about to ditch support of the manager because of a derby result and the possibilities of it not have worked by going out the cup too.

Some are making far too much out of this whole thing! I do hope these fans are behind the team fully on sat, even if we start bad or go behind!?!?

And NO...if we start bad it's not moyes fault and the team doesn't deserve getting support!

Rant over !!

Oh so true. The internet is an amazing thing.

may be i should have made my piont clearer as to fan base of the lads i go the game with one was a moyse hater the rest avarage (7)were lovers pre this season now its more haters than lovers by some way as for the rest of my post i do belive it was bang on

 

[dholliday]

Fellaini, Rodwell & others were just as guilty of making the wrong decisions. They must be anti-footballers as well.

No. It's not about percentages (that's Moyes' game). It's about permanent class.

Anti-footballers are defined by a permanent disability to control and pass the ball in a top-class way. These players offer other strengths which are very useful, but they'd never threaten to get into the Barcelona first-team.

Fella & Rodders have shown enough quality to know on their day they can be called top-class footballers. Coleman, Anichebe, Straq and Hibbert sadly not...

 

[The Equaliser]

No. It's not about percentages (that's Moyes' game). It's about permanent class.

Anti-footballers are defined by a permanent disability to control and pass the ball in a top-class way. These players offer other strengths which are very useful, but they'd never threaten to get into the Barcelona first-team.

Fella & Rodders have shown enough quality to know on their day they can be called top-class footballers. Coleman, Anichebe, Straq and Hibbert sadly not...

No they're not, but there is no need to use such a a perjorative term as 'anti-footballer' to describe a player like Coleman. It's his profession FFS. Just because some players are not as good as others doesn't make them anti-footballers.

 

[dholliday]

No they're not, but there is no need to use such a a perjorative term as 'anti-footballer' to describe a player like Coleman. It's his profession FFS. Just because some players are not as good as others doesn't make them anti-footballers.

It actually fits Coleman like a glove, as he was still playing that mad irish rugby/football hybrid thing until his late-teens. He got into proper football quite late on.

For those who feel "anti-footballers" is too harsh, what shall we use instead? It's clear what we mean. Bily was never an anti-footballer, but he was less successful at Everton than Anichebe or Coleman have been...so maybe we should think of another term that's fairer to the antis.

 

[The Equaliser]

It actually fits Coleman like a glove, as he was still playing that mad irish rugby/football hybrid thing until his late-teens. He got into proper football quite late on.

For those who feel "anti-footballers" is too harsh, what shall we use instead? It's clear what we mean. Bily was never an anti-footballer, but he was less successful at Everton than Anichebe or Coleman have been...so maybe we should think of another term that's fairer to the antis.

GAA. It's 128 years old btw. And it's light years away from anything to do with rugby. Robbie Keane played it, so he must be an anti-footballer too.

 

[dholliday]

Robbie Keane played it, so he must be an anti-footballer too.

fair point, kidda...although most irish lads likely grew up playing both sports (like we did playing football and rugby).

a little googling revealed:


Robbie Keane began seriously playing football at around age 10 (Fettercairn).
Seamus Coleman began seriously playing football at around age 11 (St. Catherine’s of Killybegs).

so around the same age they both slowly started to prefer fitbae over that mad local knees-up.


i thus humbly take back my comment suggesting Coleman's lack of top-class ball mastery has anything to do with bonkers irish sport.

 

[The Equaliser]

fair point, kidda...although most irish lads likely grew up playing both sports (like we did playing football and rugby).

a little googling revealed:


Robbie Keane began seriously playing football at around age 10 (Fettercairn).
Seamus Coleman began seriously playing football at around age 11 (St. Catherine’s of Killybegs).

so around the same age they both slowly started to prefer fitbae over that mad local knees-up.


i thus humbly take back my comment suggesting Coleman's lack of top-class ball mastery has anything to do with bonkers irish sport.

We all played Gaelic at school as it was compulsory during PE lessons. Lunchtime of course it was soc...football in the playground, as it was on the street when we got home.

Any Gaelic player who has got a bit of talent with his feet will of course pick football if he is good enough, as there is a living to be made out of it.